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Internet Addiction Treated with Electric Shocks

Health Addiction 2007

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#1 Caithness

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Posted 22 February 2007 - 04:41 PM

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DAXING, China - Sun Jiting spends his days locked behind metal bars in this military-run installation, put there by his parents. The 17-year-old high school student is not allowed to communicate with friends back home, and his only companions are psychologists, nurses and other patients. Each morning at 6:30, he is jolted awake by a soldier in fatigues shouting, "This is for your own good!"

Sun's offense: Internet addiction.

Alarmed by a survey that found that nearly 14 percent of teens in China are vulnerable to becoming addicted to the Internet, the Chinese government has launched a nationwide campaign to stamp out what the Communist Youth League calls "a grave social problem" that threatens the nation.
About the 'clinic' in Daxing:

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Led by Tao Ran, a military researcher who built his career by treating heroin addicts, the clinic uses a tough-love approach that includes counseling, military discipline, drugs, hypnosis and mild electric shocks.

Tao said the clinic is based on the idea that there are many similarities between his current patients and those he had in the past.

In terms of withdrawal: "If you let someone go online and then he can't go online, you may see a physical reaction, just like someone coming off drugs."




full article

China will find any excuse to incarcerate people.

Edited by Caithness, 22 February 2007 - 04:44 PM.

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#2 The Oncoming Storm

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Posted 22 February 2007 - 06:51 PM

The Chinese gov't will find any excuse to not only incarcerate people, but they'll try to find any way they can to keep them from seeing what else is said out there.  With the Communist gov't in China, they've followed Stalin's model of trying to control a lot of what people see or hear in order to influence how they think.  This only, in my mind, fits their mold.

Rose: [disgusted] Oh, look at what the cat dragged in: "The Oncoming Storm."

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#3 Shadowfire

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 10:02 AM

I don't post in the OT ever, but this a special case.

The Chinese government have come up with a petty decent idea in my eyes. Internet addiction is a serious problem without an effective treatment. I only wish the British government were this vicious about treating psychological problems.

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View PostRobL, on Jul 20 2009, 06:35 PM, said:

Every time I see a political thread I fondle myself just a little bit.............

'I honestly cannot justify that. You see, advertising isn't an art. Appealing to the English? Use someone from Hollyoaks and diss United. Scots? Talk about how evil Thatcher was. SNP is awesome etc. Americans? Well they be thick as sh*t so short sentences and shiny things and some Jesus helps too.. French and Germans? Talk about the war. Irish? f*ck that we can't sell sh*t in Ireland. That's frankly how it all works. So what I'm trying to say is that I'm happy you're dumping all this cash into advertising... I honestly don't see what you want me to do with it.  And also, that blip in the records in June was me buying monitors.-- never ask me to be 'brutally honest' about a budget.

You of course realise that anything you post here is comprised of ASCII characters? Each character is 7 bits with a parity bit making 8... I guess that's fairly meaningless to you which is actually the point. At most your sentence is a few kilobytes and considering I'm doing a file transfer of over a billion bytes right now those bytes making up your words are invisible with their insignificance, which is exact what I think of your post. Insignificant.

#4 Caithness

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 10:15 AM

As some one with several diagnosed psychological problems, I'd like to say that electric shock therapy isn't the way to go.  Therapy, maybe, but there's a reason they don't shock people much any more.  It hurts more than it helps.
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#5 SparkyCola

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 10:50 AM

I don't agree with the generalisations about China - but as I understand it Electric Shock Therapy has some appalling side effects that can end up worse than what they were being treated for.

I can't imagine that Internet Addiction is so severe that it needs this last-last-LAST resort treatment to cure it.

Another thing that creeps me out is the military discipline approach. It really freaks me out. Seriously. You see these kids that are misbehaving, go to a military school and come back well disciplined. And a completely different person. A standard one-size-fits-all regular army cadet. That ain't right. I've seen chatbots with more life. To be honest though I'm pretty biased - if I had to train in an army camp - I would probably end up severely depressed.

