Jump to content


Getting an "Insecure Connection" warning for Exisle? No worry

Details in this thread

How Many Earths

Quiz Carbon footprint Climate Change Science

  • Please log in to reply
61 replies to this topic

#21 Kosh

Kosh

    Criag Ferguson For President!

  • Islander
  • 11,147 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 01:49 PM

Quote

CATEGORY ACRES

FOOD 5.4

MOBILITY 0.2

SHELTER 7.9

GOODS/SERVICES 5.4

TOTAL FOOTPRINT 19


4.3 planets. BS if i've ever seen it.
Can't Touch This!!

#22 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,302 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 01:54 PM

Well, further into the site, they say that we need at least 30 - 70% land laid away for the sake of biodiversity.  That seems unrealistic in the extreme.  But I'd really like to understand how we can fulfill the demands here.

On EtU, I posted a thread about elephants dieing in the zoo.   In that thread, biodiversity was sited as a good reason to have zoos of the modern, sprawling sort that maintain natural habitats for animals in captivity.  Assuming that these kinds of areas are only part of what's required, with other parts being nature preserves... how are humans supposed to live comfortably within our environment, with modernity spreading to regions where its not, sickness and disease being alleviated world wide, and war being decreased or eliminated?  This is, I presume, the ideal state of the humanity.  In the context of this thread, and assuming that all of those ideal human conditions can happen, how are we supposed to live up to the environmental responsibility that we  have?  I'm really asking.

HM07

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#23 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,302 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 01:55 PM

Kosh, on Feb 18 2005, 01:49 PM, said:

Quote

CATEGORY ACRES

FOOD 5.4

MOBILITY 0.2

SHELTER 7.9

GOODS/SERVICES 5.4

TOTAL FOOTPRINT 19


4.3 planets. BS if i've ever seen it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Why?  Why is it b.s.?  

HM07

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#24 Shoshana

Shoshana
  • Islander
  • 4,033 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 02:12 PM

Groan...

6.8 planets? Gee whiz.

That was kinda harsh. I don't know what part of the survey made us go up so much. I guessed on the processed foods question- I don't know where alot of our food is actually produced but since we're 200 miles from both Houston and Dallas .... and it would cost us more in gas, money and tiime to shop at Whole Foods...

We really don't have any mass transportation within 2-3 miles of our house (and the road leading to the bus stop has no sidewalks and 65 mph speed limit - eek!) but my car gets good gas milage and since she's 17 years old and Gareth's is 14 years old, we aren't wasting as many resources as people who get new cars all the time.

We have either the heat or the A/C on 99% of the time. It's not always cycling on and we do keep it pretty cool in the winter (62F-ish) and warm in the summer (78F-ish). Because of the year round pollen and allergies, it's not practical to either have the windows open all the time (altho I like them open, Gareth would be miserable) or line dry the clothes. As a matter of fact, I think clotheslines are banned by our homeowners association.

Quote

Number of days my home is air conditioned (could be reduced with fan-cooling or sweating)
Lol. Days? More like months. We use the heat maybe 20 days a year and the A/C the rest of the time. And no, once it's above 90 degrees with humidity, sweating and fans don't go very far.

They didn't have a city with weather like ours .. hot and humid. Dunno if that made a difference.

Our biggest acreage usage is shelter. By far. If we turn off the electricity and water (what about the natural gas that heats our house and water and stove???) we go down to 4 planets. And if we keep the water and electric off and move to a multistory apt building w/our space <500 square feet, we go down to 2.6 planets.

Ok... all of the above ... plus turning vegan and getting all our food locally and inviting  5 of our nearest and dearest to share our <500 square foot space w/ no electeric and no water... we go down to 1.3.

Giving up the car and airplane travel?

1 planet.

But somehow I can't see us doing all that. There has to be a better way, but having to give up everything but a roof over our heads and raw veggies (with no electric or water or meat...) seems like overkill ... or some Sci-Fi movie.

'shana

edited to delete extra letters in some words and add needed letters in others...

