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Many New Orleans Evacuees will not return

Katrina Evacuees

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#1 Natolii

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Posted 16 September 2005 - 07:08 PM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9359357/


This is a very telling fact...

Quote

Too little info
The survey also provides disquieting clues as to why so many residents remained in New Orleans to face Hurricane Katrina despite orders to evacuate. A third of those who stayed said they never heard the mandatory order to evacuate issued by the mayor the day before the storm hit. Somewhat fewer -- 28 percent -- said they heard the order but did not understand what they were to do. Thirty-six percent acknowledged they heard the order, understood it but did not leave. In hindsight, 56 percent said they could have evacuated while 42 percent said it was impossible.

Bad decisions, bad luck or sheer stubbornness kept many in town. More than a third said the single biggest reason they did not leave was that they thought the storm would not be as bad as it was, or they decided too late to flee. One in 10 simply did not want to leave. Slightly fewer stayed behind to protect their homes from damage or theft. A handful said they did not want to leave pets.

Angie Oneal, 44, a housekeeper from the Sixth Ward, heard the warnings to leave on her radio. But she stayed to protect her belongings.

"I said to myself, if we went through Bessie, I thought we could go through Katrina," Oneal said. "I thought it was just going to pass over." She worried about the new TV, computer and bedroom set she had just bought.

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#2 Cheile

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 01:20 AM

and this is WHY the mayor should have forced a mandatory evacuation....to keep these idiots from claiming they never heard the suggestion or using the excuse that they had no way to leave or didn't feel like leaving.

the only ones i feel any sympathy for are the ones who did not get to the Superdome when they should have (the elderly, ill, etc).  i don't buy those who said they had no transportation out.  i would have walked or begged a ride.

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#3 Delvo

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 09:01 AM

This is good. It was a place people shouldn't have lived anyway, and this will reduce the drive some people seem to feel to rebuild and start the whole thing all over again like it was. Parts of the city that should be permanently adandoned can be.

#4 Natolii

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 10:42 AM

Cheile, on Sep 17 2005, 02:20 AM, said:

and this is WHY the mayor should have forced a mandatory evacuation....to keep these idiots from claiming they never heard the suggestion or using the excuse that they had no way to leave or didn't feel like leaving.

the only ones i feel any sympathy for are the ones who did not get to the Superdome when they should have (the elderly, ill, etc).  i don't buy those who said they had no transportation out.  i would have walked or begged a ride.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>



He did not have the manpower according to one resident of Jefferson's Parish. He appealed to Gov. Blanco for help and she did nothing...

As that resident put it, "I can't believe I voted for that Fat Cow..."

You will not find this is print anywhere as it is my friend... I tend to believe her more than the crap that comes through the media.
"I have on this board written pages and pages pointing out the science, and I will be dammed if I am going to attempt to reach closed minds that donít even know how to use a reference library." -emsparks (Fenton E. Magill, dec. 1/25/07 - Love you Dad)

#5 Shalamar

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 12:07 PM

Since people are bringing in words from the lips of residents of the Big Easy...

The international company that I work for has sites through out the entire region that the hurricane hit.

They got our partners and their families out, cared for, housed and to work at our other sites across the nation. ( some before the hurricane hit, some from  the Superdone evacuation...)

The location I work at has 6 - black and white, hourly and salary, male and female - now politics have not been discussed, but uniformly they've had nothing good to say about Nagin or Blanco - in short those six very firmly blame the locals not the feds. - and yes all six said they voted for both the Nagin and Blanco - and won't ever again.

All six of them and their families are going back, they want to and when the news came yesterday that our plant in New Orleans will restart Monday- the cheers that went up were very loud.

They want to go home.
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#6 Nikcara

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 01:44 PM

You know, it really bugs me that so many people seem to think that all the people who were trapped were idiots.  Many of these people had weathered storms before and figured that this one would be like every one they had weathered before.  It's not being stupid to use your previous experiance and expect not much more than leaky roofs, several inches on the street and perhaps in your home, and some scary storms when every other storm has been like that.  And if the leviees hadn't broken, which I'm sure wasn't anticipated, the storm probably wouldn't have caused more than a handful of deaths.