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#6 Caithness

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 10:52 AM

Read up on the laogai.  Sadly, they're not generalizations.  The thought police are waiting to get you.
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#7 The Oncoming Storm

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 11:08 AM

View PostSparkyCola, on Feb 23 2007, 09:50 AM, said:

I don't agree with the generalisations about China - but as I understand it Electric Shock Therapy has some appalling side effects that can end up worse than what they were being treated for.

I can't imagine that Internet Addiction is so severe that it needs this last-last-LAST resort treatment to cure it.

Another thing that creeps me out is the military discipline approach. It really freaks me out. Seriously. You see these kids that are misbehaving, go to a military school and come back well disciplined. And a completely different person. A standard one-size-fits-all regular army cadet. That ain't right. I've seen chatbots with more life. To be honest though I'm pretty biased - if I had to train in an army camp - I would probably end up severely depressed.

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I don't advocate the electro-shock torture threapy, but the military-like discipline I've seen.  There's a program down here on The Island that students can enter voluntarily.  It's for students that don't do well in traditional school.  The Seabourne Program, a military-based school program run in conjunction with a local reserve unit down here has a very successful track record.  My principal worked as an instructor in the program for a while before he came here.  We've had a couple of students go there and they turned out for the better.  I think that students/teens who know they don't have discipline but want it can find those programs very helpful in their attempt to build a successful life.  For those who are pushed into by parents that are frustrated due to their kid's lack of discipline, it can seriously backfire.  

What China is doing with it is something totally sinster in that they're making it a tool of oppression and abuse.  What the voluntarily entered programs do is give a kids a chance to build a sense of pride and self-respect at actually accomplishing something, instead of vegging around in front of a TV/Game Console and going brain dead.

Rose: [disgusted] Oh, look at what the cat dragged in: "The Oncoming Storm."

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." -- John Wayne


Sometimes the best causes worth fighting for are lost causes. -- Me.

Formerly Known as "Lost Cause."


#8 Shadowfire

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 11:18 AM

View PostSparkyCola, on Feb 23 2007, 03:50 PM, said:

I can't imagine that Internet Addiction is so severe that it needs this last-last-LAST resort treatment to cure it.


Let me tell you a story, its about a 20 year old girl named Sally (not her real name).

Sally was exceptionally bright and then some. She had 9 A's in GCSE and 3 A*'s. She completed 4 A-levels and got 3 A's and a B. Cambridge was begging her to study there, MIT were extremely interested in her. She had offers from all the best universities in the UK. Sally was also one of the most popular people around, everyone loved her because she was kind, generous and always willing to help out. She broke her phone once because she had too many names/numbers stored on it.

Then one day, Sally discovered LiveJournal. She started spending more and more time with LiveJournal than she did with her friends. Soon she started spending entire days on her computer without moving or eating. She flunked out of uni, lost all her friends and became a social disaster,

When Sally's parents had her computer cut of from the internet, she punched out the person who removed her network card and attacked her Dad. In the week after that she attempted suicide 3 times. She was committed to a psychiatric hospital a month later. I will not go into the treatments used.

That was two years ago, Sally is much better now but is a shadow of what she once was. She isn't allowed to use a computer for more than 30 minutes. She cries regularity, has practically no social skills and is unable to live on her own at the moment (she is getting better very very slowly so hope is not lost).

Sally is my cousin. She almost broke my nose for taking out her network card, we used to be best friends.


Any effective treatment for Internet Addiction is okay by me.


Edit: I'd like to add that there is nothing wrong with LiveJournal. If this happened today, I'm sure it would have been MySpace.

Edited by Shadowfire, 23 February 2007 - 11:34 AM.

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View PostRobL, on Jul 20 2009, 06:35 PM, said:

Every time I see a political thread I fondle myself just a little bit.............

