Nonny, on Mar 16 2005, 09:41 AM, said:
This smacks of the chilling words of nuns and priests, repeated often throughout my childhood: There will be peace on earth, once eeeeeeeeeverybody is Catholic.
Like unity guarantees peace.
And this means what exactly? I don't see the logic between comparing a civil war strife to a religion which has consistantly taken wars upon itself in the name of god and good grace. (And that's not a strike against Catholics really, just historical fact as most religions have done the same.) I just don't see the relevance in your comment.
tennyson, on Mar 16 2005, 04:00 PM, said:
The see the chance for relatively short-term profit without considering what it means for them in the long-term. Just look at how huge piles of American industry have been moved to other countries by corporations looking to make products cheaper since the 1980s without considering the effect that would have on the US manufacturing base. Corpations do not look after nation interests, they look after thier own short term profit margin.
Businesses aren't going to blindly build in a country they know who will be going against the country in which they reside in (not in the short term anyway). Germany was slightly different. The U.S. economy and most of the globes before WWII was in shambles. Germany's economy was in fact taking off and recovering. There was also no certainty that we would be against Germany either (beings there were so many German's (and wealthy ones at that) residing in the U.S.. Now I don't know what companies you all are speaking of (investing) or when they went there. One could argue all day about that stuff (when, where and what their intentions were and so on). Also business practices today are absoluetly nothing compared to what they were 70 years ago.
G1223, on Mar 17 2005, 01:18 PM, said:
Rule #162 of the Rules of Acquisition. Even in the worse of times Someone turns a profit.
Um...I can't quote that stuff like you, but isn't there also a Rule Of Acquisition that goes something like....Rule #1.., profiteering is only profitable as long as your not on the front lines. Oh and...welcome back to real life.
tennyson, on Mar 18 2005, 11:04 AM, said:
And isn't this the irony of it all? Why aren't we attacking China for something like that? I mean, the real reason why we are defending Taiwan isn't for freedom or any of that cloak and mist stuff. It's all about trade and economics with the U.S.. Buddism is (last time I checked) the fastest growing religion in the world and was supposidly to out number catholics soon. It's been a growning trend here in the U.S. since the early '90s. So why aren't we demanding the freedom of a peaceful people? Or going into Africa (like mjtian said) to stop genocides? Or hell, Central America where the really big (and quite) genocides are taking place? Because we don't have economic interest there. Without economic or political interests which are in harms way, there is no threat to Capitalism (not democracy). That's what we are really motivated by.
mjtian, on Mar 18 2005, 03:03 PM, said:
G1223, on Mar 18 2005, 01:28 PM, said:
Well it existed and was a route into India which it was also threatening. But hey China is a big misunderstood freedom loving nation jsut ask the students of Tiamen square. They knew how kind a state they were the citizens of.
I never made this claim. China has changed and while improvements is still needed, you cannot deny the fact that China in 2005 is much different than many westerners ideals of China. When was the last time you actually step foot on China? Do you have any idea what it is like to live in China today versus how it was like 15 years ago? There is no doubt that more needs to be done. But change need time. When I was growing up in China in the 1980s, food was rationed. Each individual was only allowed to consume a certain amount of protein (meats). Toady, there is a McDonald and KFC in every major intersection in ShangHai. People, including myself had to goto public telephone centers miles from my house to make an international call in 1985. Today you can dial from home or simply use your cell phone in China to make a call to the United States. So please don't just bash on a Country because your limited knowledge is based on some article you read 15 years ago.
What happened at Tianmen Square was a disgrace and I am ashamed of what the government did. Remember, I never said that the Communist government was good. As a proud Chinese American I am happy for the people of China today. When I returned to China in 2002, it was obvious to me that the people of China are much better off now than ever before. Indeed, they do not have all the freedom that we often take for granted in the West. But what works for us does not neccessarily translate into success in other Countries. While Democracy is great and the checks and balances are fair, it is foolish to think that other countries will adopt our system completely. China has shown that it is no longer a "pure" Communist country. Private businesses and ownership is booming in China. My family and many of our friends have recently invested in China. As the world changes around us so will China. Perhaps democracy is not on the immediate horizon, but change is inevitable and change is good for China and its citizens.
Here is more evidence of change.
Here's the thing (and this goes back to the intelligence remark I made too), you CAN'T blame the people for what the government does as long as there are people in society who fight for what they believe in and help change for the better what has been done wrong (such as opposing the government). MJT, you shouldn't feel shame unless you agreed with what the military did. If you felt bad for the students, then (as one who wasn't old enough to take part in either side) you shouldn't bare the guilt of mistakes of others. I say that and I still feel sorry and guilty for the European's treatment of Native Americans. *shrugs* Anyway, as long as progress is being made to a more peaceful and caring place (no matter what still has to be done), then I call it progress. There is plenty of things the U.S. needs to address. Don't forget, we're on the Humanitarian Rights bad list too. Maybe not quite as bad, but still on it.