And how are you going to get out of your house and hike to the superdome when you several feet of water rushing down in the street?  By the time most people realized this wasn't just another bad storm, they were screwed.

There also wasn't time to go door-to-door and inform everyone to evacaute, so people who didn't happen to be watching tv that night would be screwed one way or the other.  Besides, it's pretty hard to force evacuations.  Generally the best you can do is say 'if you want to stay, we won't even bother looking for your body' and move on.  That line tends to change people's minds, from what i understand
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#7 Cheile

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 01:57 PM

^ category 5 hurricanes (which Katrina originally was) do NOT happen every day.  for these people to act as if they do and therefore brush it off as nothing more than a bothersome wind IS idiocy.

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#8 Tricia

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 04:02 PM

IMO more could have been done to inform the people of the evacuation order.

Maybe it seems simplistic but hasn't anyone ever seen those movies etc where they drive the truck or whatever thru the neighborhood and thru speakers mounted on/in it blare out things like say campaign slogans?  

Or better yet....I know that around these parts, police cars have that capability. They can tell you not to get out of your car or say something over the speaker so you can hear them...without getting out of their car even.



But as to the choices folks made....perhaps they are like so many who think that it can't be as bad as they say on the news or that it might go ashore somewhere else. The "Not In My Backyard" approach to Mother Nature

In fact many times when a hurricane is "definitely" going to make landfall at a specific...or as specific as they can get....location and they announce that it most definitely is coming in There,  people have rushed around prepping for it.   Then it changes direction and goes ashore somewhere else.  

It makes folks start thinking...oh, this will be like all those other times and it won't come in Here.  So they stop taking the evacuations and all the warnings seriously.
This is usually after several times of prepping for something that doesn't happen

It is a phenomena that worries the people in charge of storm preparations...that people will start taking those dire warnings less seriously because next time the hurricane might not change directions.

Sounds a bit simplistic but.....

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#9 Tricia

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 04:06 PM

But as to people returning to New Orleans...or not....it depends on each individual.

Some may not want to go back right now but return somewhere down the road as the lure of home calls them.  Or they may stay away forever.

A lot depends on the lives they make while they are away.  A better job and new friends will come into play in the decision making process.

Just a whole lot of variables in each person's decisions

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


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Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#10 Norville

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 11:24 PM

Nikcara said:

You know, it really bugs me that so many people seem to think that all the people who were trapped were idiots.

It's driving me up the wall, and I'd like to ask the usual suspects how well they think they'd do in an emergency like that. I'm wondering how well I'd do. I don't have a car, I take buses, and live right near water, not to mention in earthquake territory. I'm wondering how well the bus lines will be working after a big quake, how well the roads (a lot of which don't get maintained very often, maybe once every 20-30 years or so! :crazy: ) will stand up to a big quake so that drivers *can* drive out (especially if there's also flooding). I remember a great big storm we had in 1981; my high school was built on "fill" ground (former marsh land), so we became an island as the area around us flooded, and I was stranded overnight because no one could get through, except for big trucks that came in to bring us mattresses. :rolleyes:

...Blah, blah, blah, why bother, no one's listening. Sorry, Cheile, I'm not going to change my mind and go along with you that everyone who stayed was an idiot. I'm sure you'll get out just perfectly in any disaster you may experience -- yay for you.
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#11 Cheile

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Posted 17 September 2005 - 11:31 PM

Norville, on Sep 17 2005, 09:24 PM, said:

It's driving me up the wall, and I'd like to ask the usual suspects how well they think they'd do in an emergency like that.

since you're directing that at me, i'll answer you.  at first warning, i'd pack the cat, the necessaries and get the hell out!

unlike the nasty blow that will be eventually delivered to us Californians (the San Andreas snapping and probly flattening half the state), they had ample warning.  it was not like they went to bed Sunday evening and woke up Monday morning at 6ish am to a hurricane they had NO idea was headed their way howling around them.

Edited by Cheile, 17 September 2005 - 11:33 PM.

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#12 Chakotay

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 06:55 AM

I find it very telling and sad that a number of people put themselves at risk in order to protect possessions. Especially in the light of the looting that followed. Is this what we're coming too, that a TV is more important than a person when Mother Nature comes bearing down on you?

