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Fun with mock indignation: "Illegals" too insensitive a word

Social Commentary Word Sensitivity Political Correctness 2006 Politics

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#21 Godeskian

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Posted 19 October 2006 - 07:25 AM

View PostNittany Lioness, on Oct 19 2006, 01:19 PM, said:

Say, for us ignorant Yanks --
what is a "yob"?  
And what do they talk and walk like?  :p

Yobs, british slang based on the reverse of 'boy' when it was invented back in the early 20's. These days it covers girls as well, and these are petty thugs, gangmembers and occasionally surly teens.

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#22 enTranced

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Posted 19 October 2006 - 09:03 AM

View PostRaina, on Oct 19 2006, 08:38 AM, said:

G1223 said:

You can pick on white folks but dare not say anything deemed offensive of any other minority group.
Someone I knew once said that white men are the most discriminated against in our day and age. I'm inclined to think that's true.

I know it's true, every time I have to fill out that little "voluntary" form in every job application I fill out. I wonder how many jobs I have lost when I fill in "white, male".

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#23 Spectacles

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Posted 19 October 2006 - 12:02 PM

Quote

Hispanic Journalists Urge Sensitivity When Covering Immigration

The National Association of Hispanic Journalists calls for stopping the use of “illegals” and curbing the phrase “illegal alien”, asking for sensitivity in the media when referring to undocumented workers:

How ridiculous.

And if the term "undocumented worker" becomes common currency, the NAHJ will probably find a reason to object to that term as well.

How on earth can people defend people who are working in this country illegally? After all, this is as much a matter of national security as it is anything else. That porous border is probably going to be the route the next Mohammed Atta takes. But god forbid we should do anything about it lest we hurt someone's feelings or deprive some industry (and big political donor) of its pool of cheap labor.

So, sorry, I have no patience for all this "sensitivity" hooey concerning the topic of illegal immigration. I'm all for welcoming immigrants into this country, as long as they come here legally. But if they don't, I'm be damned if I'm going to call them something that implies that the dog ate their "documents."
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#24 Bobby

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Posted 19 October 2006 - 12:18 PM

View PostLin731, on Oct 18 2006, 03:41 PM, said:

I so love PC crap, especially when it's pulled into service to try and not describe an action for what it is. If you came into the US from another country, you're an alien. If you came into this country without a visa, you are here illegally. Put the two together and what do ya get? Illegal alien. A drug dealer or a Pimp can call him/herself an Entrepeneur but there still just a drug dealer or pimp. A hooker can call themselves a hospitality associate/facilitater but their still just a hooker. God forbid we call things what they are, lest we offend those millions that came here via breaking US law and now lower our wage scales and suck up or social services. :crazy:  I have a solution to their oppression and hurt feelings....GO HOME.


What Lin said.  I agree.  I'm liberal as hell but I do have a degree of nationalism.  And it does under cut Americans citizens ability to get fair wages when employers can hire cheap labor.  The Mexicans just want a better life but coming here won't fix their country.  At some point somebody has to stand up and make the necessary changes but instead they come here and so Mexico's government stays corrupt.  

Although the subject of this thread is based on what hispanic journalists want done, I have to say, I think Canada should be thrown into the mix.  All we ever hear about is Mexicans but their are a few of them violating the borders too.

Edited at request of Life for Rent

Edited by QueenTiye, 26 March 2007 - 09:41 AM.


#25 Broph

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Posted 19 October 2006 - 12:41 PM

That Genesis song just won't be the same anymore. "Cause it's no fun being an undocumented worker". It just doesn't flow.

#26 Zwolf

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Posted 19 October 2006 - 12:46 PM

Yeah, I don't like calling them "immigrants."  Immigrants follow the law and take the necessary steps to move here legally and become good, productive citizens.

We should call these border-jumpers what they are - invaders.   And if they don't like "illegal," then "criminal" will work.  

Trespassing invader.

Or, "nation rapist."  Yeah, that kinda works.

If they don't like being called illegal aliens, then don't change the word;  the word isn't the problem, because, whatever you call it, the lousy situation will still the the same.  If you don't want to be illegal, then do what many of this country's greatest citizens did - take the proper steps, do the work, and come here legally.  Problem solved!

