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Truck Wheels: Budd vs. Dayton


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#1 Vapor Trails

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Posted 03 December 2006 - 10:53 AM

You all have seen these types of wheels on the roads every day. :)

Budd-type wheels:

Posted Image

Dayton-type wheels:

Posted Image

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There are two basic types of wheel/rim systems. Vehicles that have spoke wheels have the wheels "permanently" (they aren't removed when the tire is changed) attached to the vehicle. Tires are mounted on rims that have no center discs. These rims slip over the spokes and are clamped to the spokes of the wheels. These wheel/rim systems are called spoke wheel/demountable rim systems.

The second major system type is the disc wheel system. Here, the rim is permanently welded to a wheel with a disc in the center containing a mounting face with a bolt hole circle. This wheel is bolted onto the vehicle with studs that are inserted through holes in the hub, brake drum and wheel and fastened with lug nuts. When a tire is changed, the whole wheel is removed from the vehicle and then the tire is removed from the rim.

There are two types of disc wheels -- hub-piloted and stud-piloted. Hub-piloted disc wheels are designed to center on the hub at the center hole of the wheel. The wheel center hole locates the wheel on pilots built into the hub. Hub-piloted wheels are used with two-piece flange nuts which contact the disc face around the bolt hole. Only one nut on each stud is used to fasten single or dual wheels to a vehicle.

Stud-piloted disc wheels are designed to be centered by the nuts on the studs. The seating action of the ball seat nuts in the ball seat bolt holes centers the wheels. Stud-piloted dual wheels require inner and outer cap nuts. Steer/single wheels are attached with outer cap nuts only. This system is 30 or 40 years older than the hub-piloted system.

Rims for spoke wheels are generally referred to as "Daytons" since Dayton was a big manufacturer of spoke wheel/demountable rim systems. Stud-piloted disc wheels are commonly referred to as "Budds" since The Budd Corp. was the first to come out with these wheels. You hear hub-piloted disc wheels called "Unimounts" which is what Motor Wheel called their wheel when they first introduced hub-piloted wheels in the early 1980s.


This has been a fascination for me since childhood. Every kind of large truck uses either Daytons or Budds. I must tell you-the Budd company must be INCREDIBLY rich from the patent on their design, since it's used in every kind of variation all over the world, on trucks and buses, large and small. You simply can't get away from it. :)

The Daytons seem to be relegated to mostly trucks-and in the United States, the only kind of bus that uses Dayton wheels are school buses. I have never seen Dayton wheels used on commercial buses in the U.S., and it is a big mystery to me as why this is.  :blink:  Does anyone know?  :unsure:

These two seem to be the industry standard. Most trucks use either one type or the other, although I've seen trucks that mix both-though more often than not, the Daytons usually end up being used in the rear, with Budd type wheels in the front.

Fun stuff. :D

Edited by Digital Man, 03 December 2006 - 10:57 AM.

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#2 Mark

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Posted 04 December 2006 - 07:23 PM

Mark: I must admit to not understanding what makes the wheel business turn.  :D
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#3 brighty

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Posted 24 June 2010 - 06:46 AM

View PostAnalog Kid, on 03 December 2006 - 10:53 AM, said:

You all have seen these types of wheels on the roads every day. :)

Budd-type wheels:

Posted Image

Dayton-type wheels:

Posted Image

Roadstar Online

Quote

There are two basic types of wheel/rim systems. Vehicles that have spoke wheels have the wheels "permanently" (they aren't removed when the tire is changed) attached to the vehicle. Tires are mounted on rims that have no center discs. These rims slip over the spokes and are clamped to the spokes of the wheels. These wheel/rim systems are called spoke wheel/demountable rim systems.

The second major system type is the disc wheel system. Here, the rim is permanently welded to a wheel with a disc in the center containing a mounting face with a bolt hole circle. This wheel is bolted onto the vehicle with studs that are inserted through holes in the hub, brake drum and wheel and fastened with lug nuts. When a tire is changed, the whole wheel is removed from the vehicle and then the tire is removed from the rim.

There are two types of disc wheels -- hub-piloted and stud-piloted. Hub-piloted disc wheels are designed to center on the hub at the center hole of the wheel. The wheel center hole locates the wheel on pilots built into the hub. Hub-piloted wheels are used with two-piece flange nuts which contact the disc face around the bolt hole. Only one nut on each stud is used to fasten single or dual wheels to a vehicle.

Stud-piloted disc wheels are designed to be centered by the nuts on the studs. The seating action of the ball seat nuts in the ball seat bolt holes centers the wheels. Stud-piloted dual wheels require inner and outer cap nuts. Steer/single wheels are attached with outer cap nuts only. This system is 30 or 40 years older than the hub-piloted system.

Rims for spoke wheels are generally referred to as "Daytons" since Dayton was a big manufacturer of spoke wheel/demountable rim systems. Stud-piloted disc wheels are commonly referred to as "Budds" since The Budd Corp. was the first to come out with these wheels. You hear hub-piloted disc wheels called "Unimounts" which is what Motor Wheel called their wheel when they first introduced hub-piloted wheels in the early 1980s.