Hurricanes are getting stronger and stronger nowadays it seems. Building below sea level on the coast is not a smart move anymore, levees not withstanding.
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#13 Tricia

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 09:08 AM

Agreed that hurricanes do seem to be getting stronger and stronger

But I can't and won't say that all the folks who stayed are idiots.  Yes, there was plenty of warning and there are some folks who won't leave no matter what...

There are a variety of reasons that folks stayed....possessions being a definitely stupid one ( that I will say as things can be replaced, lives can't).

For some folks tho  they had no way out...due totally or in part to the following factors---

no car,

no money ...and that is very important as even if you have a car, it won't do you any good if you run out of gas due to lack of money  and I would imagine weathering a hurricane stranded on the side of the road would be worse than staying home and trying to ride it out

no transportation to get out, public or otherwise....what were they supposed to do, just start walking?

Telling some of these folks who had no means to get out to evacuate without providing some way for them to get out was like telling them to start flapping their arms and fly.  And to lump them in with those who stayed to protect their stuff is unfair.

As to that means of transportation...I'm hoping that ALL levels of government will work together on a realistic evacuation plan that takes everyone...the haves and the have nots...into consideration after what we saw in New Orleans.

May that be the one thing that comes of this...more study and planning of evacuation methods and the relief effort needed in the event of a major disaster be it a force of nature or man made...especially as involves a major metropolitan area

And none of this...we say 'get out and you figure out how to get yourself out of town' stuff

Not totally sure but a columnist in the Houston area reported that most evacuation plans rely almost completely on everyone having cars or the means to remove themselves from the danger zone.

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#14 Call Me Robin

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 09:40 AM

Cheile, on Sep 18 2005, 04:31 AM, said:

Norville, on Sep 17 2005, 09:24 PM, said:

It's driving me up the wall, and I'd like to ask the usual suspects how well they think they'd do in an emergency like that.

since you're directing that at me, i'll answer you.  at first warning, i'd pack the cat, the necessaries and get the hell out!

unlike the nasty blow that will be eventually delivered to us Californians (the San Andreas snapping and probly flattening half the state), they had ample warning.  it was not like they went to bed Sunday evening and woke up Monday morning at 6ish am to a hurricane they had NO idea was headed their way howling around them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Do you have a car?  Do you have a place to go to?  Many NOLA residents did not.  They did not have cars.  They did not have the money for transportation and a hotel room.  There were also tourists whose flights were cancelled and had no way out of the city.
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#15 Cheile

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 12:41 PM

Call Me Robin, on Sep 18 2005, 07:40 AM, said:

Cheile, on Sep 18 2005, 04:31 AM, said:

Norville, on Sep 17 2005, 09:24 PM, said:

It's driving me up the wall, and I'd like to ask the usual suspects how well they think they'd do in an emergency like that.

since you're directing that at me, i'll answer you.  at first warning, i'd pack the cat, the necessaries and get the hell out!

unlike the nasty blow that will be eventually delivered to us Californians (the San Andreas snapping and probly flattening half the state), they had ample warning.  it was not like they went to bed Sunday evening and woke up Monday morning at 6ish am to a hurricane they had NO idea was headed their way howling around them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Do you have a car?  Do you have a place to go to?  Many NOLA residents did not.  They did not have cars.  They did not have the money for transportation and a hotel room.  There were also tourists whose flights were cancelled and had no way out of the city.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


the ones i call idiots are mostly the ones who poo-pooed Katrina's viciousness and did have ways and means out but stayed cuz "we been through this before with hurricane X, blah blah blah", when hurricane X was likely a category 2 or 3, not a 4 or 5.

and i'd like to know if these people without cars tried asking their neighbors for help.  maybe NOLA is full of stuck up people who won't help those in need and i'm just used to living somewhere in which others try to help one another in the face of incoming chaos.....

the tourists who got stuck are excluded from this because it was not their fault their flights were cancelled on them so i don't understand why you're bringing them up.  this thread is about NOLA residents, not visitors.

