Jump to content


Getting an "Insecure Connection" warning for Exisle? No worry

Details in this thread

God doesn't exist . . .

Religion Atheism God Nonexistent 2006

  • Please log in to reply
192 replies to this topic

#41 Bobby

Bobby

    FKA LiberalBob

  • Islander
  • 4,369 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:12 PM

Why a mango?  God doesn't always give you what you want sometimes it's what you need.  Maybe you need your computer?  No?

Do you think there is any purpose to life excluding all religious beliefs?  Or is consciousness a random occurance?

Edited by Caesar of the Stars, 07 July 2006 - 05:13 PM.


#42 gsmonks

gsmonks

    Tree Psychiatrist

  • Islander
  • 5,053 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:15 PM

Guys, the most amazing thing just happened.

A few days ago I put an old computer out in the foyer for someone to adopt. It's such an old, suspect beater that I didn't feel right about taking money for it.

I just got a knock at my door. Kofi, the guy upstairs who took the computer, put something in my hand, and with a big, toothy smile said, "Peace, brotha."

It was a mango.

I'm not making this up.
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#43 Shalamar

Shalamar

    Last Star to the Left and Straight on till Morning

  • Forever Missed
  • 17,644 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:16 PM

Giggles madly...the Divine acts in mysterious ways.

Enjoy your mango.
The three most important R's
Respect for One's Self / Respect for Others / Responsibility for One's Words & Actions.

Posted Image

#44 Tricia

Tricia

    To err on the side of kindness is seldom an error.

  • Islander
  • 10,245 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:20 PM

And God has to prove something to you, Gs.......why? :rolleyes:  :lol:

Ever heard the saying 'sometimes the best things in life are unanswered prayers'?

Just because you ask for something, doesn't mean you will get it even if you are the most faithful of believers....

And making demands.....**shaking head**  tsk tsk..(giggles)

a computer into a mango....ROFL.


Besides....if God did as you asked, most likely you'd pass out from the shock and hurt yourself and then you'd say it was His fault

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#45 Bobby

Bobby

    FKA LiberalBob

  • Islander
  • 4,369 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:21 PM

Who is it that is in charge of verifying miracles for the church?  And does the mango have an image of Mary or Jesus naturally emblazed on it?

#46 Anastashia

Anastashia

    Tyrant Matriarch and Pegan Too!

  • Islander
  • 11,777 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:23 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 06:15 PM, said:

Guys, the most amazing thing just happened.

A few days ago I put an old computer out in the foyer for someone to adopt. It's such an old, suspect beater that I didn't feel right about taking money for it.

I just got a knock at my door. Kofi, the guy upstairs who took the computer, put something in my hand, and with a big, toothy smile said, "Peace, brotha."

It was a mango.

I'm not making this up.

ROTFLMAO at either God or gsmonks, either interpretation works.
The Science Fiction Examiner

In the quiet of Midden a young child grows.
Does the salvation of his people grow with him?
"Everything we do now is for the child"

"I made a mistake,
just follow along,
isn't that what tyranny is all about?"
Sheila M---my Praise Band Director

For as long as I shall live
I will testify to love
I'll be a witness in the silences when words are not enough
Testify to Love

Posted Image


#47 gsmonks

gsmonks

    Tree Psychiatrist

  • Islander
  • 5,053 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:38 PM

To make matters worse, the mango talks.

It says, "Behold, I am the fruit of man's existence!"

Edited by gsmonks, 07 July 2006 - 05:39 PM.

Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#48 Bobby

Bobby

    FKA LiberalBob

  • Islander
  • 4,369 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:40 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 05:38 PM, said:

To make matters worse, the mango talks.

It says, "Behold, I am the fruit of man's existence!"


Does this mango have a name?  Why am I thinking of Saturday Night Live..

#49 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:43 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 09:57 PM, said:

I have a simple method for proving that God doesn't exist.

God is supposedly all-seeing, all-knowing, all-powerful, right?

He can do anything.

Okay, well, "God, as we're reading this, turn each of our computers into a mango."

