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I believe homosexuality is a sin

Religion Homosexuality Sin 2006

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#41 Anakam

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 01:58 PM

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Let me clarify; premarital sex is a sin, but it doesn't hurt anyone but the offenders, so I don't think the goverment should make a law banning that. Does that metahor help?

Yep.  Also this:

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Setting standards for yourself, that you don't expect others to adhere to. She is not forcing the standards she sets for herself on others.

is also pretty close to what I was trying to say; maybe even a little closer.

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#42 Kosh

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 01:58 PM

View PostCaithness, on Jul 3 2006, 02:50 PM, said:

View Postemsparks, on Jul 3 2006, 02:22 PM, said:

Homosexuality is a proven fact of Mammalian biology / life, not just Homo sapiens biology. Those that think otherwise are ill informed, and I dare them to prove scientifically otherwise. Homosexuality is not an orientation but a fact of life, (rather nasty expletives deleted)

I have on this board written pages and pages pointing out the science, and I will be dammed if I am going to attempt to reach closed minds that don’t even know how to use a reference library.

Anyone who's as well-read and done as much research as you should know that there's volumes upon volumes supporting any argument.  When some one shows me where on the human genome the the chromosome for homosexuality is, I'll believe you.  I promise.




There are a lot of things in science that are speculated on, worked out in Mathmatics, but have never been found in the real world, but our inablity to find it doesn't mean that it isn't there, just that we haven't advanced far enough to see it yet.






People follow what is inside. When we see something that attracks us, we don't chose to be attracked, we just are. It really is that simple.


Since I personnely believe in evolution, then homosexuals have to exsist. eveolution is stupid. It works on trial and error alone. If you find one straight man, then eveolution has gone down the other path as well, an "Equal but Opposite Reaction"
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#43 Nonny

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:02 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 3 2006, 11:15 AM, said:

When it comes to a concept like "sin", there really is no plural form of the word.
Except, of course, for 'sins.'   :)   Further inflection is done upon 'sin' when the noun is verbed.  

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It essentially means "going against your god"
That's one meaning among several, and, I suspect, a modern one.  

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#44 Lover of Purple

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:04 PM

Actually, I believe (as Jesus said) we all are sinners. Why would I attack or badmouth any fellow sinner?

#45 G1223

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:06 PM

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#46 Godeskian

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:06 PM

View PostLover of Purple, on Jul 3 2006, 08:04 PM, said:

Actually, I believe (as Jesus said) we all are sinners. Why would I attack or badmouth any fellow sinner?

Very enlightenened. :)

Personally though, it is one of my biggest issues with Christian doctrine is the notion that we all start out as sinners because of something that happened millenia ago. We don't generally speaking visit punishments of the parent on the child in modern society, because the child isn't responsible for it's parents actions. Why then should I be punished for what Adam and Eve did.

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#47 BklnScott

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:09 PM

Oy.

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#48 Lover of Purple

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:12 PM

Actually, it isn't really because of what was done. It is the fact that man's nature is to sin. Adam and Eve acted on that nature.

#49 SparkyCola

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:25 PM

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Personally though, it is one of my biggest issues with Christian doctrine is the notion that we all start out as sinners because of something that happened millenia ago.


It's not about that at ALL! We don't start out as sinners- it's simply that no one can possibly be perfect. As Christians we endeavour to aim for perfection- but we need God's forgiveness because we know we cannot possibly get there.

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#50 Caithness

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:32 PM

View PostNorville, on Jul 3 2006, 02:33 PM, said:

I know that I'm going to regret posting this and will want to delete it later... but it seems important at the time.

What about homosexuality when it appears in nature? Is it still wrong? What about those two male penguins who appeared to be partners and were raising a baby penguin together? (I'm not certain that they're still together, but they were.)

Caithness said:

I just think that it's about time people stopped being persecuted on this board because of their first amendment right to voice a dissenting opinion.

Is there something about your faith that believes that people defending themselves against your stance *against them* is persecuting *you*? (Is that an overly complicated sentence? Yes. Apologies.)

However, you're expressing your belief in terms which are more polite than "Abomination!" Thanks.

I just want you to be aware that I've cut back on posting here because I feel that nothing I say is right, and that people make a blessed *point* of misunderstanding anything I say, so you're not the only one who feels like an outsider.

Delvo said:

What are you thinking of as the meaning of the word "homosexuality": sexual attraction to others of the same sex, or action based on such an attraction?

