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#81 Godeskian

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 07:02 AM

musn't.....make....WWE joke....:p

gah,

anyway,

The British press seems less than enchanted with the idea of Ratzinger, calling him amongst other things 'God's Rottweiler' (not a description most would find favorable) and making jokes at his expense (such as 'from nazi youth to Papa Ratzi')

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#82 Delvo

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 07:58 AM

A biogrphical summary I heard this morning said he deserted the Hitler Youth.

#83 Smiley

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 08:12 AM

Who I don't understand are the Catholics that are on the news who were hoping for a Pope who would loosen the rules on: Birth Control, Abortion, Pre-marital sex, Women Priests, allowing Priests to marry, etc. Ummm...you guys are Catholics right? That is what you do. That is what has been done for quite some time now. They could try these fledgling religions like Methodist, Baptist, Snake-handler, Buddist, Lutheran, whatever. Point is, if you don't like your religion's rules, "break the chains". Don't sit and weep because some old man isn't going to rule in your favor.
Although I guess this is moot because most Catholics I know just do what they want anyway (as they should). God bless confessional.
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#84 Zwolf

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 08:22 AM

Whatever else this new pope does, I hope he can do something to stop this moronic phenomenon of stain-worshipping.  

Posted Image
Is it a holy miracle... or have they just found somebody's favorite place to take a leak?

And how come every stain has to be the Virgin Mary?  I still think that grilled cheese sandwich thingie was Marlene Dietrich.

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#85 Nonny

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 08:45 AM

Spectacles, on Apr 20 2005, 02:07 AM, said:

I understand that the Church has to stand on immutable principles. The differences center around which principles are immutable. For example, the celebacy of priests is considered a this-is-what-Jesus-commanded-and-what-we've-done-for-two-thousand-years immutable principle when in fact in the early years of the church priests were allowed to marry. I may be wrong about this, but the celibacy rule has been around for only a thousand years, following a thousand years of priests marrying. Now it seems to me that arguing for the celibacy of the priesthood is really a matter of picking and choosing which principles ought to be preserved--not standing on a fundamental truth of doctrine. But then I ain't a theologian, so I don't really understand how these things are arrived at.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Few women could read or write back in the Bad Old Days, so few women were available to counteract centuries of spewage on the "inferiority" of women.  Church leaders were such misogyinists that the surprise isn't that priests were ordered to give up their wives, but that it took so long to happen.  Among the strategies used by bishops to get rid of the wives of their priests was to kidnap them and force them into convents and brothels.  BTW the point of the tragedy of Heloise and Abelard was not that they had an affair, but that they secretly married.  He was a rising young cleric and was expected to become a great man, but a wife was a liablility.  They continued to correspond after she was packed off to a convent, and while she continued to express her passion for him, he, well, didn't have what it takes anymore.  :(  :o  I am uncomfortable talking about mutilation of either sex, so more I will not say.  

Spectacles, on Apr 20 2005, 02:07 AM, said:

What disturbs me is that it seems to me that Christianity ought to be based on the teachings of Jesus--and the teachings and example of Jesus ought to be viewed in the context of his time and place. When you do that, you see that Jesus was for affirming the spirituality of all people and didn't have much use for the hierarchy of priestly authority or tradition for tradition's sake. In many ways, I worry that two thousand years of church traditions have done more to obscure the teachings of Jesus than to illuminate them. So I'm all for scrubbing off the caked-on grime of centuries of old and sometimes corrupt interpretations of his teachings. (IMHO, of course.)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Interesting.  By forcing celibacy (which does not BTW mean chastity) upon the priesthood, the church leaders imposed the context of their own time and place upon the church.  One explanation of the current effort by the church leaders to stop needed change is that imposing the context of our time and place is wrong!  :blink:

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#86 Nonny

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 08:48 AM

Christopher, on Apr 20 2005, 03:59 AM, said:

