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Mine Accident

West Virginia Mine Accident 2006.Sago MIne

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#41 Tricia

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 11:00 AM

View PostEskaminzim, on Jan 5 2006, 03:26 PM, said:

What I blame the mining company for is not going to the families when they got the SECOND bit of informaiton forty five minutes later and saying "look, I know someone's told you that we've found twelve alive, but right now, there is so much going on down in the mines that the truth is, we don't know what we've found, so I'd just continue to pray and let's see what happens."

He didn't, and that was wrong.  But it was, IMHO, a human mistake, needing to rectify something that he had expressly ordered NOT to happen (no one giving ANY information to the public), and I think that he was paralyzed when the second contradicting message came down the pipe.

There was a mistake made, and it was a horrible mistake, but I don't think the man's an ogre either.


I don't think he's an ogre either....

Like I said it was somehwat of an organized chaos as that false/misunderstood news was spread.

Can't really blame anyone person and how do you regain control and fix the problem when the news is spreading so fast?.  You can try but....

They want to be sure of their facts but when you have those people pulling out there phones and calling and spreading news that they have not confirmed....that news getting passed along like some wildfire out of control....and then those who are told that it may not be true and either chosing not to conrrect the situation or not wanting to be the one who breaks everyone's hearts.

To be sure it was a bad and unfortunate situation and should have never happened....

All we can hope is that lessons are learned for future situations, whether it is another accident in a coal mine or elsewhere

That it helps improve the mining industry as whole.....improves conditions in individual mines, the inspections of mines, enforcement of the rules and safety factors......

That these men died without any or not much pain.....

I heard one man who was being asked by a reporter how his family member had died in the mine...whether he thought it was from injuries from the explosion or the carbon monoxide.  That question seemed extraordinarily cruel to me.

Don't we all want to think that perhaps our loved one died semi-painlessly in that situation?  Finding out otherwise may hurt but finding it out later when the pain is not so raw might help the families cope initially.

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


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Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#42 Spectacles

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 12:38 PM

Quote

Eska: What I blame the mining company for is not going to the families when they got the SECOND bit of informaiton forty five minutes later and saying "look, I know someone's told you that we've found twelve alive, but right now, there is so much going on down in the mines that the truth is, we don't know what we've found, so I'd just continue to pray and let's see what happens."

He didn't, and that was wrong. But it was, IMHO, a human mistake, needing to rectify something that he had expressly ordered NOT to happen (no one giving ANY information to the public), and I think that he was paralyzed when the second contradicting message came down the pipe.

There was a mistake made, and it was a horrible mistake, but I don't think the man's an ogre either.

I agree. He certainly didn't set out to compound their pain. I can't imagine anyone being willfully malicious like that. It's more likely that the stress and exhaustion impaired his judgment. And he himself admits he should have notified them sooner.

As for the media's lack of respect for the families, yep. I know it's their job to get information, but one of the saddest things I saw was an older couple walking like zombies from the church with a gaggle of reporters around them. They obviously didn't want to speak. The man at one point stared straight ahead but calmly reached up and moved a microphone out of his face.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

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#43 Nonny

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 04:16 PM

View Posttrikay, on Jan 5 2006, 08:00 AM, said:

Don't we all want to think that perhaps our loved one died semi-painlessly in that situation?  Finding out otherwise may hurt but finding it out later when the pain is not so raw might help the families cope initially.

Some were comforted that way, according to Yahoo.

Quote

Relative: Miners Left Notes for Family

By ALLEN G. BREED, Associated Press Writer 1 hour, 51 minutes ago

TALLMANSVILLE, W.Va. - Some of the 12 coal miners who died following an explosion left notes behind assuring family members that their final hours trapped underground were not spent in agony, a relative said Thursday.

"The notes said they weren't suffering, they were just going to sleep," said Peggy Cohen, who had been called to a makeshift morgue at a school to identify the body of her father, 59-year-old mining machine operator Fred Ware Jr.

Cohen said a note was not left with Ware's body, but that she planned to retrieve his personal belongings later Thursday to see if he left one in his lunch box. But she said the medical examiner told her notes left with several of the bodies all carried a similar message: "Your dad didn't suffer."

Ware was among a dozen miners who were found after 41 hours inside the mine. They were found at the deepest point of the Sago Mine, about 2 1/2 miles from the entrance, behind a fibrous plastic cloth stretched across an area about 20 feet wide to keep out deadly carbon monoxide gas.

Cohen said her father had the peaceful look of someone who died from carbon monoxide, and the only mark on his body was a bruise on his chest. "It comforts me to know he didn't suffer and he wasn't bruised or crushed. I didn't need a note. I think I needed to visualize and see him."
At least they have that.  :(  

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#44 Tricia

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 04:21 PM

I read this just a few minutes ago on AOL News.