I get the impression that daring to have the feelings at all is all the same to certain people, whether it's acted upon or not. I've had bi feelings that I've never dared to act upon, and so, feeling that everything about me is wrong according to someone, I gave up on relationships. Whatever. At least I'm not living in sin -- oh, but I am, because I haven't had children! Whatever, again.

Delvo said:

But Christianity and Judaism have been known to set a different standard, by which even being tempted is already a sin even though you can't possibly control what you feel or think.

Yes, the Bible does say that thinking is the same as doing, which has driven me into guilty depressions my entire life, thank you. I've come to realize that I have no control over anything in the world except for my

self, and sometimes I can't even control *myself*, because my crazed, depressed mind thinks things that are apparently the same as doing them. That sent me into such a tailspin back in my 20s, I'm not sure how I survived. I've come to terms with it somewhat better now. Maybe...

Delvo said:

honor your parents

And yet, even while saying that if children raise a hand against their parents, they should be punished, the Bible also speaks of family members turning against each other to follow Christ. Gotta love the contradiction.

Anakam said:

it's possible to believe that something is a sin and leave it alone. Whenever I'm fighting with the more conservative aspects of my upbringing, I am of the opinion (and wish very much that more of my faith would share this opinion) that if it really is a sin, it's between, you know, them and God,

Okay, Anakam, there have been times when I've wanted to say "I love you!" and this is one of them -- but don't worry, it's purely platonic. :devil:

I've felt the same, because no matter how strongly I said as a teenager that homosexuality was bullbleep (before friends came out to me and caused me to rethink some things, etc.), I still felt that we're all God's children and should be treated with respect and decency. (Which I'm sure makes me a liberal leftist. Oh, give it a rest.) There's a little concept that only God is allowed to judge, and that if people judge, they'll be judged by the same measure -- so if people have no mercy, they'll be judged the same way. Therefore, yes, it's much better to keep these things between oneself and God.

Broph said:

If we were to truly avoid everyone who sinned, wouldn't we lead a very solitary life?

Considering the Bible says something to the effect that "We have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God," yes, it's impossible to avoid everyone. (Although, actually, apart from work, I do my best to live like a hermit, so...)

Balderdash said:

Homosexuals are icky and we shouldn't act on our ickyness but y'all heterosexuals feel free to fall in love with whoever you want, no one is going to bother you or take anything from you. You can live where ever you want and your jobs are safe and god looooooves you! Yay for you!

*chuckle* There are times when I want to tell heteros who are pawing each other in public, "Are you certain that it's only gays who flaunt themselves?" Because I've seen a lot of that, including young women sitting in men's laps in public while they kiss and grope each other. Why is *that* acceptable? "Oh, *look* at how hetero we are!" :rolleyes:

*edited for Quotes Gone Wrong*
\

Actually, that penguin thing is kinda cute.

By persecution, I was talking about people being called bigots and jackasses.  I won't post links cuz I'm sure everyone already knows what I'm talking about.
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#51 emsparks

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 02:45 PM

View PostCaithness, on Jul 3 2006, 02:50 PM, said:

View Postemsparks, on Jul 3 2006, 02:22 PM, said:

Homosexuality is a proven fact of Mammalian biology / life, not just Homo sapiens biology. Those that think otherwise are ill informed, and I dare them to prove scientifically otherwise. Homosexuality is not an orientation but a fact of life, (rather nasty expletives deleted)

I have on this board written pages and pages pointing out the science, and I will be dammed if I am going to attempt to reach closed minds that donít even know how to use a reference library.

Anyone who's as well-read and done as much research as you should know that there's volumes upon volumes supporting any argument.  When some one shows me where on the human genome the the chromosome for homosexuality is, I'll believe you.  I promise.

You are quite correct, no gene has been found for homosexuality.

What is a fact, a proven medical fact is the various effects that sex hormone shots have on the human body. One only has to look at the medical work up used on transsexuals to see the effects. If hormones can change the sexual appearance of the entire body so, there is no reason that they canít affect the mind in the same way.  The current theory is that homosexuality is a variation in the sex hormones. OH and by the way homosexuality both male and female has been imaged, using medical imaging techniques. So itís not a homosexual gene, itís the sex hormone genes acting differently. Human sexuality is on all fronts a very complicated subject.

Reliably and repeatedly affected by specific medications, and imaged, in todayís scientific world there is no stronger proof of biological existence.
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#52 Bobby

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:05 PM

Jesus loves me, Jesus loves me, this I know, for the bible tells me so.

