Jump to content


Getting an "Insecure Connection" warning for Exisle? No worry

Details in this thread

Teenage Birth Rate Rises for First Time Since ’91

Birth Rate Teenagers Health Pregnancy 2007

  • Please log in to reply
47 replies to this topic

#21 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 08:09 AM

Minimum legal ages are relatively meaningless unless one of the people involved is signifigantly older anyway.

Just because the goverment says 'no sex till 16 (or 18 or whatever) isn't going to stop teenagers from having sex. And I can't imagine many, if any, courts are going to prosecute a pair of 15 year olds, or even a pair of 14 year olds who had consensual sex and got caught.

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#22 Nonny

Nonny

    Scourge of Pretentious Bad Latin

  • Islander
  • 31,142 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 08:26 AM

View PostRhea, on Dec 7 2007, 08:17 PM, said:

View PostJuris Rovvius, on Dec 6 2007, 08:45 AM, said:

Quote

Robert Rector, a senior research fellow with the Heritage Foundation, said that blaming abstinence-only programs was “stupid.” Mr. Rector said that most young women who became pregnant were highly educated about contraceptives but wanted to have babies.

Is there a female in the room who believes this? :sarcasm:
Not me!    :suspect:

Quote

My b*llsh*t meter just broke. :sarcasm:  Teenage girls do not plan to have babies - they screw around and end up with them because they're in a hormone haze and don't use contraception. And some are dumber than dirt and do it multiple times. They're no more intelligent about sex than teenage boys (if possibly not as perpetually horney :p).
Mine too.  If these young women are so highly educated about bc, how did they get their information?  It's not as if kids do extra homework for no credit.    :sarcasm:   As for who's stupid, I'm guessing Mr Pot doesn't have a clue on just how black the Kettles are not.    :whatsthat:

Quote

And I wouldn't have problems with teaching abstinence if ways and means of birth control were also taught. The Pixie is right - they're going to mess around anyway and without being taught ways and means of birth control they're just doing it unprotected. And that's just dandy - get pregnant AND get AIDS.
All that too.  

Why are we up at 5:25 am?  Sigh.   :p
Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#23 Caithness

Caithness

    Nemo me impune lacessit.

  • Islander
  • 4,941 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 08:27 AM

Cuz it's 8:30 in Michigan, silly billy, and I've got an exam today.  Hey you guys, who's Samuel Chase?
Posted Image

#24 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 09:32 AM

Samuel Chase was one of the only Supreme Court justices to be impeached wasn't he? (am trying desperately to remember a US history book I read as a teenager)

As for abstinence, I wouldn't mind if it was taught as part of the package of how to deal with sex as a teenager, but I object to it being taught as the only thing to do, because reality doesn't conform to adults sensibilities about whether kids should or shouldn't have sex.

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#25 Nonny

Nonny

    Scourge of Pretentious Bad Latin

  • Islander
  • 31,142 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 10:13 AM

View PostGodeskian, on Dec 10 2007, 06:32 AM, said:

Samuel Chase was one of the only Supreme Court justices to be impeached wasn't he? (am trying desperately to remember a US history book I read as a teenager)
You know more about him than I do.  I searched on his name and found this interesting article, compliments of the Daughters of the American Revolution.   I'd quote the pertinent information, but it won't let me.  

Quote

As for abstinence, I wouldn't mind if it was taught as part of the package of how to deal with sex as a teenager, but I object to it being taught as the only thing to do, because reality doesn't conform to adults sensibilities about whether kids should or shouldn't have sex.
What Gode said!
Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#26 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 10:37 AM

View PostNonny, on Dec 10 2007, 03:13 PM, said:

You know more about him than I do.  I searched on his name and found this interesting article, compliments of the Daughters of the American Revolution.   I'd quote the pertinent information, but it won't let me.

I had this trio of booklets, one on the executive, one on the legislative and one on the judicial branch, and I vaguely recall the third had a whole chapter dedicated to the fact that while normally a SC justice is a 'for life' appointment, a vanishingly small number of them had been impeached. His name rang a bell.

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#27 szhismine

szhismine

    why must you hurt me in this way Harry...