Have to admit that I am still wiping up the tears.  :blush:  :cry:

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#45 Nonny

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 04:41 PM

View Posttrikay, on Jan 5 2006, 08:00 AM, said:

I heard one man who was being asked by a reporter how his family member had died in the mine...whether he thought it was from injuries from the explosion or the carbon monoxide.  That question seemed extraordinarily cruel to me.
It does to me too, and I can just hear the tone of voice.  :angry:    

View PostSpectacles, on Jan 5 2006, 09:38 AM, said:

As for the media's lack of respect for the families, yep. I know it's their job to get information, but one of the saddest things I saw was an older couple walking like zombies from the church with a gaggle of reporters around them. They obviously didn't want to speak. The man at one point stared straight ahead but calmly reached up and moved a microphone out of his face.
Geez.  :angry:
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"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#46 Aes Sedai

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 05:15 PM

This is incredibly sad. My prayers go out to the families of the lost miners.

#47 Nonny

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Posted 05 January 2006 - 05:53 PM

View PostNonny, on Jan 5 2006, 01:16 PM, said:

View Posttrikay, on Jan 5 2006, 08:00 AM, said:

Don't we all want to think that perhaps our loved one died semi-painlessly in that situation?  Finding out otherwise may hurt but finding it out later when the pain is not so raw might help the families cope initially.

Some were comforted that way, according to Yahoo.

Quote

Relative: Miners Left Notes for Family

By ALLEN G. BREED, Associated Press Writer 1 hour, 51 minutes ago

TALLMANSVILLE, W.Va. - Some of the 12 coal miners who died following an explosion left notes behind assuring family members that their final hours trapped underground were not spent in agony, a relative said Thursday.

"The notes said they weren't suffering, they were just going to sleep," said Peggy Cohen, who had been called to a makeshift morgue at a school to identify the body of her father, 59-year-old mining machine operator Fred Ware Jr.

Cohen said a note was not left with Ware's body, but that she planned to retrieve his personal belongings later Thursday to see if he left one in his lunch box. But she said the medical examiner told her notes left with several of the bodies all carried a similar message: "Your dad didn't suffer."

Ware was among a dozen miners who were found after 41 hours inside the mine. They were found at the deepest point of the Sago Mine, about 2 1/2 miles from the entrance, behind a fibrous plastic cloth stretched across an area about 20 feet wide to keep out deadly carbon monoxide gas.

Cohen said her father had the peaceful look of someone who died from carbon monoxide, and the only mark on his body was a bruise on his chest. "It comforts me to know he didn't suffer and he wasn't bruised or crushed. I didn't need a note. I think I needed to visualize and see him."
At least they have that.  :(  

Nonny
Aw geez, this was the guy who was planning to get married Valentine's Day.  Now I'm really losing it.  :cry:  From "Capsules on some of W.Va. trapped miners" in the Desert Sun:

Quote

Fred Ware Jr.

A coal miner for six years, Fred Ware Jr. always told his fiancee, Loretta Ables, he was going to die in the mines.

Ware, 59, an operator from Tallmansville, had previously broken his ankle in the mine when a rock fell off a rib.

Ables said she and Ware had been engaged about six years and were planning a Valentine's Day wedding. Ware had worked through the holidays except for Sunday and had considered taking Monday off, too.

Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#48 Cardie

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Posted 06 January 2006 - 05:43 AM

Having grown up in WV, I heard about such tragedies regularly, but there was a lot more humanity in the news coverage before competing 24-hour news services.

I got the false good news when I got up to feed my cats and was quite devastated to go to my Yahoo front page several hours later and hear that it hadn't been true.

I just hope this leads to all these safety violations that are doubtless at other mines as well being taken care of in short order.

Mining has always taken away too many of WV's people in a state where other kinds of economic opportunity are hard to come by.  We only hear about the mining disasters, but the toll from black lung disease and other side effects of the work cause premature death for many.

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Edited by Cardie, 06 January 2006 - 05:52 AM.

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#49 Kosh

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Posted 06 January 2006 - 05:03 PM

Cable news had a thing last night, where they played back the EMT calls that night. Part of the misunderstanding may have come from those messages.
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#50 Tricia

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Posted 06 January 2006 - 05:36 PM

I heard those tapes too....

And I can see where the misunderstanding came from....


My only issue still is with the amount of time it took to get back to the families and tell them that the info was wrong.  Or even just that they weren't sure of the truth yet

I guess either everyone thought someone else had taken care of it.

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.




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