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It's kid #17 for the Duggars family

Child Birth Duggars kid #17 2007

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#41 Kosh

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Posted 07 August 2007 - 11:46 AM

Meat to add.

I'm number seven of seven, six living. My mother was one of 11, my Dad one of five living in the same house, with two other sibs thaqt we know about, may have been more. My Grandfather Albert got around.
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#42 Nonny

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Posted 08 August 2007 - 09:40 AM

View Postsierraleone, on Aug 6 2007, 06:44 PM, said:

At least they recongise there are limitations.... perhaps it shouldn't but it makes me roll my eyes ;)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20134584/
From the article:  

Quote

When the Duggars were married in 1984 (she was 17 and he was 19), they didnít want children immediately, feeling they could not afford them. After four years, Michelle stopped taking birth control pills to have their first child, then went back on birth control after giving birth.
So she does "believe" in birth control, she just doesn't believe in using it, at least for herself.  (I apparently saw the doesn't believe in bc quote in some other article, which I would cite if I could remember where I saw it and find it again.  Sorry.)  

Quote

When she got pregnant anyway only to suffer a miscarriage, which they attribute to the birth control pills, the couple felt that they had taken a childís life. They prayed for forgiveness and for as many children as God decided to give them.
It worries me that folks this superstitious are home schooling their kids.   :blink:
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#43 Cheile

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Posted 10 August 2007 - 01:10 AM

^ can't send those kids to public school.  God forbid they learn how to interact with anyone outside of that house.

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#44 Enkephalen

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Posted 11 August 2007 - 11:39 AM

I know someone who is the 13th child out of 14 kids total.  His mother died after giving birth to the last child.  He said there was never enough of anything, life was a struggle, and he sorely missed the mom he never knew.  On many occasions the family was threated with living apart because there were so many of them.  The oldest child never really knew the youngest children because as soon as they were old enough they escaped the home, never to return.  The kids basically raised themselves since dad was so busy feeling sorry for himself and his lot in life.  It was a hardship on everyone and everyone suffered because of it.  When grown, none of the children wanted big families, nor did they want their children to have to take on the role of "parent" within their own household.

Kids in large families like the Duggers seem to lose out on being kids.  They have to take on the responsibilities of parenting the younger children, and running the household.  If the parents of large families had to take care of the families as is done in smaller families, I wonder if they would have so many children?

Edited by Enkephalen, 11 August 2007 - 11:09 PM.

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#45 tennyson

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Posted 11 August 2007 - 02:25 PM

Quote

China alone has around 6 billion people, and I think the planet is around 8 billion, maybe more.

No China alone does not have 6 billion people. The total world population is only slightly more than 6 billion. China's population is around 1.2 billion and they apply the most restrictive population control measures of any nation on the planet. They're currently going through the same demographic transition that the US and Europe went through from the late 18th through the beginning of the 20th century. Once thier society transitions thier population should drop significantly. Current United Nations predictions are for the world population to reach a maximum of around 11 billion by 2050 and then start a slow drop. The goal is to manage our resources so that we can reach the point where the demographic transition that has happened in the West happens in more areas of the world.
As it is population pressure varies with the most issues being in the developing nations least able to handle it. In Europe the population of all the EU nations is below replacement levels and even with immigration is declining. The only reason the population in the US has been increasing has been immigration. It's own native birth rate is below replacement. Russia's population has been crash diving for nearly a decade. Japan's population is below replacement. If it weren't for immigration Australia's population would be dropping.
The twin means of sustainable populations and growth are reducing consumption in the develped nations while giving the developed world the tools to manage thier own demographic transitions in a better manner than the intial industrialization wave in the West. This includes a wide range range of things from teaching about and providing effective birth control, giving native populations the incentive and ability to regulate access to thier own resources so they will be able to manage them in a sustainable manner and improving access to improved quality of life by providing the financial resources needed to adopt cleaner technologies as they are developed.
I'd prefer significant expansion of human industry into space myself as well to move a variety of  poluuting industries there as well as power generation but I'm not counting on it.
I'm not with the economists who think that more people is an automatic good thing but I do see solutions for various problems and efforts underway that can if they are applied deal with a significant portion of our climate and pollution issues. I think we still have time as long as we keep developing the tools we'll need to keep going. Commercial space travel and human expansion beyond the Earth is one of many ways to give us breathing room but by no means the only one.
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#46 wiggy

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Posted 11 August 2007 - 02:28 PM

View PostUna Salus Lillius, on Aug 6 2007, 05:41 AM, said:

Yup my grandmother's brother had nine or was it eleven?

My mum is from an Irish Calothic family with 11 brothers and sisters.  My grandad had to work really hard to clothe and feed them but they never went without.

I personally don't want kids neither do a lot of my friends...  I think it kinda balances out.

I think people should be free to do what they want in life as long a it doen't intrude on other peoples freedoms... there are plenty of families in the UK with loads of kids that mooch of the state... it's completely wrong and unfair but what can you do... forcibly sterilize them??

At least these people take care of their kids.