'I honestly cannot justify that. You see, advertising isn't an art. Appealing to the English? Use someone from Hollyoaks and diss United. Scots? Talk about how evil Thatcher was. SNP is awesome etc. Americans? Well they be thick as sh*t so short sentences and shiny things and some Jesus helps too.. French and Germans? Talk about the war. Irish? f*ck that we can't sell sh*t in Ireland. That's frankly how it all works. So what I'm trying to say is that I'm happy you're dumping all this cash into advertising... I honestly don't see what you want me to do with it.  And also, that blip in the records in June was me buying monitors.-- never ask me to be 'brutally honest' about a budget.

You of course realise that anything you post here is comprised of ASCII characters? Each character is 7 bits with a parity bit making 8... I guess that's fairly meaningless to you which is actually the point. At most your sentence is a few kilobytes and considering I'm doing a file transfer of over a billion bytes right now those bytes making up your words are invisible with their insignificance, which is exact what I think of your post. Insignificant.

#9 D.Rabbit

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 11:32 AM

Nothing like making sure people don't arm themselves with information.
Keep 'em ignorant and keep them in line/off line and you have heaven on earth.

The problem with that, is that heaven is boring and not necessarily conducive to creativity. I think any one subject to this type of discipline/torture will in the future have the right to sue.

China is trying very hard to keep it's people ignorant of what is going on in the rest of the world, that's why they have so many proxy servers coming on line everyday. It's a losing battle and I for one think that Draconian governments are only kidding themselves.

When I found myself addicted to the web, it was mostly the social interaction that was the addictive part. Locking me in a cell would have done nothing to help me. I cured myself by becoming more social in the neighborhood and limiting my time to after work.

What they might have done with the patient is sign him up for sports or art classes. No one ever imprisoned someone for kicking a ball around or painting pretty pictures, which can be just as addictive as the internet.
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#10 The Oncoming Storm

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 01:01 PM

The biggest problem I have is that the Chinese gov't is declaring this addicition (and buddy, that runs in my family hard and strong--all forms of addictions; hell, I'm a go-getter for new and exciting things) must be treated with electro-shock therapy, a form of therapy that the vast majority of medical world seems to be saying is the absolute, against the wall, last resort of all therapies.  Let's flip this:

I love Greek.  I could read it all day long and forget the rest of the world.  I've read as many as 40 verses of the Greek New Testament in one day.  Also, I'm teaching myself Homeric Greek; I've learned that my Koine (NT) Greek gives me a leg up on both Homeric and Attic Greek.  I'm planning on studying this the rest of my life, either professionally or personally.  I've been fascinated with the language since I was 11; at 19 I took my first Greek class.  I am a Greek addict.  That addiction would make me subject to such therapy by the Chinese gov't, if I lived there.  (But, then again, they probably would arrest me for possessing a Bible; but, let's play it out this way anyway.)  What bothers me is not what these poor folks are addicted to, it's that the Chinese gov't has decided that the addictionneeds to be dealt with like this.  My love for foreign (dead) languages and my addiction (and it is that) to Greek would put me in a similar boat to those poor folks.  

But, what's even worse, is that we don't know what the Chinese gov't (with their Stalinistic style of governance) qualifies as "addiction."  Is it hardcore, 24/7/365 reading of anything on the internet?  Or is this just an excuse to beat people into line who have looked at sites the Chinest gov't considers anti-revolutionary and seditious?  Given their track-record where human rights are concerned we have to be suspicious.

Rose: [disgusted] Oh, look at what the cat dragged in: "The Oncoming Storm."

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." -- John Wayne


Sometimes the best causes worth fighting for are lost causes. -- Me.

Formerly Known as "Lost Cause."


#11 Mel

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 02:22 PM

For those who didn't read the article, most, if not all of those in the program were put there by their parents not the government.  However, some of them were put there because they spent as many as five hours a week on the internet.  Their parents thought they should spend that time studying.  

There are multiple treatment programs (the article focused on one, but mentioned some others)--some use the electrotherapy, some use drugs (like anti-depressants, anti-anxiety drugs, etc), some use counseling or a mix of all three.  China's government does discourage internet use and is encouraging these centers as the country really doesn't want it's teens and young adults on the internet for a variety of reasons, probably including controlling access to information.  (There's also the focus on schoolwork, etc.)  However, the government has not mandated treatment with electro-shock therapy for internet addiction.  It's just one therapy available to worried families.