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"Andromeda may be over but it's not dead. Not as long as we have fanfic writers dedicated to keeping it alive.  Whether you accept everything as canon or stop at a certain point. Whether you accept and enjoy Nu Drom or only accept Classic Drom, it will never be over.  Not as long as we have each other [and Beka], who binds us all together." ~ Mary Rose

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#16 Cardie

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 01:14 PM

Many of the people who stayed despite having the means to get out managed at least to survive in the homes they stayed in. Here is the plight of the majority who did not get out and who drowned or suffered at the SuperDome and Convention Center or ended up on a roof for three days:

You have no car.  You have no bank account or credit card, just the $25 left from your last paycheck after you paid for rent and food.  You take care of four children and an elderly, wheelchair bound parent.  In the next block, your frail aunt and uncle live, and you are the person who they look to for help in emergencies.  The few people in your neighborhood who have cars are filling them up with their extended families and don't have room for you. And, a statistic I just heard on CNN, you've never been outside the city of New Orleans in your life.

Are you going to brave the outside world on foot, pushing that wheelchair with your children trailing behind?  If you are smart, you'll do what the city told you to, go to the SuperDome and expect livable conditions for at least a few days after the storm passes.  If you are distrustful of that order, you stasy home and pray.

I've been lucky my entire life to have enough money to ride out emergencies.  I've never been out of work for even one day.  I don't understand why I can understand and sympathize with people who live in poverty while so many of the rest of you can't.

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#17 Cheile

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 06:04 PM

^ i wasn't referring to the people who went to the Superdome.  i was referring only to those who stayed in their homes despite being told they should leave.

Posted Image


"Andromeda may be over but it's not dead. Not as long as we have fanfic writers dedicated to keeping it alive.  Whether you accept everything as canon or stop at a certain point. Whether you accept and enjoy Nu Drom or only accept Classic Drom, it will never be over.  Not as long as we have each other [and Beka], who binds us all together." ~ Mary Rose

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#18 Norville

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Posted 19 September 2005 - 12:30 PM

Cardie said:

I don't understand why I can understand and sympathize with people who live in poverty while so many of the rest of you can't.

My boss really doesn't discuss religion, but said something a few days ago to the effect that she felt that we're being tested by God to see if we have *any* caring or compassion or kindness left for each other. I agreed, despite not exactly being conventionally religious (as some would wish me to be). What I said in return was about how so many people are so pleased to make callous, cruel comments about how those who died deserved it, or how those who stayed behind because they couldn't get out were too stupid to live.

Cheile said:

i was referring only to those who stayed in their homes despite being told they should leave.

Despite it being explained to you over and over how some couldn't get out because they were too old (too many old people are abandoned by others who are capable of helping, but aren't interested), or disabled, or had nowhere else to go. Whatever thrills you, dear.
"The dew has fallen with a particularly sickening thud this morning."
- Marvin the Paranoid Android, "Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy"

Rules for Surviving an Autocracy
Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
http://www.nybooks.c...s-for-survival/

#19 Kosh

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Posted 19 September 2005 - 04:01 PM

Cheile, on Sep 18 2005, 07:04 PM, said:

^ i wasn't referring to the people who went to the Superdome.  i was referring only to those who stayed in their homes despite being told they should leave.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>




Your earlier post didn't get that message across, hence, the responces you got. If Cardie hadn't done such a beautiful job, I would have chimed in with more.
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#20 Cheile

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Posted 20 September 2005 - 01:43 PM

Kosh, on Sep 19 2005, 02:01 PM, said:

Cheile, on Sep 18 2005, 07:04 PM, said:

^ i wasn't referring to the people who went to the Superdome.† i was referring only to those who stayed in their homes despite being told they should leave.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>




Your earlier post didn't get that message across, hence, the responces you got. If Cardie hadn't done such a beautiful job, I would have chimed in with more.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


uhhh WRONG.  everyone just focused on the first paragraph of my first reply to Natolii and failed to notice the second in which i said:

Quote

the only ones i feel any sympathy for are the ones who did not get to the Superdome when they should have (the elderly, ill, etc).

Posted Image


"Andromeda may be over but it's not dead. Not as long as we have fanfic writers dedicated to keeping it alive.  Whether you accept everything as canon or stop at a certain point. Whether you accept and enjoy Nu Drom or only accept Classic Drom, it will never be over.  Not as long as we have each other [and Beka], who binds us all together." ~ Mary Rose

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