Edited by Shoshana, 18 February 2005 - 02:16 PM.


#25 tennyson

tennyson
  • Islander
  • 6,173 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 02:19 PM

Here's what I got,

CATEGORY   ACRES
FOOD 5.9
MOBILITY 0.2
SHELTER 11.6
GOODS/SERVICES 8.2
TOTAL FOOTPRINT 26
and I got 5.8 planets. But there wasn't a question that took into account my recycling efforts, there is no way to return to my house with public transportation because no bus lines run there from here and I challenge anyone to be able to drive around safely where I live in winter without a four wheel-drive vehicle. Otherwise, I just don't know what else I could do aside from maybe recycle more things than paper, metal and plastic somehow that would actualy work in my own situation. I mean I walk to all of the places I can reach that way in a reasonable time, I haven't flown anywhere in years, and I need to haul around a bunch of stuff in my vehicle and one that can handle  bad road conditions.
"Only an idiot would fight a war on two fronts. Only the heir to the throne of the Kingdom of Idiots would fight a war on twelve fronts."

— Londo, "Ceremonies of Light and Dark" Babylon-5


#26 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,302 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 02:35 PM

Ok.  A couple of people have mentioned recycling, and I didn't see anywhere on the site to account for the influence of recycling.  So, where is this information?  

Also - I think the idea of the site creators is to think beyond our current abilities.  It seems obvious that there's just no way any of us in a modern lifestyle such as exists today, can help but consume more resources than we are "allotted" by nature, so to speak.  But society could possibly be transformed to accommodate a change.

Here's an outlandish (but doable) idea:  what if we built an interstate highway system concurrent with our existing highways, for bike and other human/animal powered vehicles?  Conceivably, one could for the fun of it travel from one state to another, or even crosscountry, and it could spur a lot of roadside business, as bikers or horse riders might need to stop more frequently than cars.  Obviously this would not replace cars, but it could conceivably create new ways for people to approach transportation.

Also the personal rapid transit units discussed in EtU - an interstate system with these, and nearby park and rides, could be helpful (although one might have to wonder about energy consumption/pollution, etc, as discussed in that thread.)

And again, fuel-celled automobiles.  We could start subscriptions to manufactures who are working on developing such vehicles, so that when they are created we can simply replace our current vehicles with these.

???

HM07

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#27 Shoshana

Shoshana
  • Islander
  • 4,033 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 03:02 PM

We recycle plastic, paper, glass and metal but you're right, there's no category for that.

Here they're building a tollroad east of town to reduce congestion for several hundred miles on I35 (the main interstate running from Canada to Mexico). And further east, they just said that a Spanish firm has won the bid to build a huge super tollway that supposedly will include space for new freight and passenger trains ... not sure about any kind of bike lanes - but it will really be too far out to even think about that.  It will be running from the Mexican border to Oklahoma. They'll be using land that is currently farmland for that. The Gov wants these super transportation alleys in several locations around the state. I'm not real clear on how this will be a good thing - paving over more farmland so more trucks and cars can go faster????

#28 ZipperInt

ZipperInt
  • Islander
  • 1,825 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 03:20 PM

CATEGORY GLOBAL HECTARES
FOOD 3.7
MOBILITY 0.9
SHELTER 1.5
GOODS/SERVICES 1.8
TOTAL FOOTPRINT 7.9

I need 4.4 planets. Maybe I should stop eating so much meat?! :)

I think if *everyone* changed to a minimal-impact lifestyle, industry would eventually adapt and become more environmentally friendly - but it will never happen. Hopefully as technology advances we can find more efficient/less wasteful ways to get things done while still making full use of our technological abilities - I don't think it is possible to revert to 'small footprint' lifestyle they have in that site, unless the world's population were significantly reduced.
The second greatest podcast in the history of ever:
http://geeksonaplain.blogspot.com/

#29 JchaosRS

JchaosRS

    Ordered Chaos

  • Islander
  • 2,373 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 03:40 PM

Interesting. I got exactly 2 planets.