Edited by Mel, 23 February 2007 - 02:23 PM.


#12 Caithness

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 02:26 PM

Sally is an extreme case and her internet addiction probably stems from something else psychological.  I believe in finding the root cause and treating people individually- they should be seen by psychiatrists and have treatment plans and rehab-like programs for those with serious problems.  Electroshock is just crazy, imo.  That'll also make you a shell of your former self if it's done enough.
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#13 Raina

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 05:14 AM

View PostSparkyCola, on Feb 23 2007, 08:50 AM, said:

Another thing that creeps me out is the military discipline approach. It really freaks me out. Seriously. You see these kids that are misbehaving, go to a military school and come back well disciplined. And a completely different person. A standard one-size-fits-all regular army cadet. That ain't right. I've seen chatbots with more life. To be honest though I'm pretty biased - if I had to train in an army camp - I would probably end up severely depressed.
I've heard that that can also happen with psychiatric drugs. Though my experience was the complete opposite.  :wacko:

Caithness said:

Sally is an extreme case and her internet addiction probably stems from something else psychological.
Yeah I can't help but wonder if it aggravated an existing condition, or awakened a previously-dormant condition.

Edited by Raina, 24 February 2007 - 05:16 AM.


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#14 Shadowfire

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 08:34 AM

View PostRaina, on Feb 24 2007, 10:14 AM, said:

Caithness said:

Sally is an extreme case and her internet addiction probably stems from something else psychological.
Yeah I can't help but wonder if it aggravated an existing condition, or awakened a previously-dormant condition.

No previous history of any kind of psychological disorder in her or the rest of her family. It's my side of the family that is screwed up.

Edited by Shadowfire, 24 February 2007 - 08:34 AM.

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View PostRobL, on Jul 20 2009, 06:35 PM, said:

Every time I see a political thread I fondle myself just a little bit.............

'I honestly cannot justify that. You see, advertising isn't an art. Appealing to the English? Use someone from Hollyoaks and diss United. Scots? Talk about how evil Thatcher was. SNP is awesome etc. Americans? Well they be thick as sh*t so short sentences and shiny things and some Jesus helps too.. French and Germans? Talk about the war. Irish? f*ck that we can't sell sh*t in Ireland. That's frankly how it all works. So what I'm trying to say is that I'm happy you're dumping all this cash into advertising... I honestly don't see what you want me to do with it.  And also, that blip in the records in June was me buying monitors.-- never ask me to be 'brutally honest' about a budget.

You of course realise that anything you post here is comprised of ASCII characters? Each character is 7 bits with a parity bit making 8... I guess that's fairly meaningless to you which is actually the point. At most your sentence is a few kilobytes and considering I'm doing a file transfer of over a billion bytes right now those bytes making up your words are invisible with their insignificance, which is exact what I think of your post. Insignificant.

#15 SparkyCola

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 05:20 PM

Quote

There's a program down here on The Island that students can enter voluntarily.

It's the voluntary bit - I agree that it's good for kids that don't enjoy academic things to maybe check out the vocational options - but for me? You couldn't PAY me to go into one of those places, and I would seriously resent having it forced upon me. Come to think of it I'd pretty much resent having anything forced upon me :blink:  Basically, I agree, LC ;)


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I can hardly imagine how hard that must have been. Believe me when I say that I sympathise. However - there are electric shock therapy survivor groups out there campaigning to stop it. Often the effects of electric shock therapy are worse than what the person went in for. People lose their memories to the extent they can't recognise their own children.

The thing is that they are turning this whole experience into a nightmare- a form of torture, and I'm not too fond of the "cruel to be kind" treatment when it is forced upon someone. It's the age old ends justifies the means - but I never believed in that. I believe there must be a better way, and if we don't know what it is- then let's start looking for one. Because this involuntary form of torture is not acceptable to me.

