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LGBT Sam-sex marriage San Francisco Disobedience

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#321 Bad Wolf

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 06:37 PM

I think it's amazing that people assume that all gay people have sex.  Do we assume that all heterosexual people have sex??? :wacko:   It's bizarre!
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#322 Josh

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 06:39 PM

It seems to be a common misconception. I guess after making the assumption that gay people "chose" to be gay (which is ridiculous), they make the further assumption that they chose to be gay so they could ONLY have sex with the same sex. Being in a loving relationship with the same sex doesn't even seem to cross their minds. It's rather appalling, actually.

*shrug*

I don't care. Let them think what they think.
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#323 Bad Wolf

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 06:42 PM

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{Josh}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Lil
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#324 Josh

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 06:44 PM

(((((Lil)))))

Thanks. It used to really bother me... but I find that I don't give a sh*t anymore. I know who I am and I know why I am and dammit, I'm PROUD of who I am and that's all that matters to me.

I think the world will always have at least a little ignorance.
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#325 the 'Hawk

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 06:52 PM

Una Salus Lillius, on Feb 23 2004, 06:35 PM, said:

Do we assume that all heterosexual people have sex???
Baby, assumption's all I get. And I don't mean assumption of any positions, neither..... :p~

:cool:
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#326 Shalamar

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 06:57 PM

Meh, 'Hawk, I don't even get assumptions...
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Respect for One's Self / Respect for Others / Responsibility for One's Words & Actions.

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#327 ArmourMe

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 07:45 PM

Josh, on Feb 23 2004, 11:42 PM, said:

I know who I am and I know why I am and dammit, I'm PROUD of who I am and that's all that matters to me.
(((((((((Joshy)))))))))  I'm glad yer Josh :D

#328 Bad Wolf

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 07:49 PM

the'Hawk, on Feb 23 2004, 03:50 PM, said:

Baby, assumption's all I get. And I don't mean assumption of any positions, neither..... :p~
PUT that tongue away!!!!!!!!!!!   :eek2:
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#329 imzzadi

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 07:56 PM

Ah but with a tongue like that he might get more than assumptions.  At least once the word gets out.  :devil:  :inlove:
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#330 ArmourMe

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 08:12 PM

Rhea, on Feb 23 2004, 11:30 PM, said:

Oh, please! Do you think you'd be really thrilled to be gay if you knew that the net result of the fun sex was that you ran the risk of being discriminated against, best case; and beaten and reviled, worst case? I doubt it.
((((((((your friend, Rhea))))))))


This has been one of the most baffling distinctions that people shove at me regarding homosexuality.  Being bi I've had some insight though - its once again about the difference between being gay being a BEHAVIOUR or being a state-of-self.

If being gay is a behaviour, then you're ONLY gay if you're in a relationship in which you're sporking someone of the same sex.  So I can't call myself bi without pissing someone off - if I'm sporking a woman, I'm a lesbian.  If I'm sporking a man, I'm straight.  My sense of who I'm attracted to or want a deep meaningful connection to has no bearing in this sceanario - its only my ACTIONS that count.  Sex defines the range of definition.

Personally, I find this very insulting.

If being gay is about a state-of-self that in inherant in me at all times....If my ORIENTATION is what counts, then the sporking makes no difference.  If I'm in a relationship with a woman, I'm bi.   If I'm in a relationship with a man, I'm bi.  If I'm not in a relationship at all.... I'm STILL BI.

All you straight people out there can probably relate.  When you're not in a relationship at all..... is your sexuality in question?  Or are you still oriented toward the opposite gender?  

Is your sexual orientation a BEHAVIOUR or a state of being?

The really aggravating thing is, I get to deal with this from both sides - queers and straight people.  :D  My orientation is not determined by which ever gender I'm currently in a sexual/spiritual relationship with.  

Orientation is what it always is, regardless of current sexual behaviour or anyone's lack thereof :p

The fact that gay people want to engage in as deep a spiritual/sexual/emotional connection as any straight person really messes with the definition of being gay as an abherent BEHAVIOUR, or a mere CHOICE.

And isn't it laughable the idea that "gay sex"  might be SO TEMPTING, so much more alluring because of TABOO that perfectly straight people would "cross over" just to experience the tittilation??  What????  That's cheap porn inspired fantasy land.  People who think that same-sex-sex-as-a-perversion could inspire people to change orientation are insulting in the extreme.

#331 ArmourMe

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 08:17 PM

Una Salus Lillius, on Feb 24 2004, 12:47 AM, said:

the'Hawk, on Feb 23 2004, 03:50 PM, said:


Baby, assumption's all I get. And I don't mean assumption of any positions, neither..... :p~
PUT that tongue away!!!!!!!!!!!   :eek2:
ROFL!!!!!  I knew that tongue would cause trouble when Mary trotted it out!!!

#332 the 'Hawk

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 10:29 PM

imzzadi, on Feb 23 2004, 07:54 PM, said:

Ah but with a tongue like that he might get more than assumptions.  At least once the word gets out.
Word's been out. Still no takers.

I'm rather proud of the things I can do with it. Like, for example, speak.

:cool:
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#333 emsparks

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Posted 23 February 2004 - 10:43 PM

I sent this to CNN, and thought it might be well to share it here;
Sparky::


As unpopular as it might be, the real reason behind the controversy over gay marriages is the mistaken belief that being Gay is a matter of choice, and not biology. For any other physiological / medical condition, except it would appear homosexuality, more then enough medical testing and imaging has taken place to prove that homosexuality is a physiological fact of life, not as believed a matter a perverse choice.