To paraphase Father Mulcahey on Mash, 'God does answer every question, only sometimes the answer is no'

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#50 gsmonks

gsmonks

    Tree Psychiatrist

  • Islander
  • 5,053 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:43 PM

It hasn't told me its name yet, but I've set up a little shrine for it surrounded with scented candles. It's all very New-Agey.
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#51 gsmonks

gsmonks

    Tree Psychiatrist

  • Islander
  • 5,053 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:45 PM

View PostGodeskian, on Jul 7 2006, 04:43 PM, said:

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 09:57 PM, said:

I have a simple method for proving that God doesn't exist.

God is supposedly all-seeing, all-knowing, all-powerful, right?

He can do anything.

Okay, well, "God, as we're reading this, turn each of our computers into a mango."

To paraphase Father Mulcahey on Mash, 'God does answer every question, only sometimes the answer is no'

Yes, but that's still just talk, Godeskian. This thread should have been subtitled "Where's the beef?"

Part of my point is that this religion stuff is all talk, no go. Endless mountains of talk, in fact, but not one measelly little mango. Except for mine, of course.

I could add that "Mine is the only true mango. Thou shalt have no other mango before mine!"

Edited by gsmonks, 07 July 2006 - 05:46 PM.

Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#52 Lord of the Sword

Lord of the Sword
  • Islander
  • 15,681 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:46 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 06:15 PM, said:

Guys, the most amazing thing just happened.

A few days ago I put an old computer out in the foyer for someone to adopt. It's such an old, suspect beater that I didn't feel right about taking money for it.

I just got a knock at my door. Kofi, the guy upstairs who took the computer, put something in my hand, and with a big, toothy smile said, "Peace, brotha."

It was a mango.

I'm not making this up.

Now aren't you upset that you didn't ask GOD to turn your computer into a million dollars? LMAO!
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#53 gsmonks

gsmonks

    Tree Psychiatrist

  • Islander
  • 5,053 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:48 PM

View PostLORD of the SWORD, on Jul 7 2006, 04:46 PM, said:

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 06:15 PM, said:

Guys, the most amazing thing just happened.

A few days ago I put an old computer out in the foyer for someone to adopt. It's such an old, suspect beater that I didn't feel right about taking money for it.

I just got a knock at my door. Kofi, the guy upstairs who took the computer, put something in my hand, and with a big, toothy smile said, "Peace, brotha."

It was a mango.

I'm not making this up.

Now aren't you upset that you didn't ask GOD to turn your computer into a million dollars? LMAO!

I dunno . . . you can't eat a million dollars.
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#54 Bobby

Bobby

    FKA LiberalBob

  • Islander
  • 4,369 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:50 PM

If you come across a truck with a load of mangos, trail very, very far behind it.  Just in case.

Edited by Caesar of the Stars, 07 July 2006 - 05:56 PM.


#55 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:51 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 11:45 PM, said:

Yes, but that's still just talk, Godeskian. This thread should have been subtitled "Where's the beef?"

Part of my point is that this religion stuff is all talk, no go. Endless mountains of talk, in fact, but not one measelly little mango. Except for mine, of course.

Are you an ignosticist by chance?

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#56 SparkyCola

SparkyCola
  • Islander
  • 14,904 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:53 PM

I feel we may benefit from having the quoted bible passage in its entirety:

Quote

"The Pharisees and Sadducees came to Jesus, wanting to trick him. So they asked him to show them a miracle from God.
Jesus answered, "At sunset you say we will have good weather, because the sky is red. And in the morning you say that it will be a rainy day, because the sky is dark and red. You see these signs in the sky and know what they mean. In the same way, you see the things that I am doing now, but you don't know their meaning. Evil and sinful people will not be given any sign, except the sign of Jonah*." Then Jesus left them and went away."

* Jonah's 3 days in the fish are like Jesus' 3 days in the tomb

Good ole' Red sky at night, shepherd's delight, red sky in the morning, shepherd's warning. Don't you think gs, that that passage is perhaps, not dissimilar to this situation? There, and all along you were asking us- there's an FAQ in the Bible with answers from Jesus himself! Ask God! But, 'talk is cheap', even from God...? If you can't accept words from Jesus that you can see, you'll never accept mangoes from a God that you cannot see.