For my current "job", I am in a car most of the time and driving around. But I walk or use public transportation every other time except for work. I do need to cut down on processed foods though. It currently takes up half my diet.  I never fly and I live with six people in my small apartment.

But I absolutly refuse to give up electricity and runing water.
Will be eternally Rommie's Slave
Jays Music Videos | Jeremy Farnum | LexaFans

#30 sierraleone

sierraleone

    All things Great and Mischievous

  • Islander
  • 9,215 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 04:19 PM

^ and I can't see how they put an option for electricity and running water, when people without electricity would have a tough time accessing their website ;) :D
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#31 Kosh

Kosh

    Criag Ferguson For President!

  • Islander
  • 11,147 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 04:39 PM

Handmaiden07, on Feb 18 2005, 02:55 PM, said:

Kosh, on Feb 18 2005, 01:49 PM, said:

Quote

CATEGORY ACRES

FOOD 5.4

MOBILITY 0.2

SHELTER 7.9

GOODS/SERVICES 5.4

TOTAL FOOTPRINT 19


4.3 planets. BS if i've ever seen it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Why?  Why is it b.s.?  

HM07

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>





It looks to me to be geared toward making it worse. As some have said, there is no place for recycling, just about bad environmental things like cars and Planes.
Can't Touch This!!

#32 shambalayogi

shambalayogi

    Fan of Many Things

  • Islander
  • 2,448 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 04:55 PM

I could totally give up meat but that wouldn't add much to this general debate.  I eat some everyday but not more than 3 oz everyday.   I could use less electricity but only in the winter! My thermostat isn't as cold as most people I know set theirs in southern Arizona.  Last summer we had a electric power problem and TPTB wanted everyone to set their thermostats to 80 or above. I've tried this summer after summer, NO WAY, it is total misery.  78 on the other hand I can do. Lots and lots of people do 72 degrees or so here.  Now, that's just too cold for me even in the summer here.

Fuel for cars, planes and other vehicles seems to be the biggest problem.  


we'll just have to figure out how to beam people around with transporters.  :)
Shamba,
I Trust SNAPE!  so .. he better be loyal!
I Knew Where NZ was before LOTR!
Frodo Lives! Long Live the King!
It may not be a time of myth and legend, but it's
definitely a time for heroes and heroines!
Shambalayogi's Retreat
Tulsa Trek Expo
Comic Con In 2008
Learn About Peak Oil

#33 Jid

Jid

    Mad Prophet of Funk

  • Islander
  • 12,554 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 05:48 PM

Shoshana, on Feb 18 2005, 01:02 PM, said:

We recycle plastic, paper, glass and metal but you're right, there's no category for that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I went digging, and this is what they say on the matter:

Quote

What about recycling?


Recycling is incorporated into the footprint calculations through the question about trash. Households that recycle, reduce and reuse will throw out less than average households in their area. Recycling diverts materials from the solid waste stream and landfills. Using recycled materials to make new products saves energy and resources. For recycling to work, people need to buy recycled products. Even more effective, of course, is to reduce consumption and re-use products when possible. Look for durable, long-lasting, and used or second-hand products. Avoid disposable items with lots of packaging. Extend product life through maintenance and repair.

Of course, their question about trash is "Do you produce less, the same, or more trash than your neighbours?"  :rolleyes:

#34 Josh

Josh

    He stares...

  • Islander
  • 13,774 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 06:38 PM

3.9 here. I think if I got rid of the car, it probably would have been lower... and living in the city doesn't help. ;)
"THE UNICORNS ARE NOT TO BE TRIFLED WITH!" - John Burke.