A psychiatrist, John Breeding said in his 2003 book that the side side-effects, psychologically, of ECT are:

Quote

1) Suppression of emerging distress material
2) Suppression of ability to heal by emotional release;
3) Creation of emotional distress, including deep feelings of terror and powerlessness;
4) Promotion of human beings in the roles of victims and passive dependents of medical professionals;
5) Confirmation of patients' belief that there is something really wrong with them (shame)."

I'm sorry that that happened to you and your cousin, and if you want me to shut up about it just ask and I will. :(

LC- man cannot live by Greek alone...uh...to paraphrase. Would you seriously want to kill yourself without Greek? Or be willing to hurt someone if they took it away?

Quote

However, some of them were put there because they spent as many as five hours a week on the internet. Their parents thought they should spend that time studying.

*shudders* I'm a Christian Computer Scientist...I'm not sure they'd like me over there. I think Mel has outlined an incredibly important point. Five hours a week....I would count that as someone with very little interest in the internet. That is horrifying.

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#16 QueenTiye

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 06:58 PM

I am not always in favor of voluntary entry into rehabilitation programs.  I do think family members ought to have more ability to force their loved ones into treatment for any addiction.  I would have a review panel to review the family's case, and to protect the assets of the addict from family members looking to seize them, but at the same time, family members have a right to be protected FROM addicts ruining the family... including failure to pay bills, etc.  

In the case of internet addiction - there are numerous dangers to the individual that justify the family intervening, and I'm in favor of forced intervention if it has gotten that serious.  

All of which doesn't address the treatment methods at all... just my position that addicts shouldn't have quite as much say as we allow them... if they were in their right minds, they wouldn't be addicts.

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#17 SparkyCola

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 08:09 PM

I understand what you're saying QT- but when families decide 5 hours a WEEK is too much - something is seriously wrong with that system. Like you say - maybe a review panel would do the trick.

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#18 Godeskian

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 09:31 PM

View PostSparkyCola, on Feb 25 2007, 10:20 PM, said:

Quote

However, some of them were put there because they spent as many as five hours a week on the internet. Their parents thought they should spend that time studying.

*shudders* I'm a Christian Computer Scientist...I'm not sure they'd like me over there. I think Mel has outlined an incredibly important point. Five hours a week....I would count that as someone with very little interest in the internet. That is horrifying.

Sparky

I'll second that shudder and raise you a 'hairs on the back of my neck standing up'. I regularly spend more than five hours a day online.

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#19 The Oncoming Storm

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Posted 26 February 2007 - 10:07 AM

View PostSparkyCola, on Feb 25 2007, 04:20 PM, said:

LC- man cannot live by Greek alone...uh...to paraphrase. Would you seriously want to kill yourself without Greek? Or be willing to hurt someone if they took it away?

Firstly, it's not only my fascination and passion, it calms my nerves.  (Mel thinks that's weird.)  Secondly, I would be seriously upset if I couldn't study it (now that I have studied it for 10 years).  But, the thing I was trying to say was this:  My fascination with Greek hurts no one; it enlightens me; it offers me something to share with other willing victims :devil: people.  I still eat; I still sleep (somewhat--not the Greek); and I still function at work (probably what's killing my sleep).  The Greek doesn't dominate me.  And by the sound of it (at 5 hrs a week) I'd say the Internet doesn't dominate those who are defined as "addicts" by the Chinese gov't.  So, comparatively speaking, I probably read about 5 hrs of Greek a week (maybe a little more) these days because of work.  (That reading is probably about to go back through the roof as my procedure draws near.)  So, by the Chinese gov't's definition, I'm an "addict" (I knew that!) and deserve to be treated by electro-shock therapy (dont' think so!).

Rose: [disgusted] Oh, look at what the cat dragged in: "The Oncoming Storm."

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." -- John Wayne


Sometimes the best causes worth fighting for are lost causes. -- Me.

Formerly Known as "Lost Cause."


#20 Mikoto

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Posted 26 February 2007 - 10:38 AM

I'll third that *shudder* because I regularly spend about 2-3 hours a day on the internet and assosiated online games.  :crazy:
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