#47 FlatlandDan

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 02:55 AM

I've often thought that birth control should be put in the water and you should have to go to the Doctor to get put a pill to get pregnant.  No comments passed on if you should have a child or not and the pill should be free.  But we're passed the point where people are making sensible choices about having kids.  I'm willing to guess that a lot of young parents would have put off having kids for many more years (possibly never) if the default biological setting was to be on birth control.
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#48 Raina

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Posted 12 August 2007 - 03:26 AM

View PostFlatlandDan, on Aug 12 2007, 12:55 AM, said:

I've often thought that birth control should be put in the water and you should have to go to the Doctor to get put a pill to get pregnant.  No comments passed on if you should have a child or not and the pill should be free.  But we're passed the point where people are making sensible choices about having kids.  I'm willing to guess that a lot of young parents would have put off having kids for many more years (possibly never) if the default biological setting was to be on birth control.
I'm not sure about the whole putting it in the water thing, because what happens if someone has an allergic reaction to the hormones they use? But it would be nice if we could be unable to get pregnant by default and only able to get pregnant by getting a (free) pill, minor procedure, or something else easy and free done. It'd be soooo nice not having to take a pill every day just in case a condom breaks, I get raped, etc.

Edited by Raina, 12 August 2007 - 03:27 AM.


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#49 Anastashia

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Posted 13 August 2007 - 10:52 AM

View Posttennyson, on Aug 11 2007, 03:25 PM, said:

Quote

China alone has around 6 billion people, and I think the planet is around 8 billion, maybe more.

No China alone does not have 6 billion people. The total world population is only slightly more than 6 billion. China's population is around 1.2 billion and they apply the most restrictive population control measures of any nation on the planet. They're currently going through the same demographic transition that the US and Europe went through from the late 18th through the beginning of the 20th century. Once thier society transitions thier population should drop significantly. Current United Nations predictions are for the world population to reach a maximum of around 11 billion by 2050 and then start a slow drop. The goal is to manage our resources so that we can reach the point where the demographic transition that has happened in the West happens in more areas of the world.
As it is population pressure varies with the most issues being in the developing nations least able to handle it. In Europe the population of all the EU nations is below replacement levels and even with immigration is declining. The only reason the population in the US has been increasing has been immigration. It's own native birth rate is below replacement. Russia's population has been crash diving for nearly a decade. Japan's population is below replacement. If it weren't for immigration Australia's population would be dropping.
The twin means of sustainable populations and growth are reducing consumption in the develped nations while giving the developed world the tools to manage thier own demographic transitions in a better manner than the intial industrialization wave in the West. This includes a wide range range of things from teaching about and providing effective birth control, giving native populations the incentive and ability to regulate access to thier own resources so they will be able to manage them in a sustainable manner and improving access to improved quality of life by providing the financial resources needed to adopt cleaner technologies as they are developed.
I'd prefer significant expansion of human industry into space myself as well to move a variety of  poluuting industries there as well as power generation but I'm not counting on it.
I'm not with the economists who think that more people is an automatic good thing but I do see solutions for various problems and efforts underway that can if they are applied deal with a significant portion of our climate and pollution issues. I think we still have time as long as we keep developing the tools we'll need to keep going. Commercial space travel and human expansion beyond the Earth is one of many ways to give us breathing room but by no means the only one.

So it seems you agree with Bread for the World that the planet can sustain us. Your whole post is very well put BTW.

View PostFlatlandDan, on Aug 12 2007, 03:55 AM, said:

I've often thought that birth control should be put in the water and you should have to go to the Doctor to get put a pill to get pregnant.  No comments passed on if you should have a child or not and the pill should be free.  But we're passed the point where people are making sensible choices about having kids.  I'm willing to guess that a lot of young parents would have put off having kids for many more years (possibly never) if the default biological setting was to be on birth control.

That would be religious persecution to many though. I wouldn't want to see us go there. Re the putting it off, there was a lot of press/studies several years ago that it was affecting fertility and that when the older couples wanted to have their kids they couldn't. Then we're into artificial stuff which uses up resources and again leads to problems for many religions. I'd like to be more involved in this conversation but I'm actually on vacation now so don't know when I'll be online again. When I get home, late Thursday, I have appointments all day on Friday (including the refinance closing) plus my laptop is in California (well actually it gets there on Wednesday and they said they needed two weeks) and I'm not sure if the used desktop I got has an ethernet card. I only get 100 free hrs of dialup/month.
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#50 nightfall

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Posted 26 August 2007 - 10:39 PM

As the middle child out of seven, I can tell you that I never felt neglected.  We all felt sorry for the baby of the family because there was a five year break between her and the second youngest.  She missed us all terrible when we went out into the world and she was left home alone with the parents.  

For the first nine years of my life my first cousins lived next store and they had six kids.  We all had a blast!  What a posse we were!  After listening to stories of our youth, one of my cousin's daughters cried and said it wasn't fair......that we had all the fun and her cousins lived too far away!  

About schooling...... every state is different.   Every school system is different.  There are good public school and there are bad public schools.  There are good private schools and there are bad private schools.  There are good catholic schools and there are bad catholic schools.  Even home schooling is different for each state so I don't know what the requirments are for their state.  One of my sisters home schooled her two youngest for their last two years of High School.  (I wouldn't want to do it!  But they were able to do their school work and hold jobs so they could help pay for college!)You have to be an informed parent and do your job and do what you think is best for YOUR child!
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#51 Hibblette

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Posted 29 August 2007 - 11:34 AM

It's their business.  Not mine.
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