#35 eechick

eechick
  • Islander
  • 4,219 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 07:26 PM

2.3

#36 sierraleone

sierraleone

    All things Great and Mischievous

  • Islander
  • 9,215 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 07:53 PM

Josh, on Feb 18 2005, 07:38 PM, said:

3.9 here. I think if I got rid of the car, it probably would have been lower... and living in the city doesn't help. ;)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Actually I think living in the cities does help, believe it or not - *families* who live out in the country often need a vehicle each often, if they don't work close to their home, or have various activities to take kids to.... Even if the one parent stays at home.... if one is at work during the day, how does the other one do anything if they live out in the boonies? Little/No public transportation, nearest grocery store is miles away, heck perhaps not even a Taxi company.... Smaller pool of people to car pool with.
Of course depends on what you mean by City.
Depend on whether one is living in a Small City/Town/Village/country Side/No where.

I think a strong transporation system is a important step in the right direct, and buses/train systems should be bike/stroller friendly. Bus stops should be built with the local climate in mind.

Edited by sierraleone, 18 February 2005 - 07:55 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#37 eloisel

eloisel

    Non-sequitur

  • Islander
  • 1,998 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 10:20 PM

Well, we don't have public transportation here.  So, given my current lifestyle - 3.7 planets.  If I go vegan and walk more, cut my living space in half and employ energy efficiency in my electrical usage, I'm down to 3.0 planets.  If I go totally vegan; eat very little processed food; all my food is local grown and unpackaged; be in constant competition to produce less waste than my neighbors; cram 6 more people into a green-design energy conservative efficient living space of 500 feet or less with me;  never use public or motor transportation of any type preferring to bike or walk everywhere all the time; and, never fly - then I could get it down to 1 planet.

CATEGORY               ACRES
FOOD                        1.7
MOBILITY                     0
SHELTER                    0.5
GOODS/SERVICES      0.2
TOTAL FOOTPRINT       2

Considering that is most unlikely - I'm thinking I'm supporting exploring other planets for colonization and biologically productive acres.

#38 Delvo

Delvo
  • Islander
  • 9,273 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 10:30 PM

Anakam, on Feb 18 2005, 10:21 AM, said:

I think I've taken tests like this before and come out at 7.2 or something, which annoyed me because I minimize trash and recycle AND I don't have my own car. :p 

Hey, I like this one better; I got 3.3 planets.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Zwolf666, on Feb 18 2005, 11:27 AM, said:

Just for the heck of it, I went and took it again, but told outrageous lies.   The best you can get is one planet, but you pretty much have to live the life of a Cro-Magnon to do it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Kosh, on Feb 18 2005, 01:49 PM & 04:39 PM, said:

4.3 planets. BS if i've ever seen it.... It looks to me to be geared toward making it worse. As some have said, there is no place for recycling, just about bad environmental things like cars and Planes.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Handmaiden07, on Feb 18 2005, 02:35 PM, said:

Ok.  A couple of people have mentioned recycling, and I didn't see anywhere on the site to account for the influence of recycling.  So, where is this information?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


The thing to always keep in mind with these kinds of online quizzes, from the "What's your political philosophy" to the "Which Stargate SG-1 character are you" to "How healthy is your 'relationship'" to the "What kind of barnyard animal are you", to simulations that are supposed to predict the weather or future political events, is that they never reveal facts. It's not even possible. What they do is reveal whatever their authors wrote into them. Sometimes authors try to really write the things to be realistic; sometimes they write them to make a point regardless of honesty or accuracy. If the author wanted it to, a quiz on dessert foods could produce an answer that says that in the year 2065 the world will be taken over by telepathic butterflies armed with photon hammers.

Edited by Delvo, 27 April 2005 - 12:30 PM.


#39 ZipperInt

ZipperInt
  • Islander
  • 1,825 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 10:52 PM

Delvo said:

an answer that says that in the year 2065 the world will be taken over by telepathic butterflies armed with photon hammers.

They'll have to get past me and my shovel, first. :p
The second greatest podcast in the history of ever:
http://geeksonaplain.blogspot.com/

#40 eloisel

eloisel

    Non-sequitur

  • Islander
  • 1,998 posts

Posted 18 February 2005 - 10:55 PM

I want a photon hammer.



Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Quiz, Carbon footprint, Climate Change, Science

0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users