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Drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge

Animals Arctic Wildlife Refuge Drilling

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#41 Drew

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 08:02 AM

Nuclear power plants! (gasp!) You think environmentalists would allow that!?
"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."

#42 Talkie Toaster

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 08:20 AM

Bah. I'd condem them to travel by bicycle. :p
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#43 Rhiannonjk

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 08:38 AM

1) COAL!  ACK!  yes, let's start a frenzy of blasting off mountaintops to mine all of this resource (also a limited resource) which pollutes through mining, and burning.  

There are so many other forms of fuel, but a conscious decision was made in the teens or twenties to go with Gas.  It seemed like the best decision at the time.  

2) Nuclear!  Wheee!  
As an "Environmentalist" I'm very much in favor of the nuclear option.  It is mis-concieved in so many ways, but is the direction we should be looking.  But I doubt we will, as there is so much stigma related to the whole idea.

***Is easily distracted***


#44 emsparks

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 10:28 AM

As far as mining coal, and cutting off the tops of mountains, we’re already doing that. The use of gasified coal would be stopgap.

I think though energy intensive; we should build nuclear power plants. Using the electricity thereby derived, at local filling stations to convert water to hydrogen and oxygen. Then take the hydrogen thus produced to fuel, internal combustion engines converted to hydrogen, and hydrogen fuel cells. As was mentioned above part of the extra electrical capacity would naturally be used to power battery driven vehicles. Note it cost about 20 - $150 to convert most gasoline engines from gas to hydrogen.

Yes on one hand this has a very high energy over head, but it does away with the need for the whole petroleum, refinery and petrochemical transport infrastructure. This means that at a somewhat higher initial cost per BTU, we are doing way with a hell of a lot of manufacturing, and transport along with the millions of tons of toxic waste produced each year in the petrochemical and trucking industries. Not to mention the land reclaimed from refineries and pipelines.
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#45 Rhiannonjk

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 10:50 AM

^yes, I realize we are already blasting off the tops of mountains. I just had this sudden mental image of us being as hungry for coal as we are oil, and what the Appalachians would look like when it was all over.  *shudder*  

I have other thoughts on Hydrogen, which I don't have time to type up right now, but it might be the answer.  I didn't realize it was so cheap to convert.  I know some people already that make their own biodiesel and use that...

***Is easily distracted***


#46 HubcapDave

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 11:42 AM

The biggest obstacle with hydrogen is storage. Since it is the smallest atom in the universe, it tends to bleed through containment vessels relatively easily.

I'm on board for more nuke plants! Reprocess our fuel rods too, so the waste is much smaller and only radioactive for 300 years, not 20,000!

#47 Delvo

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 12:37 PM

HubcapDave, on Aug 5 2005, 11:42 AM, said:

The biggest obstacle with hydrogen is storage. Since it is the smallest atom in the universe, it tends to bleed through containment vessels relatively easily.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Storage options are being researched and developed that hold the hydrogen atoms in compounds or trap them in crystalline structures.

#48 HubcapDave

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 01:20 PM

Delvo, on Aug 5 2005, 10:37 AM, said:

HubcapDave, on Aug 5 2005, 11:42 AM, said:

The biggest obstacle with hydrogen is storage. Since it is the smallest atom in the universe, it tends to bleed through containment vessels relatively easily.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Storage options are being researched and developed that hold the hydrogen atoms in compounds or trap them in crystalline structures.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Cool.

#49 Drew

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 01:27 PM

That would be cool. Crystals as energy sources. Sounds positively Sci Fi.
"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."

#50 szhismine

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    why must you hurt me in this way Harry...

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Posted 06 August 2005 - 10:49 AM

^hehe... :D a solution like that would definately be supported by the nerds. ;)
Neville: "My grandmother forbids me from using raunchy language."
Harry: "Well your grandmother is a Blast-Ended Skank!"
Neville: *GASP*
Hermione: "He doesn't mean it Neville, he's just testing out some wizard swears."
Harry: "I mean every word I ever say ever, because I'm Harry Potter." --'Wizard Swears', Potter Puppet Pals

Hermione: "What's your problem Harry?"
Harry: "My parents are dead, my life sucks, I can't hold down a girlfriend, and I'm surrounded by f*ck*ng goblins and sh*t all the time. I mean what the f*ck?"
Ron: "But it's magic Harry. The goblins are magical!" --'Wizard Angst', Potter Puppet Pals

Me: "It's just a matter of looking past [McKay's] arrogant exterior to see his warm, fuzzy, probably angst-filled interior."
Hawkeye: "You harperchondriac girls think everyone has an angst filled interior."

"Good gods, you sniff out angst like a police dog sniffs out drugs." --Lyric (to me)

#51 Delvo

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Posted 06 August 2005 - 11:08 AM

Well, the article(s) describe subatomic crystalline structre, but didn't mention the things actually looking like "crystals"...



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