  • Islander
  • 13,661 posts

Posted 10 December 2007 - 06:00 PM

i feel i should point out that although teenagers under the legal age aren't necessarily responsible, MANY KIDS AREN'T RESPONSIBLE EVEN IF THEY'RE 18 OR OLDER. AND EVEN IF THEY'RE OVER 18 THEY CAN STILL BE UNEDUCATED AND WIND UP PREGNANT.

and, the kids under 18 who actually are responsible (le gasp! that's impossible!) who are having sex (not necessarily "sleeping around") are judged and labeled as irresponsible morons.

sometimes, age shouldn't be counted as most important, but rather someone's actual capacity for judgment. a 15 year old can be smarter and more responsible than any number of 30 year olds.
Neville: "My grandmother forbids me from using raunchy language."
Harry: "Well your grandmother is a Blast-Ended Skank!"
Neville: *GASP*
Hermione: "He doesn't mean it Neville, he's just testing out some wizard swears."
Harry: "I mean every word I ever say ever, because I'm Harry Potter." --'Wizard Swears', Potter Puppet Pals

Hermione: "What's your problem Harry?"
Harry: "My parents are dead, my life sucks, I can't hold down a girlfriend, and I'm surrounded by f*ck*ng goblins and sh*t all the time. I mean what the f*ck?"
Ron: "But it's magic Harry. The goblins are magical!" --'Wizard Angst', Potter Puppet Pals

Me: "It's just a matter of looking past [McKay's] arrogant exterior to see his warm, fuzzy, probably angst-filled interior."
Hawkeye: "You harperchondriac girls think everyone has an angst filled interior."

"Good gods, you sniff out angst like a police dog sniffs out drugs." --Lyric (to me)

#28 Nikcara

Nikcara

    confused little imp

  • Islander
  • 3,500 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 03:53 AM

Actually, my Psych textbook had a couple interesting things to say about the topic of safe sex.  For one thing, people who are uncomfortable talking about sex (something encuraged, IMO, by abstence-only education) generally won't make plans for if sex happens and therefore won't have things like condoms availble and won't be on any type of birth control.  So refusal to talk about sex openly and honestly leads to a decrease in protection used, even if the people participating in the act know about condoms and whatnot.
It also goes on to talk about another problem commonly seen - condoms are linked closely in our minds with diseases, which makes them less sexy.  Some people don't want to use things like condoms because it implies (to their minds) a lack of trust in their partner and the feeling that their partner is "dirty".  In this sense, having ads/education that makes condoms sexy increases their use more than trying to frighten people into using them because of disease (I remember in Germany seeing some of the most hilarious condom ads.  I think we should have them here because A) everyone needs more humor in their life and B) more effective then showing really gross pictures of things like gonorreha)
We have fourty million reasons for failure, but not a single excuse  -- Rudyard Kipling

Develop compassion for your enemies, that is genuine compassion.  Limited compassion cannot produce this altruism.  -- H. H. the Dalai Lama

#29 WildChildCait

WildChildCait

    And from the ashes of fire, she is reborn

  • Islander
  • 3,416 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 09:45 AM

wheras dutch sex ed treats them as normal 'as in youre a fool if you don't use them...in fact, use pill and condom, one against pregnancy, one against std's.

and as a result they are quite widespreadly used.

average age of first child: 29
teenage abortion rate: lowest in europe
teenage pregnancy rate: lowest in europe
(stats from 2005, i don't have more recent ones)

and sex ed starts at age 11...over and over again.
RIP Ruby Medallion: 31-10-1999/21-05-2007
one gender-reassigned, world travelling, world class snake.

FKA Chaddee, amongst other things.
http://scentedalchemy.webs.com Custom handmade bath and body products

#30 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 09:49 AM

View PostWildChildCait, on Dec 11 2007, 02:45 PM, said:

wheras dutch sex ed treats them as normal 'as in youre a fool if you don't use them...in fact, use pill and condom, one against pregnancy, one against std's.

England has started doing this as well with a series of 'Want respect, use a condom' ads I've seen in cinema's. They've got a long way to go before they match up to the peerless and cutting sarcasm of the Dutch ones, but it's a start.

