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First Republican debate tonight

Election 2008 Republican Debate 2007

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#1 Spectacles

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 02:07 PM

Should be interesting. I'm especially curious to see how Ron Paul does.

Any predictions on who will do well and who will bomb?

ETA: Link to MSNBC's politics page. Some interesting stuff there:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032553/

Edited by Spectacles, 03 May 2007 - 02:09 PM.

"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

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#2 Godeskian

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 02:09 PM

I'd be very interested to see how the Repubs handle the topic of Bush. With even some of the republican base deserting him, how each candidate deals with him should be interesting.

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#3 BklnScott

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 02:11 PM

I'll be watching.  My prediction is that Rudy emerges the clear loser -- He may even fall on his face.  I'll be surprised if McCain does well... and if both do badly, that could have a major effect on the landscape, huh?

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#4 Spectacles

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 02:12 PM

Interesting...Joe Scarborough says the Republican candidates should embrace Bush. This is surprising considering Scarborough has been one of Bush's most vocal conservative critics.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18439344/
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#5 Spectacles

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 02:14 PM

I don't have a lot of faith in Rudy, who Peggy Noonan has accused of "winging it" too much. But I'll be surprised if McCain doesn't do well. After all, he has a ton of experience at this sort of thing.

McCain, by the way, is beginning to pass Rudy in the polls and take the front-runner position.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#6 MuseZack

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 02:19 PM

View PostSpectacles, on May 3 2007, 07:12 PM, said:

Interesting...Joe Scarborough says the Republican candidates should embrace Bush. This is surprising considering Scarborough has been one of Bush's most vocal conservative critics.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18439344/

He's right, though.  The Republican primary is all about playing to the base, and the Republican base that gets their news from Fox, Rush, and Drudge still loves Bush and thinks Iraq is peachy keen, if only the liberal media would let us know.  So they have to embrace Bush to win them over.  Unfortunately, the Independents that they need for the general election have definitively turned against Bush.  Many downright hate the guy.  That's the Republican dilemma right now-- how to win over the lunatic base, then pivot to appeal to the center afterwards.  Strangely, that's usually the Democrats' problem, but right now the Dems are fortunate in that most of the country supports their main positions on Iraq and health care.
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#7 Zwolf

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 03:39 PM

If it's going to be about appealing to the base, then prepare to be horrified by Tom Tancredo.  He's a big favorite on RedState and Free Republic, but just about anybody else would be disgusted by the guy, since he's a white supremacist.  Expect him to rant about immigration a lot.

If that guy doesn't get bumped off early, then the GOP is a whole lot sicker place than I'd thought.  There's no way he'll ever win, but it's pretty disturbing that he appeals to anybody at all.  He'll be the "Gravel" of this debate; fringe-pleasing loonie bait.

As for the rest of 'em, I figure that McCain will make a good showing, but I'd never vote for him anymore.  Guiliani's popularity still eludes me... I don't know why anybody likes that guy, I just don't see it.  But, he'll probably lose a lot of points with the base if he's honest at all.  Many of the others I just don't know that much about, honestly...

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#8 Captain Jack

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 05:49 PM

I am so looking forward to this. :cool:
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#9 Cait

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 08:39 PM

Oh dear... I missed half of it.  I'll watch it on line as soon as it gets posted and try and give a report.  Sorry I missed it the first time around.

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#10 QueenTiye

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 09:35 PM

As I said in the previous debate thread - the governors do best, and the republicans have more of them running for office. In the television age, I'm not convinced a Senator can get elected to anything but the executive role best suited for a senator - namely, Vice President.  I can see a Obama Vice Presidency, or a McCain Vice Presidency.  McCain tried to look "presidential" but mostly looked loud.

Of the candidates - I couldn't remember most of their names, but the most impressive candidates were (in order by QT's ranking): Romney, Guiliani, Hucklebee.

Interestingly enough - I liked the prolife stance articulated by some of the candidates, not as an issue of rights or privacy or any of that, but as a national identity articulated from conception to death.  I haven't always liked or agreed with some of what that has meant to the prolife movement, but I certainly like the clarity of vision expressed there. I also continue to appreciate these candidates speaking truthfully about the existence (gasp!) of moderate Muslims in the Muslim world, and the need to work with them.  Unfortunately this group doesn't talk a whole lot about what it wants to accomplish for the country - perhaps that's a conservative thing - they don't believe they should be accomplishing anything FOR the country, but rather defending it?  But in absence of an understanding of what life will look like at home with these guys, it's scary to support them despite liking some of what they had to say.  I'll be looking for more domestic policy from these guys in the coming months, and more foreign policy from the other guys...

I wish that we could merge some of these candidates into one supercandidate.  I didn't agree with any one of them on everything, but agreed with a lot of them on something!

OH! And I kept thinking that maybe I had turned to the wrong channel because I swore that I was seeing Dorcal from BSG in the debate, and also Mary Tyler Moore's husband...:o

QT

Edited by QueenTiye, 03 May 2007 - 09:43 PM.

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#11 QueenTiye

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 10:07 PM

btw - Does anyone have a link to the debate schedule?  I thought I saw one... :unsure:

Nevermind... found it: http://www.baltimore...04/29330005.pdf

QT

Edited by QueenTiye, 03 May 2007 - 10:12 PM.