When a homosexual says that they choose to be homosexual, it is not that they have sat down and made a logical choice for some perverse pleasure, but rather they have decided to go face the inhumane stigma, and except the physiological fact of their life. The fact that they where born gay.

Even if the choice bit where true, on to it’s self there is what is called a “catch 22.” The inconsistency of this so-called choice is the fact of basic neurology. Which simply put says if there weren’t a predisposition towards homosexuality, the person wouldn’t even be thinking that being gay was an acceptable life style for them.  Understand every thing you are, every thing you do and say, is a function of what is called your engram, the actual wiring of your brain. Your engram is as unique as your genetics, and your environment can make it, every bit as unique as your fingerprints. While your environment cannot make you Gay, your genetics can, and for 10% of all mammalian life forms, not just for mankind, it does.

I would humbly point out that if these facts where properly reported then the American public would do the right thing. Not to report these facts is to be Journalistically irresponsible. AND to the Gay community it’s high time you stopped using the word “choice.”
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#334 Drew

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:50 AM

Rhea, on Feb 23 2004, 05:25 PM, said:

According to both the AMA and the APA, so-called "conversion" therapy doesn't work. And they decry it as a technique.
And yet we have testimonies that it does. So . . . do we believe the pronouncements of highly politicized organizations, or do we believe people's experiences.

The point I'm trying to make is that sexuality is not hard-wired, as some hope and pray it is.
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#335 Drew

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 09:56 AM

Una Salus Lillius, on Feb 23 2004, 05:35 PM, said:

I think it's amazing that people assume that all gay people have sex.  Do we assume that all heterosexual people have sex??? :wacko:   It's bizarre!
That's a good point. I managed to remain celibate for 36 years. :cool:

I also know someone who is gay and celibate--he believes homosexual sex is immoral--but he never hides the fact that he's gay.
"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."

#336 emsparks

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 01:08 PM

Drew, on Feb 24 2004, 02:48 PM, said:

Rhea, on Feb 23 2004, 05:25 PM, said:

According to both the AMA and the APA, so-called "conversion" therapy doesn't work. And they decry it as a technique.
And yet we have testimonies that it does. So . . . do we believe the pronouncements of highly politicized organizations, or do we believe people's experiences.

The point I'm trying to make is that sexuality is not hard-wired, as some hope and pray it is.
Ah but it is hard wired, it’s hard wired to your endocrine system and as your level of hormones change so can your sexual orientation. This is especially true around the times of puberty, and menopause, and yes men go through a kind of menopause as their hormone levels drop after age forty. If you play with the levels of testosterone and estrogen, to drop a few names, you can get the body to make some astounding changes. The problem is not, that it is not hard wired, but rather that it is so intertwined with survival that the wiring is so very complex, and not easily understood.

If a person is experiencing changes in the levels of their sex hormones, then it is very conceivable that they might experience feelings that can be mistaken for changes in their sexual orientation. Again this is quite common during puberty, and menopause, the genetically assigned orientation reasserts itself when the levels of the sex hormones again come into a kind of equilibrium, albeit at a lower level.

The people that have reported these conversions, if genuine, are most likely suffering from an undiagnosed endocrine disorder. Which makes them further proof of the physical nature of a person sexuality.

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#337 emsparks

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 01:11 PM

Drew, on Feb 24 2004, 02:54 PM, said:

...  I also know someone who is gay and celibate--he believes homosexual sex is immoral--but he never hides the fact that he's gay.
That is singularly the most tragic thing I have ever heard, and a dam good reason why these myths about homosexuality have to be debunked. What a needless waste of a human potential, to live a life in such a state of self-loathing.

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#338 Gaiate

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 02:31 PM

Drew, on Feb 24 2004, 09:48 AM, said:

And yet we have testimonies that it does. So . . . do we believe the pronouncements of highly politicized organizations, or do we believe people's experiences.

The point I'm trying to make is that sexuality is not hard-wired, as some hope and pray it is.


I could just as easily say "Do we trust the scientific findings of a highly respected medical organization and several other independant groups, or ancedotal evidence from people with an obvious agenda?"

--Te
"This visage, no mere veneer of vanity, is it vestige of the vox populi, now vacant, vanished, as the once vital voice of the verisimilitude now venerates what they once vilified. However, this valorous visitation of a by-gone vexation, stands vivified, and has vowed to vanquish these venal and virulent vermin vanguarding vice and vouchsafing the violently vicious and voracious violation of volition. The only verdict is vengeance; a vendetta, held as a votive, not in vain, for the value and veracity of such shall one day vindicate the vigilant and the virtuous. Verily, this vichyssoise of verbiage veers most verbose vis-à-vis an introduction, and so it is my very good honor to meet you and you may call me V." -- V, making an first impression

"Dude . . . that was cool." -- My first impression of V

#339 G1223

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 02:50 PM

Both sides in this have an agenda.

#340 Gaiate

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Posted 24 February 2004 - 03:06 PM

And yet only one side is giving scientific evidence to support their "agenda."

--Te
"This visage, no mere veneer of vanity, is it vestige of the vox populi, now vacant, vanished, as the once vital voice of the verisimilitude now venerates what they once vilified. However, this valorous visitation of a by-gone vexation, stands vivified, and has vowed to vanquish these venal and virulent vermin vanguarding vice and vouchsafing the violently vicious and voracious violation of volition. The only verdict is vengeance; a vendetta, held as a votive, not in vain, for the value and veracity of such shall one day vindicate the vigilant and the virtuous. Verily, this vichyssoise of verbiage veers most verbose vis-à-vis an introduction, and so it is my very good honor to meet you and you may call me V." -- V, making an first impression

"Dude . . . that was cool." -- My first impression of V



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