I have all the proof I need in my life. God always leads me in the right direction and shows me things and teaches me things I wouldn't otherwise appreciate. Because I have faith, I don't need God to make it abundantly obvious that he is real- just as I don't need my mum to make it clear to every person on this planet that SHE exists. If you come knocking on my door- there you will find my mum. But until you do that you can never know her. It's the same with God.

gs- Like any good parent, no matter how much we whine, God gives us what we need, not what we want. In heaven I've no doubt you can have all the mangoes your heart desireth but happy are those who believe without seeing. Believe you me- you need a computer more than a mango. God knows that.

This isn't nearly as black and white as you make it seem. Mary Rose is understandably insulted that you make it seem so simple when it really. just. isn't. you act as though you expect us to say 'oh yeah, i never thought about that'- newsflash- we don't believe things irrationally, we think questions like this through- for me very objectively before i became Christian. think about the consequences of God making it unavoidably clear to all that he exists. that changes everything about life- including free will. God wants people to come to him of their own free will, if he wanted a bunch of minions he could do that very easily. He doesn't.

It all comes down to this - for those who believe, no proof is needed. for those who do not- no proof is enough. If a burgler stole your computer and the next day your friend bought you a mango for a birthday present, you would be quick to dismiss it as coincidence, i'm sure.

Why should God give you a mango? You don't believe in him, you haven't prayed for a mango, you don't need a mango, oh, and did i mention the part about you not believing in him? If you don't let God into your life, you can't expect him to force his way in.

What you're asking, is your friend to get you something from your bedroom, but without letting them into your house. Sure, they could break in forcibly and give it to you- but they care about you too much to break in and force their presence upon you when you so clearly don't want them there. No matter how much you yell at your friend, they won't enter your house until you invite them. God is an amazing friend- not all friends stay outside your door through all weathers, being continually rejected and rejected and insulted, potentially abused, slandered ...just on the offchance that you want to let him in. Even some parents wouldn't stand up to that.

gs, you say that a mango is more important than the words of the bible? My friend a mango is extremely cheap. Tesco probably do them for under a pound. Wisdom is priceless. Words can be cheap, or they can be invaluable. Do not be so quick to write them off for the sake of a mango. Now if you went looking for something equally as priceless, say, love, you'll find God has already given that to you. If you went looking for forgiveness, God would give it to you. Unless, you used the same insincerity which you employ now, that is...

Quote

Well, long, long ago God turned my computer into an APPLE. Since then I have felt so very blessed with this APPLE that there is absolutely no reason to ask for it to be a mango. I already have a miracle, so thus I am well pleased.

ROFL! Brilliance Gigi! :lol:

Quote

All I will say is that when you finally see him face to face I hope He hands you a mango.

I can picture it now.

God: Gs, you have lead a good life. Thus, if you want, you can enter into heaven if you now accept that I *do* exist, and can be a part of your life in death, even if you missed out in life, but only if you want.
GS: ...that's all well and good, but where's my mango?
God *hands GS a mango*
Gs: thank you! finally! *enters heaven*
God  :rolleyes:


I daresay though gs, that you, being nearly as stubborn as me, will disregard my point of view in a circular sort of argument which implies you have not read a word I typed.  :(

If you answer with 'That's all talk, where's my mango?' then again you insinuate that mangoes are worth more than talk. Well then, that is where we fundamentally disagree.

Much beside the point, as a computer nerd *huggles computer* (don' worry darlin, i'd much rather have you than a lousy mango :hugs: ) ahem, I value my computer much more than a mango *pats CPU*

Well, wouldn't want *MY* computer getting any funny ideas...

Sparky
Able to entertain a thought without taking it home to meet the parents

#57 Lord of the Sword

Lord of the Sword
  • Islander
  • 15,681 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:54 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 06:48 PM, said:

I dunno . . . you can't eat a million dollars.

LMAO! But a million dollars buys an awful lot of mangos.