Cheers,

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#27 JamesValEson

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 08:56 AM

View PostLife for Rent, on Oct 19 2006, 12:18 PM, said:

View PostLin731, on Oct 18 2006, 03:41 PM, said:

I so love PC crap, especially when it's pulled into service to try and not describe an action for what it is. If you came into the US from another country, you're an alien. If you came into this country without a visa, you are here illegally. Put the two together and what do ya get? Illegal alien. A drug dealer or a Pimp can call him/herself an Entrepeneur but there still just a drug dealer or pimp. A hooker can call themselves a hospitality associate/facilitater but their still just a hooker. God forbid we call things what they are, lest we offend those millions that came here via breaking US law and now lower our wage scales and suck up or social services. :crazy:  I have a solution to their oppression and hurt feelings....GO HOME.


What Lin said.  I agree.  I'm liberal as hell but I do have a degree of nationalism.  And it does under cut Americans citizens ability to get fair wages when employers can hire cheap labor.  The Mexicans just want a better life but coming here won't fix their country.  At some point somebody has to stand up and make the necessary changes but instead they come here and so Mexico's government stays corrupt.  

Although the subject of this thread is based on what hispanic journalists want done, I have to say, I think Canada should be thrown into the mix.  All we ever hear about is Mexicans but their are a few of them violating the borders too.


I agree fully with your assertion that Mexican need to change their country. If these people would put as much into change in their country as they put into making us accept the Illeagal, then Mexico would be on par with us, and not just leeching off of us. We shouldn't have to prop them up just because they want to take the easy way out (and jumping ship instead of trying to fix it before it sinks IS the easy way out, to those who may not agree).


Besides, we all saw just how much alot of these people wanted to 'assimilate' when they waved Mexican flags at all those rallys earlier this year, not to mention the post office where agroup of illegals raised a Mexican flag after removing the American one.

Barry

edited quote at request of original poster--QT

Edited by QueenTiye, 26 March 2007 - 09:42 AM.

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#28 Themis

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 04:52 PM

View PostLife for Rent, on Oct 19 2006, 05:18 PM, said:

And it does under cut Americans citizens ability to get fair wages when employers can hire cheap labor.  The Mexicans just want a better life but coming here won't fix their country.  At some point somebody has to stand up and make the necessary changes but instead they come here and so Mexico's government stays corrupt.

Preach it!!!!

As to Canadians, I don't know why they'd want to come here unless they just want a warmer climate (or are up to no good, of course).  The Canadian economy's good, they've got universal healthcare, etc. etc.  At least (unless it was somebody from Quebec who didn't speak English) a Canadian doesn't present the vast language, education and cultural differences we have with those coming illegally from south of our border.  There doesn't seem to be a Canadian movement to force Americans to say "oot" instead of "out."   Most speak English.  They aren't making slave wages at home.  So if there's any kind of illegal immigration from Canada happening, I don't have that much of a problem with it.  Yes, it would still be illegal, but it wouldn't have nearly the consequences.  I'm not going to worry about it.

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#29 SparkyCola

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 06:07 PM

Nation rapist? Let's not get carried away! lol. Whatever next.

If it's not a legal matter but a civil matter how about 'uncivil immigrants' ? hehe. civil violation immigrants is a bit too longwinded, as is undocumented immigrants - blimey. Just do what us Computer Scientists do when this sort of problem occurs. Start to call them CVIs. Civil violation immigrants.

CVIs. Problem solved!

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#30 SparkyCola

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 06:08 PM

Quote

Yes, it would still be illegal, but it wouldn't have nearly the consequences. I'm not going to worry about it.

I appreciate that you explained your reasoning there - but there still seems to me to be a slight double standard there, somehow...

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#31 Themis

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 06:27 PM

If someone can point me to some statistics and then to what damage a few (?) illegal Canadians are doing the US, I could reconsider.  But there's "illegal," like doing 48 in a 45-mile zone and "illegal," like doing 80 in a 45-mph zone. There's "illegal" like marijuana for medical or casual smoking use - growing, using or selling -  and "illegal" like selling coke in vast quantities to do some real damage.   Or like flooding the country with immigrants who don't speak and don't learn English and most of their earnings to another country and want us to conform to their language and standards...  Whether I worry about it or not is a matter of degree and how much damage is done to the population at large.  Some things are not worth the time and effort to prosecute in favor of prosecuting stuff that does significant damage.

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#32 SparkyCola

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 06:33 PM

I can't help thinking that you have to draw the line somewhere, in which case, the line is drawn. If that makes sense.

I was under the impression that Mexico is not such a rich country as Canada- rather, the kind of country people might want to get out of. Canada on the other hand - surely they have little excuse for becoming CVIs when they could very easily become Civil immigrants?