Quote

average age of first child: 29
teenage abortion rate: lowest in europe
teenage pregnancy rate: lowest in europe

I think that about says it all doesn't it.

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#31 WildChildCait

WildChildCait

    And from the ashes of fire, she is reborn

  • Islander
  • 3,416 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 09:56 AM

do you remember htat 'te laat, te vroeg ' series?

a series of very short scenes with 'too late' or 'too early' with it, hwen to discuss a condom. IE, woman pregnant in a wedding dress? too late

Little kid playin wiht dolls and boy pops up with a train and a condom? too early
there must have been six or eight of htem and they end with two people just wearing undies (girl is in bra and knickers, guy in knickers) and the text 'just right' and each of htem holding a condom.

I also received one at my age 16 graduation and one with my age 18 graduation, with my certificate and a mug each time.
RIP Ruby Medallion: 31-10-1999/21-05-2007
one gender-reassigned, world travelling, world class snake.

FKA Chaddee, amongst other things.
http://scentedalchemy.webs.com Custom handmade bath and body products

#32 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 10:02 AM

View PostWildChildCait, on Dec 11 2007, 02:56 PM, said:

do you remember htat 'te laat, te vroeg ' series?

I do actually, and I think the english ads are trying for something similar, but pushing the whole 'It's cool to use a condom' thing. The ad usually runs in two halves, with a different ad inbetween. In the first one, you see four boys heading out for a pickup game while two girls clean-up from a party. As the lads discuss the last night, one of them asks for a condom back, and the fellow asked tells him he used it. the lads congratulate him and put him in goal because he needs to rest after last night. This is intercut with the two girls obviously being happy.

The second ad starts the same, but he gives the condom back, explaining that he did it bareback, upon which his mates basically tell him he's an ass and put him in goal to get some practice getting his gloves on. This is intercut with the girl he obviously did it with looking very unhappy and her friend comforting her.

As annoying as I find the actors in the ads, I think they hit just the right note for the campaign. Making it not only socially acceptable for people to talk about condoms with each other, but trying to make it socially expected to use one if you want respect from your peers.

Quote

I also received one at my age 16 graduation and one with my age 18 graduation, with my certificate and a mug each time.

I don't recall getting condoms for graduation at the GSG, but I do recall receiving information on where to go for free condoms if I didn't want to go to a shop, and where to go for confidential advice on sex and protection if I couldn't talk to my parents.

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#33 Rhea

Rhea

  • Islander
  • 16,433 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 09:32 PM

View PostNonny, on Dec 10 2007, 05:26 AM, said:

Why are we up at 5:25 am?  Sigh.   :p

I'm always up that time of day. I don't post much then, unless I've had insomnia and I've been up all night. ;)
The future is better than the past. Despite the crepehangers, romanticists, and anti-intellectuals, the world steadily grows better because the human mind, applying itself to environment, makes it better. With hands...with tools...with horse sense and science and engineering.
- Robert A. Heinlein

When I don’t understand, I have an unbearable itch to know why. - RAH


Everything is theoretically impossible, until it is done. One could write a history of science in reverse by assembling the solemn pronouncements of highest authority about what could not be done and could never happen.  - RAH

#34 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,302 posts

Posted 11 December 2007 - 10:40 PM

View PostAlica, on Dec 6 2007, 01:58 PM, said:

Generally, I think abstinence-only sex ed leads to teenagers saying "we won't have sex, we'll wait", then they end up having sex anyway. Then, since they didn't think they were going to have sex, they aren't prepared and don't have a condom to hand. I can also imagine use of contraception having something to do with it, since if they're only been taught abstinence, they won't know how to use it.
Sorry to be so late... but, welcome to Ex Isle, Alica!

QT

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#35 Caithness

Caithness

    Nemo me impune lacessit.

  • Islander
  • 4,941 posts

Posted 12 December 2007 - 08:24 AM

View PostNikcara, on Dec 11 2007, 03:53 AM, said:

In this sense, having ads/education that makes condoms sexy increases their use more than trying to frighten people into using them because of disease (I remember in Germany seeing some of the most hilarious condom ads.  I think we should have them here because A) everyone needs more humor in their life and B) more effective then showing really gross pictures of things like gonorreha)

Now I'm interested.  What was the ad?
Posted Image

#36 Caithness

Caithness

    Nemo me impune lacessit.