Tell you what...you keep the mango...GOD, if you're listening turn my computer into a million dollars.

*waits for the money*

Come on GOD, show me the money!
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#58 gsmonks

gsmonks

    Tree Psychiatrist

  • Islander
  • 5,053 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:55 PM

View PostGodeskian, on Jul 7 2006, 04:51 PM, said:

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 11:45 PM, said:


Yes, but that's still just talk, Godeskian. This thread should have been subtitled "Where's the beef?"

Part of my point is that this religion stuff is all talk, no go. Endless mountains of talk, in fact, but not one measelly little mango. Except for mine, of course.

Are you an ignosticist by chance?

What the heck is an ignosticist?

Anyway, I've decided on a new name for my new faith. I call it:

-get this-

The Cult of the Mango!

All Shall Love Me And Despair!


(-dunt-dunt-dunt-dunt-da-a-a-a-a-a!!!-)
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#59 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:58 PM

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 11:55 PM, said:

View PostGodeskian, on Jul 7 2006, 04:51 PM, said:

View Postgsmonks, on Jul 7 2006, 11:45 PM, said:


Yes, but that's still just talk, Godeskian. This thread should have been subtitled "Where's the beef?"

Part of my point is that this religion stuff is all talk, no go. Endless mountains of talk, in fact, but not one measelly little mango. Except for mine, of course.

Are you an ignosticist by chance?

What the heck is an ignosticist?


From Wiki

Quote

Ignosticism is the view that the question of the existence of God is meaningless because it has no verifiable (or testable) consequences and should therefore be ignored

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#60 Delvo

Delvo
  • Islander
  • 9,273 posts

Posted 07 July 2006 - 05:59 PM

View PostRobert Hewitt Wolfe, on Jul 7 2006, 05:10 PM, said:

The existance or lack of existance of God is a matter of faith either way.
It depends on what idea of "god" you want to prove or disprove. As a word with all lowercase letters, so it's "a god" instead of a proper noun naming a specific character, it's very vague. To try to prove it or disprove it, first you'd have to come up with a definition that describes it more precisely and then see whether that description includes any testable details. And whereas a still-vague definition like "the force that created everything" is still not provable or disprovable, some definitions do have enough meat in them to really prove or disprove.

One such definition, specific enough to contain elements that allow proof or disproof, is the definition GSMonks is using here, although he didn't openly state his definition: that it not only is all-powerful but also obeys and serves us. Our inability to call for miracles whenever we want might not disprove the existence of some other kinds of gods, but it does disprove the existence of the particular one he's defined to start with: one from whom we could call for miracles like that.

The catch for most religious people, and many others who say "God" instead of "a god" when dealing with this question, is that they're using not just a word but a name: a name of a character defined as having some specific traits, not just a generic concept of "the supernatural". So now it's not a matter of proving or disproving the existence of any and all gods or some undefined vague concept. It's a matter of proving or disproving the existence of THAT particular one based on its own description/definition. And that, though few people admit it, is quite easy to disprove.

The particular, specific god who bears that name is supposed to be all-powerful, the creator of everything, all-knowing, and benevolent. But such a god would have created a world without problems in it, and this world has problems in it. Some try to shift the blame to something else like the Devil, but God created that, too, or else he's not really the creator of everything. So, assuming he is the all-creator, the fact that the world has problems in it forces one (or more) of these conclusions:
1. He's not all powerful; he can't fix the problems.
2. He's not all-knowing; he didn't see the problems coming and doesn't know they're here now, or can't figure out a solution.
3. He's not benevolent; he doesn't particularly care about making things go well here.

The usual response to this is about "free will", but that has its own problems:
A. It doesn't account for problems we didn't cause ourselves.
B. If he's really the creator, then he's the one who designed our will when he created us, so he could have defined us as creatures that would freely choose to do good because we want to even when not compelled to.
C. It doesn't really even get us out of the choice between numbers 1, 2, and 3 above at all; it just quietly chooses #3 and hopes to sneak that by unnoticed.



Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Religion, Atheism, God Nonexistent, 2006

0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users