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#12 MuseZack

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Posted 03 May 2007 - 11:53 PM

After seeing the debate, all I can be is thankful that Huckabee isn't doing better in the primary.  With his avuncular, likeable manner and soothing words about the environment and workers' rights, he's IMO by far the most formidable candidate in the general election.
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#13 Captain Jack

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 12:23 AM

Oh man...where to begin.  I'm still digesting what I saw, but here's a little.

NONE of them want Hillary in the White House-Great.

"Giuliani looks like a mob man" was my mom's reaction about him.

I really was not happy with Giuliani.  He really wants to go to war, and we don't need another president like that.

McCain was pretty good, as was Romney and Brownback (who was one of my favorites of the bunch).

I really didn't like how NONE of them had enough time to really answer the questions.  It felt more like a game show race of some sort.  A wasted golden opportunity for all of them to be in the same place, and really given a decent chance to voice their views.  Same thing with the Democratic debate of last week.
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#14 Rhea

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 04:48 AM

I also disliked Giuliani's response to the question of overturning Roe v. Wade - he basically said it would be ok either way - over turn it, let it stand, whatever...  :wacko:

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With a record of supporting abortion rights, Giuliani was the only candidate who said "it would be OK" if the Supreme Court upholds the landmark ruling. "It would be OK to repeal it. It would be OK also if a strict constructionist viewed it as precedent," he said.

As in, he doesn't really give a crap either way. So much for his pro-choice stance. Somebody should explain to him that he's already taken a stand on the issue, and fence-straddling doesn't make him look attractive.  :blink:  :suspect:  :sarcasm:
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#15 Spectacles

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 06:20 AM

Well, after an hour of hearing "God," "Sanctity of Life," "Strong," and "Ronald Reagan" a thousand times, I fell asleep.

McCain looked like a nervous wreck and punctuated his every utterance with a finger jab and a creepy smile.

Romney was charming and debonair and may the GOP's "Slick Willie."

Huckabee and Brownback reminded me of televangelists. That's apparently a plus for Republicans, but not for me.

Paul was interesting but largely overlooked.

Giuliani seemed like the least ideological, most practical person on the stage, so he's the only one I'd even consider voting for.

Oh, and compared to the Religious Right candidates, Duncan Hunter looked good to me. At one point after an extended bout of "god-life-strong-reagan," Hunter was asked a question and I swear he looked as disgusted as I was and made a point *not* to bang that drum. I appreciated that.

It was fun watching Chris Matthews moderate, though. It was a lot like seeing a debate moderated by the Mad Hatter....
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#16 offworlder

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 09:00 AM

I couldnt watch but I was hearing michael savage having it on his show and ranting in the foreground
;)
he said mccain and hunter came off the best , and for many he said they are Done, Out, Over, including
Giuliani and the evangelist sounding guy.

it is really an appearance fest, how you look, how you come off, can viewers get an impression you are presidential ~ or rather , dont come off as Not Presidential ~ so just don't screw up what you say, and look suave and caring, and smart but not Too smart, and ...

he was going on and on, shouting at Matthews even though he (S) wasnt even there, just shouting on his mic, and saying how these guys shouldnt take this insulting crap from Matthews :)
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#17 QueenTiye

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 09:07 AM

Well - to be fair to the candidates - all the questions were about God, Sanctity of Life, etc.  I found that disappointing, because comparatively, there's just no way to rate this group's performance against the last group's performance.  

Oh - the moderator with the laptop - Jim somethingoranother looked like Hugh Laurie Jr.  

Re: Huckabee - turns out he is a minister by profession! I didn't know that.  But anyway - I did like him a great deal, but I agreed with the call Scarborough made, that Romney won the debate.  I personally found Romney's switch on family issues to be in good conscience, and would like to hear what he'd like to replace Roe v Wade with.  Not sure I got that answer from him, and I'm not convinced that the states rights issue is convincing on this topic.

QT

Edited by QueenTiye, 04 May 2007 - 09:11 AM.

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#18 QueenTiye

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 09:10 AM

View PostSpectacles, on May 4 2007, 07:20 AM, said:

McCain looked like a nervous wreck and punctuated his every utterance with a finger jab and a creepy smile.


Forgot to mention ... yep!  That's absolutely how it came across.  And creepy doesn't even begin to cover it.  My stomach turned watching him.  


QT

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#19 BklnScott

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 09:32 AM

Three of the 10 Republican presidential candidates debating at the Regan Library last night indicated they do not believe in evolution.  

It's hard to tell from the video which three raised their hands, but they have since been identified as Brownback, Trancredo and Huckabee.  McCain (who seems more and more unhinged to me) hesitated before saying "yes," he does believe in evolution.    

Tommy Thompson said he thinks it's just dandy if an employer wants to purge gays from his payroll.

Brownback said the day Roe v Wade gets overturned will be a "glorious day."

"The Iranians looked into Regan's eyes, and two minutes later, released the hostages," pandered Giluiani (who doesn't so much smile as bare his teeth... like a Rottweiler.)

McCain promised that he would pursue bin Laden "to the gates of hell."  Um... I think we can get bin Laden without plunging the United States into the infernal Lake of Fire.  So, y'know, thanks, Ahab, but I think we'll pass on that.

All in all, quite a warm and fuzzy bunch of old white guys, huh?

Edited by ScottEVill, 04 May 2007 - 09:49 AM.

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#20 QueenTiye

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Posted 04 May 2007 - 10:44 AM

Glad you mentioned Guiliani's idiotic claim about getting the hostages in 2 minutes. :Oo:  Ok, I know he didn't mean that, but geez. I think that kinda cheapens Reagan's accomplishment...

QT

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