sierraleone, on Nov 24 2004, 10:08 PM, said:
Through some sort of enlightened self interest?? Or at least concern for your children's generation.... At the very least I not want my money to go towards someone's education then the things Spectacles has mentioned....
With the term "enlightened self-interest" who says what's enlightened?
If my tax dollars go to the funding of an educational system I don't believe in and do not support and
produce "educated" individuals who don't produce anything to justify the investment, why should I contribute to that?
Let's examine the quality of that educational system a little closer:
Who determines the makeup of the curriculum?
What if the curriculum consists of ideals I disagree with? That's funded with my tax dollars. Do I get my money back? I think not.
Who determines whether an individual has/has not learned enough from that curriculum to justify receiving/not receiving the diploma?
If I am a businessman who hires someone straight out of college (and I helped fund his "education" through taxes) and it turns out he doesn't know a damn thing about his job, what guarantee on the investment do I get?
That's not "enlightened self-interest." That's blind optimism and it's stupid.
Besides "enlightened self-interest" can you explain why I should be responsible in any way for the education of someone else when he/she has no direct impact on my life...desired or undesired? Am I directly responsible for feeding, clothing or medicating such an individual? The answer is no; therefore, why should I help pay for their education? Should I desire to do so, I have no problem helping a young person achieve their dreams, but being robbed at gunpoint every April to fund such an endeavor isn't my cup of tea, and I applaud those who had the nerve to cut funding.
I guess it depend on how taxing their courses are, if they are trying a 7 yr run through University to become a specialist they don't want to make that longer than they have too
Some people are able to do University Course, but are not able to handle full time University courses at the same time as a full time job.... (not to mention I don't think most jobs they could get would support the tuition fees) and part time University can add yrs to graduating....
It is my understanding the average age of a PhD candidate in the US defending his dissertation is 38. Considering that one normally enters college at 18, that's quite a span. To expect government funding to carry one from high school through graduate school is the equivalent of me showing up on your doorstep three times a day for a full meal. Of course, you probably prefer not to see me dead from starvation in the gutter, but are you really going to tolerate my behavior (especially given my voracious appetite)? If one wants that level of education badly enough and is capable of achieving it, he/she will find a way. Given a lack of government funds, if one is smart enough to handle difficult curriculums, but not smart enough to find a way to finance it, I don't think much of his intelligence level.
Some might see it that way, if a field you are trying to get into hires 70 % of the Graduates in your disipline from one University, and 30 % from another that puts out the same amount of graduates, which school are you going to try to attend? A school that has more money generally has more resources I would think, and they pass those costs onto the students....
Of course you want the former school...that only makes sense. But if you cannot afford that school, isn't it more realistic to go with the latter example and shoot for the best?
Trust me: not everyone is going to get exactly what they want, and it's not the role of the government to make such a scenario happen. We've become spoiled with the idea of the government taking care of us. Now they're withdrawing the teat and there's screaming.
The American Dream ..... and how about some of them are picking a kind of job they *want* which required an Education, because they'll love the job, not the paycheck? Also, its near impossible to find a good job w/ out *some* college education. If you have no education these days, might as well as apply at the nearest fast food restaurant.... not that its not the case for some, some naturally have great work ethic & leadership ability and quickly climb the ranks in that kind of enviroment.... but working at a min wage job because I didn't bother getting *some* education? I'd rather not.....
Maybe everyone doesn't need a B.S. or B.A. Someone has to flamebroil my Whopper.
Edit: There are just too many variables to try to prescribe one way of doing things for everyone.
But there is one way: everyone has a right to life, liberty and property. The role of the government is to make sure no one takes those rights from you. You have a right to pursue an education to the level of your own competence. So long as you do not harm or steal from anyone else, how you accomplish it is your own business. Use your brain, work for it, sell your body. I don't care. But forcibly taking my tax dollars and using it without my consent to fund someone's education is no better than armed robbery.
Edited by John Galt, 24 November 2004 - 11:50 PM.
"Do not confuse altruism with kindness, good will or respect for the rights of others. These are not primaries, but consequences, which, in fact, altruism makes impossible. The irreducible primary of altruism, the basic absolute, is self-sacrifice - which means: self-immolation, self-abnegation, self-denial, self-destruction - which means: the self as a standard of evil, the selfless as a standard of the good." —Ayn Rand