I've been thinking about what was mentioned earlier, the Biblical description of Jesus christening the first Pope... the line which is translated today as "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church" -- and how "Peter" is the modern form of the Latin/Greek name that means "rock," translated from the Aramaic or whatever it was.  Which basically means that in the original language of the line, it would've been a pun.  Jesus founded the church with a joke!  It just goes to show that organized religion should have more of a sense of humor about itself.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wo!  Good one!  :happy:  :happy:  :happy:

Christopher, on Apr 20 2005, 03:59 AM, said:

Although the mind boggles at the thought that the first Pope was called "The Rock." :eek:  :hehe:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

:lol:  :lol:  :lol:  

Nonny
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#87 Vapor Trails

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 11:11 AM

NeuralClone, on Apr 19 2005, 08:39 PM, said:

Nonny, on Apr 19 2005, 09:26 PM, said:

He's already done quite a lot.  :(  He's been Bad Cop to JPII's Good Cop.
People can change...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Yep. I just put on fresh clothes today.  :p

;)
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#88 Christopher

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 01:55 PM

Vicious Maggot, on Apr 20 2005, 09:12 AM, said:

Who I don't understand are the Catholics that are on the news who were hoping for a Pope who would loosen the rules on: Birth Control, Abortion, Pre-marital sex, Women Priests, allowing Priests to marry, etc. Ummm...you guys are Catholics right? That is what you do. That is what has been done for quite some time now. They could try these fledgling religions like Methodist, Baptist, Snake-handler, Buddist, Lutheran, whatever. Point is, if you don't like your religion's rules, "break the chains". Don't sit and weep because some old man isn't going to rule in your favor.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


That's oversimplifying.  Yes, some people do reach a point where they conclude they can no longer remain within a church or faith if they disagree with it on too fundamental a level.  But it's possible to disagree with your church on various social policies while still finding great value in its core tenets of faith and feeling loyalty to its community.  At least two of my best friends have been extremely devout Catholics while still being far more socially liberal than the papacy.  Because it isn't just about the politics to them.

Besides, the Catholic Church itself has undergone many reforms over the ages.  It isn't true that "this is what Catholics do," because, as others have already stated in this thread, there have been times in the past when Catholics did not do many of these things.  Catholicism has changed numerous times before, and it will change again.  And it's natural and healthy for the members of the church to engage in ongoing debate about what its policies should be.
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#89 NeuralClone

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 02:25 PM

^

Well said! :D
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#90 Kosh

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 03:10 PM

Most of the rules that people are upset about, were created by men after Jesus died. The Church could reverse it's stance on a lot of things, and not be going against "Gods word". We'll see what happens with this one.
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#91 Timon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 04:17 PM

Quote

JadziaDax: I wish he didn't look so much like Palpatine.

When I saw him my first impression was "By god, Zell Miller has just been elected pope!"

#92 DWF

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 10:12 PM

The top 11 Rejected Names for Pope Benedict XVI

http://www.bbspot.co...pope_names.html

Quote

11. Pope Jesus II
10. P-Benny
9. Pope Rageous sponsored by Mountain Dew
8. Pope xXx
7. Pope.tmp
6. Pope Muhammed I
5. Pope Inquisition II
4. Pope Position LXIX
3. Pope Doggy Dog
2. Pope John Paul George and Ringo
1. Pope Cracker CCLXII

:lol:  :lol:
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#93 NeuralClone

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 10:16 PM

^

LOL! :lol:
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#94 Smiley

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 08:13 AM

Christopher, on Apr 20 2005, 12:55 PM, said:

  Catholicism has changed numerous times before, and it will change again.  And it's natural and healthy for the members of the church to engage in ongoing debate about what its policies should be.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



I know, and I agree. I would love to see the Catholic chruch change for the better. It was just the image of these people with their fingers crossed hoping that one of the condenders for Pope would make changes like the ones I mentioned that I found amusing. Maybe some of the younger priests would be apt to change some rules, but I doubt the elder gents at the top are. Either way, as long as this Pope promotes peace, love and understanding, he'll be fine with me.
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