And, of course, Jesus is with me in every moment always wanting for me to turn to him and proclaim that he is my savior.  And then let us not forget the only way to heaven is by accepting Jesus.  I went to Southern Baptist churches and Presbyterian churches up until I was twelve.   :Oo:

So that means that all those Chinese people that never get to hear the word because they'll be executed for practicing will go to hell.  Or the Muslims who believe in Allah.  And let's not forget the Jews.  When I'm looking for a good laugh, I turn on TBN and watch that   gluttonous overweight Pastor Haggee casting stones from the pulpit.  Or I think of Jimmy Swaggert and Jim Baker and their prostitutes.

I don't believe in Chrisitianity for the sole fact that Judaism( that's where Christainity gets it's roots) doesn't acknowledge Jesus as the Lord and Savior.

Pentecostal's don't believe in wearing make up and think it's a sin or so one of them told me in school once.  I guess getting all painted up for a night on the town is just as sinful.

So everyone can  think it's a sin all they like.  If any religion were the only game in town I might believe it but what with over 10,000 Christian groups disagreeing over the small things, why should I believe a word about what any church says about the big things?

If I go to hell, I'll go gladly and some of the most interesting people in history will be there waiting, I'm sure.

I see this topic as being more of a forum for discussing religious beliefs myself.  After all, 'for ALL have sinned and fall short of the glory of god."  I see quite clearly, I have no mote in my eye.

Why should it be limited to just homosexuality?  Or am I allowed to start topics about every single sin in the bible?  Fair is fair.   I want to start one on Gluttony if we can't use this topic to encompass all sins since 67% of Americans are overweight, myself included.  I mean, according to statistics only 10% of the population is gay but far more are pigging out daily.  I think they should pass an amendment against being fat.  It would save on health care costs and affects every American.

God bless but not to the athiests.  Myself, I'm an agnostic with Buddist/Quaker leanings.

To each his own.  Good day.  Hurrah for the Freedom of Speech.   :D

Edited by Caesar of the Stars, 03 July 2006 - 04:47 PM.


#53 ArdenCabbel

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:28 PM

I support Caithness for her expression of her beliefs.  
As I have mentioned in a previous thread I am a southern baptist (carrying with it all the associated beliefs.).  It has become a social order of the day to cry foul when someone mentions that they believe that homosexuality is a sin.  To me that is breeding a new order of intolerance.

I do not have a problem with any homosexual (i do believe that it is a sin, but everyone is a sinner in my beliefs), I will not harass them, persecute them, ignore them, demean them, dehumanize them, or in any other way be uncivil towards them.  (but I also will not support the lifestyle, but i will support the person).  I come from a school of baptist thought that says that in the end all that matters is the person's soul.  I would rather save a person then 'turn them straight'.

That being said.... enjoy your conversations!

(edited for spelling.... don't want to turn anyone into George Strait.....)

Edited by ArdenCabbel, 03 July 2006 - 03:29 PM.

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#54 gsmonks

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:34 PM

View PostSparkyCola, on Jul 3 2006, 01:25 PM, said:

Quote

Personally though, it is one of my biggest issues with Christian doctrine is the notion that we all start out as sinners because of something that happened millenia ago.


It's not about that at ALL! We don't start out as sinners- it's simply that no one can possibly be perfect. As Christians we endeavour to aim for perfection- but we need God's forgiveness because we know we cannot possibly get there.

Sparky

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#55 EChatty

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:35 PM

^There is only ONE George Strait ;) :drool:

#56 gsmonks

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:38 PM

View PostChatterbox, on Jul 3 2006, 02:35 PM, said:

^There is only ONE George Strait ;) :drool:

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#57 Josh

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:44 PM

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I am of the opinion (and wish very much that more of my faith would share this opinion) that if it really is a sin, it's between, you know, them and God, if they believe in the same God whose Bible says homosexuality is a sin.

What this lovely lady said. I am confident in my homosexuality because I believe that God made me this way. I do not believe that I'm meant to be alone in this life. It took a lot of pain and a lot of discovery to get to this place and I'm happy about it.

Ultimately, whatever choices I make (and I've made a lot of them) they're between me and God. I left the Mormon faith a few months ago and that was between me and Him. I'm gay. That's between me and Him. No one else has the right to judge me.

It's astonishing to see how many actually have.
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#58 veganmom

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:46 PM

View PostJosh, on Jul 3 2006, 08:44 PM, said:

No one else has the right to judge me.

Doesn't it all just boil down to this?

#59 Josh

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:46 PM

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Doesn't it all just boil down to this?

You'd think. ;)
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#60 eryn

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 03:52 PM

View PostJosh, on Jul 3 2006, 02:44 PM, said:

No one else has the right to judge me.

Now this is probably the best thing I've read in this thread. :)
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