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#33 Themis

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 06:44 PM

View PostSparkyCola, on Oct 20 2006, 11:33 PM, said:

I can't help thinking that you have to draw the line somewhere, in which case, the line is drawn. If that makes sense.

I was under the impression that Mexico is not such a rich country as Canada- rather, the kind of country people might want to get out of. Canada on the other hand - surely they have little excuse for becoming CVIs when they could very easily become Civil immigrants?

Sparky

That's pretty much what I said.  Which is why I'd like to see some statistics.
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#34 SparkyCola

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 06:58 PM

What I meant was that, regardless of how many Canadians there are, versus how many Mexicans - they should be treated equally, rather than let off the Canadians because they have more in common with the Americans. :unsure:

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#35 Mel

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 07:29 PM

View PostSparkyCola, on Oct 20 2006, 06:58 PM, said:

What I meant was that, regardless of how many Canadians there are, versus how many Mexicans - they should be treated equally, rather than let off the Canadians because they have more in common with the Americans. :unsure:

Sparky
I can't speak for what Themis meant of course, but I don't think anyone's arguing for treating any illegal Canadian immigrants we happen to find differently.   It's just that as a practical matter, our focus needs to be on preventing and dealing with the flood of illegals across the Mexican border rather than the trickle across the Canadian side.   Whatever illegal Canadian immigrants there are will presumably blend in easier thanks to the common language, small numbers, etc.   Should we focus our resources on trying to track down that handful or deal with the large numbers that are, at least in the Southwestern states, having a large and visible impact on the economy, the education system and the healthcare system?   Additionally, the protests by illegal Mexican immigrants have kind of annoyed a lot of people (at least here in TX), so, rightly or wrongly people just aren't going to get as worked up about the idea of an illegal immigrant from Canada.

#36 Mark

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 07:32 PM

View PostMel, on Oct 20 2006, 07:29 PM, said:

View PostSparkyCola, on Oct 20 2006, 06:58 PM, said:

What I meant was that, regardless of how many Canadians there are, versus how many Mexicans - they should be treated equally, rather than let off the Canadians because they have more in common with the Americans. :unsure:

Sparky
I can't speak for what Themis meant of course, but I don't think anyone's arguing for treating any illegal Canadian immigrants we happen to find differently.   It's just that as a practical matter, our focus needs to be on preventing and dealing with the flood of illegals across the Mexican border rather than the trickle across the Canadian side.   Whatever illegal Canadian immigrants there are will presumably blend in easier thanks to the common language, small numbers, etc.   Should we focus our resources on trying to track down that handful or deal with the large numbers that are, at least in the Southwestern states, having a large and visible impact on the economy, the education system and the healthcare system?   Additionally, the protests by illegal Mexican immigrants have kind of annoyed a lot of people (at least here in TX), so, rightly or wrongly people just aren't going to get as worked up about the idea of an illegal immigrant from Canada.

Mark: Yes, the real problem currently lies with illegals from Mexico...not Canada.
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#37 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 20 October 2006 - 10:33 PM

View PostAnastashia, on Oct 18 2006, 06:55 PM, said:

I'm all for dropping the PC stuff, but you all are brutal.

Thank you.

I call em like I see em. If it's brutal, then so be it.
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#38 SparkyCola

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Posted 22 October 2006 - 07:37 AM

Quote

I can't speak for what Themis meant of course, but I don't think anyone's arguing for treating any illegal Canadian immigrants we happen to find differently. It's just that as a practical matter, our focus needs to be on preventing and dealing with the flood of illegals across the Mexican border rather than the trickle across the Canadian side. Whatever illegal Canadian immigrants there are will presumably blend in easier thanks to the common language, small numbers, etc. Should we focus our resources on trying to track down that handful or deal with the large numbers that are, at least in the Southwestern states, having a large and visible impact on the economy, the education system and the healthcare system? Additionally, the protests by illegal Mexican immigrants have kind of annoyed a lot of people (at least here in TX), so, rightly or wrongly people just aren't going to get as worked up about the idea of an illegal immigrant from Canada.