  • Islander
  • 4,941 posts

Posted 12 December 2007 - 08:29 AM

View PostGodeskian, on Dec 11 2007, 10:02 AM, said:

I don't recall getting condoms for graduation at the GSG, but I do recall receiving information on where to go for free condoms if I didn't want to go to a shop, and where to go for confidential advice on sex and protection if I couldn't talk to my parents.

I don't think they should hand them to you, but I think, like you said, Gode, that they should be available and people should know where to go to get them.

I think in places like South Africa there should be a condom guy who goes door to door, cuz clinics are few and far between there and women don't want the stigma attached to going to a clinic or carrying a condom around.  Then they need government announcements about how condoms are cool or something.  

But seriously, here in the US, they should start teaching you about condoms when you're twelve.
Posted Image

#37 Godeskian

Godeskian

    You'll be seein' rainbooms

  • Islander
  • 26,839 posts

Posted 12 December 2007 - 08:35 AM

View PostCaithness, on Dec 12 2007, 01:29 PM, said:

I don't think they should hand them to you, but I think, like you said, Gode, that they should be available and people should know where to go to get them.

Unless you're planning on having a graduation day fling (and I've known people who did exactly that) then I think you can probably find time to go get some, but I have to admit I don't have a big problem with the idea of them handing them out at graduation.

Quote

I think in places like South Africa there should be a condom guy who goes door to door, cuz clinics are few and far between there and women don't want the stigma attached to going to a clinic or carrying a condom around.  Then they need government announcements about how condoms are cool or something.

It would also help if the vatican hadn't condemned condom use under John Paul II. I realise that their religious doctrines required it, but it probably did more damage than anything else to attempts to get people to have safe sex.

Quote

But seriously, here in the US, they should start teaching you about condoms when you're twelve.

Given that we have 12 year old mothers in the UK, I'd prefer eleven, but I do recognise that the 12 year old mothers are the extreme end of the statistics.

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#38 Caithness

Caithness

    Nemo me impune lacessit.

  • Islander
  • 4,941 posts

Posted 12 December 2007 - 07:33 PM

View PostGodeskian, on Dec 12 2007, 08:35 AM, said:

Unless you're planning on having a graduation day fling (and I've known people who did exactly that) then I think you can probably find time to go get some, but I have to admit I don't have a big problem with the idea of them handing them out at graduation.

"Congratulations... here's your diploma and your profilactic.  I'm sure you'll go on to do great things with both."
Posted Image

#39 Nonny

Nonny

    Scourge of Pretentious Bad Latin

  • Islander
  • 31,142 posts

Posted 12 December 2007 - 08:41 PM

View PostWildChildCait, on Dec 11 2007, 06:45 AM, said:

wheras dutch sex ed treats them as normal 'as in youre a fool if you don't use them...in fact, use pill and condom, one against pregnancy, one against std's.

and as a result they are quite widespreadly used.

average age of first child: 29
teenage abortion rate: lowest in europe
teenage pregnancy rate: lowest in europe
(stats from 2005, i don't have more recent ones)

and sex ed starts at age 11...over and over again.
Sigh.  So reasonable, so helpful, so right.  I happened to watch a movie today that had the most horribly funny scene of abstinence only sex ed.  Tina Fey wrote Mean Girls and played the math teacher.  The guy who played the sex ed teacher was deadpan perfect.  Total send up of current US sex ed.
Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#40 Nonny

Nonny

    Scourge of Pretentious Bad Latin

  • Islander
  • 31,142 posts

Posted 12 December 2007 - 08:44 PM

View PostRhea, on Dec 11 2007, 06:32 PM, said:

View PostNonny, on Dec 10 2007, 05:26 AM, said:

Why are we up at 5:25 am?  Sigh.   :p

I'm always up that time of day. I don't post much then, unless I've had insomnia and I've been up all night. ;)
Yeah, I'm almost always up by then whether I need to be or not, and I almost never need to be.    :rolleyes:
Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot



Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Birth Rate, Teenagers, Health, Pregnancy, 2007

0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users