This has been a fascination for me since childhood. Every kind of large truck uses either Daytons or Budds. I must tell you-the Budd company must be INCREDIBLY rich from the patent on their design, since it's used in every kind of variation all over the world, on trucks and buses, large and small. You simply can't get away from it. :)

The Daytons seem to be relegated to mostly trucks-and in the United States, the only kind of bus that uses Dayton wheels are school buses. I have never seen Dayton wheels used on commercial buses in the U.S., and it is a big mystery to me as why this is.  :blink:  Does anyone know?  :unsure:

These two seem to be the industry standard. Most trucks use either one type or the other, although I've seen trucks that mix both-though more often than not, the Daytons usually end up being used in the rear, with Budd type wheels in the front.

Fun stuff. :D


#4 brighty

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Posted 24 June 2010 - 06:55 AM

I did notice on very old city transit busses, many had dayton spoke hubs. When I used to drive a truck, both semi trailer and straight, many fleets were set up with budd wheels on the steer axle and dayton hubs on the drive tandems. Sometimes the opposite, daytons on the steer and budds on the drives. Why a fleet would be set up like this I don't know. The company that I drove for had all steel or aluminum budds. A tire mechanic told me that the problem with daytons on the dual drives especially, that you have to get those claw spokes and shackles just right with the impact werench when you reinstall a new set of tires. He said that you can see the bad result if you look at some of these trash trucks and dump trucks as they go down the road and the wheels wobble. He said that's because who ever put on the new tires did not true them up properly. He said it takes patience and care to do it properly

#5 Vapor Trails

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Posted 24 June 2010 - 07:56 AM

View Postbrighty, on 24 June 2010 - 06:55 AM, said:

I did notice on very old city transit busses, many had dayton spoke hubs. When I used to drive a truck, both semi trailer and straight, many fleets were set up with budd wheels on the steer axle and dayton hubs on the drive tandems. Sometimes the opposite, daytons on the steer and budds on the drives. Why a fleet would be set up like this I don't know. The company that I drove for had all steel or aluminum budds. A tire mechanic told me that the problem with daytons on the dual drives especially, that you have to get those claw spokes and shackles just right with the impact werench when you reinstall a new set of tires. He said that you can see the bad result if you look at some of these trash trucks and dump trucks as they go down the road and the wheels wobble. He said that's because who ever put on the new tires did not true them up properly. He said it takes patience and care to do it properly

Thanks for bumping this old thread! :D I was a bit disappointed it didn't get more traction. :( ;)

I wonder if it's because Budds are more aesthetically pleasing than Daytons-because all I see are Budds on transit buses in my area. :whatsthat:

As for the trucks that mixed Dayton/Budd hubs the way you mentioned, yeah-I see those every day-though it's very rare for me to see Daytons on the steer and Budds on the drives. I hear that Daytons are really good for sustaining very heavy weights.
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#6 Orpheus

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Posted 24 June 2010 - 11:04 PM

I  have nothing to add, but I love this thread.

#7 Vapor Trails

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Posted 24 June 2010 - 11:19 PM

Orph,

Budd wheels are SO ubiquitous-they're worse than Tribbles! They are one of those things that you see EVERYWHERE in every-day life, but never give much thought to. I'm nerdy, so I did think about it: why are they SO popular?

The Budd company invented these wheels around the early 1920s(?), so this is a technology that is 80-90 years old. If they have the patent on this design, I'd wager that a huge chunk of their fortune came from these wheels. They are truly EVERYWHERE.
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Politicians are like bananas; they hang together, they're all yellow, and there's not a straight one among them.

"We're relevant for $ and a vote once every two years. Beyond that, we're completely irrelevant, except of course to consume, and preach the gospel according to [insert political demigod here]."--Cait

#8 dumpfixxer

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 09:12 AM

the diffrent styles each have thier pros and cons. in the field daytons are way easier to change, requiring only a half inch impact wrench, and a 1.25 in socket, but they are heavier and take away from the tonnage you can haul. personally, i love dayton style rims because i have to change many tires in a weeks time. buds are lighter, but require a one inch impact, and sometimes an inner and outer nut and stud removed to dismount the rims on older lug piloted rims . that and a lot of air pressure. they are run on from 400 to 800 ft lbs

#9 Vapor Trails

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Posted 28 June 2012 - 04:12 PM

Welcome to the board dumpfixxer! :) It's a cool thing to see this old thread bumped-particularly since budd & dayton wheels are among the most ubiquitous things in existence, yet there is little discussion about them. I tried doing some research on when budd wheels first came into being and who designed them (My guess iw that they made their first appearance around the early 1920s). They must have made a KILLING from the patent!! :eek3:

Edited by Vapor Trails, 28 June 2012 - 04:13 PM.

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Politicians are like bananas; they hang together, they're all yellow, and there's not a straight one among them.

"We're relevant for $ and a vote once every two years. Beyond that, we're completely irrelevant, except of course to consume, and preach the gospel according to [insert political demigod here]."--Cait




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