Fair enough. Thanks for the explanation :)

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#39 Bobby

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Posted 22 October 2006 - 08:33 AM

View PostMark, on Oct 20 2006, 07:32 PM, said:

View PostMel, on Oct 20 2006, 07:29 PM, said:

View PostSparkyCola, on Oct 20 2006, 06:58 PM, said:

What I meant was that, regardless of how many Canadians there are, versus how many Mexicans - they should be treated equally, rather than let off the Canadians because they have more in common with the Americans. :unsure:

Sparky
I can't speak for what Themis meant of course, but I don't think anyone's arguing for treating any illegal Canadian immigrants we happen to find differently.   It's just that as a practical matter, our focus needs to be on preventing and dealing with the flood of illegals across the Mexican border rather than the trickle across the Canadian side.   Whatever illegal Canadian immigrants there are will presumably blend in easier thanks to the common language, small numbers, etc.   Should we focus our resources on trying to track down that handful or deal with the large numbers that are, at least in the Southwestern states, having a large and visible impact on the economy, the education system and the healthcare system?   Additionally, the protests by illegal Mexican immigrants have kind of annoyed a lot of people (at least here in TX), so, rightly or wrongly people just aren't going to get as worked up about the idea of an illegal immigrant from Canada.

Mark: Yes, the real problem currently lies with illegals from Mexico...not Canada.

Oh, yes, it's so much easier to spot the brown ones, isn't it. I don't appreciate the wetback comments up thread either.  Illegal is illegal.  I'm sick of Canadians telling us how we should feel.  Case in point, the late great Peter Jennings making so that Toby Keith couldn't sing his song on the 4th of July celebration a few years back.  Truth be told my politics ran in line with Peter Jennings and I don't think Toby Keith should have been singing it because it was in bad taste. But at the same time it wasn't his place to be telling an American what not to sing and having him blocked.  Peter Jennings went decades without becoming a citizen of the U.S but not long after that he got his papers, although he was here legally, you have to give him that.  And you can claim Canadians aren't taking jobs because they are from more developed countries but the truth of the matter is they take the higher paying jobs.  The Mexicans are taking the lower paying jobs that a good portion of us think we're above doing because we're a college eduction level nation now.   Some things are just beneath us and that's why the next century belongs to China.

My liberalism comes back into play because Mexicans are exploited because they will work for lower wages.  And American's won't take those jobs that pay those lower wages because a person really can't afford to live off them.  So thanks to the cheap illegal immigrant labor the employers don't have to pay what amounts to a living wage.  

My nationalism comes back into play when there here illegally, send them home.  But if anyone comes legally come one and come all, whether they speak a lick of English or not.   Lord knows enough U.S. citizens mutilate the English language daily.  

Canada is a bilingual nation and it works and they seem to be able to get along well.  There a lot of things to admire about Canada.  But saying they blend in really drives home the point, you really don't know how many of them are here for that reason.  Illegal is illegal.   Rounding up the ones you can see because they are brown, is what?   My nephews are U.S. citizens and you can imagine the nine kinds of hell anyone will catch from me if they try to racial profile them.

Edited at request of original poster

Edited by QueenTiye, 26 March 2007 - 09:47 AM.


#40 Rhea

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Posted 22 October 2006 - 11:24 AM

View PostLife for Rent, on Oct 22 2006, 06:33 AM, said:

My liberalism comes back into play because Mexicans are exploited because they will work for lower wages.  And American's won't take those jobs that pay those lower wages because a person really can't afford to live off them.  So thanks to the cheap illegal immigrant labor the employers don't have to pay what amounts to a living wage.  

My nationalism comes back into play when there here illegally, send them home.  But if anyone comes legally come one and come all, whether they speak a lick of English or not.   Lord knows enough U.S. citizens mutilate the English language daily.

Agreed.

And I'm the one who used the word "wetback" up thread, and I was joking. :sarcasm:

And it was not originally a pejorative - it was originally a literal description of folks from Mexico who swam the Rio Grande to enter the country illegally. I'm glad it's not used any more (although it was still in use when I was a girl, back in the Bronze Age ;) ).

The whole point I was originally making is that "illegal immigrants" is perfectly PC because it describes a group of people who are in this country....well...illegally. And I'm all for us letting in anyone who wants to immigrate legally.

The illegal immigrant population in California may support the growers, but in many other ways they're draining my state dry. Hospitals are closing because, instead of going to the many free clinics available in this state, illegal immigrants are using emergency rooms like clinics and racking up bills they're never going to pay. We are educating their children, paying their medical bills, their special ed kids are getting Social Security disability - the list is endless. They get free legal aid, social workers, translators, day care - all at no cost to them, funded by the state and the Feds. Many if not most illegal immigrants don't pay into the system they're drawing from.

Which is why I wish Congress would get over themselves and get a policy in place post haste to deal with them. Make 'em legal, send 'em home, give 'em temporary work cards - whatever.  Just fix the situation so that they're not pulling out of a system they're not paying into.

Edited by Rhea, 22 October 2006 - 11:24 AM.

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