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Gun Control Gone Mad. Bye Bye Toys!

Gun Control Childrens toy guns

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#1 Rov Judicata

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:00 AM

http://washingtontim...02748-8128r.htm

Quote

ANNAPOLIS — Residents had mixed reactions yesterday to a city lawmaker's push for a statute that would ban children from playing outdoors with most toy guns and fine parents of the pistol-packing tots.
    Some parents said keeping realistic-looking toy guns away from children could curb violent behavior and stop police from making a fatal mistake.
    "My children will say to me that 'It's fake, it's not real,' " said Dina Olmo, who has two sons. "But they represent the real thing and violence."
    Yet others said they and their friends grew up playing cops and robbers and military games, and that fake weapons did not lead them to violent lifestyles. They also said the legislation would be unfair to parents.

This is just... stupid. It's bad enough to curb the 2nd amendment rights of citizens. But to prevent children from playing with toys?

Edited by Cait, 21 September 2012 - 02:59 PM.

St. Louis must be destroyed!

Me: "I have a job and five credit cards and am looking into signing a two year lease.  THAT MAKES ME OLD."
Josh: "I don't have a job, I have ONE credit card, I'm stuck in a lease and I'm 28! My mom's basement IS ONE BAD DECISION AWAY!"
~~ Josh, winning the argument.

"Congress . . . shall include every idiot, lunatic, insane person, and person non compos mentis[.]" ~1 U.S.C. 1, selectively quoted for accuracy.

#2 Lady of Mystery

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:12 AM

Please!  I remember many leisurely summer days playing outside with my friends with our "pistols" that shot caps.  Hiding behind trees, behind fences, playing cowboys and indians.  And I had 'real leather' holsters too!  (Don't think I wasn't proud of that!)

I may be a girl, but shucks, we had a wonderful time in 'pretend' land.

Mercy!  What would Randolph Scott say!????

Lady

#3 Bad Wolf

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:12 AM

*sigh*

Big Brother to the rescue again.

I blame Tipper Gore and her ilk for this kind of nonsense.
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#4 AnneZo

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:20 AM

Hey, I grew up playing cops and robbers and cowboys and indians and all the rest of it.

We didn't need no stupid guns.  You get yerself a good stick and a mean stare, and you're good to go.

Kids today.

Bah. Don't even know how to play right.


Anne, who once amused herself for three hours with two bricks and a pile of dirt. (But of course that was last weekend.)

#5 QuiGon John

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:23 AM

Well, I know I wasn't supposed to play with toy guns-- the realistic-looking kind, sci-fi guns were okay ;)-- growing up.  I think there's probably something to be said for that.  But it definitely should be up to the parents, not written into law.

#6 Bad Wolf

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:29 AM

John Burke, on Jun 25 2003, 05:24 PM, said:

But it definitely should be up to the parents, not written into law.
Precisely.

This trend of wanting to substitute the law for parenting really steams me.

:glare:
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#7 Rov Judicata

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 11:36 AM

Thanks for sharing LM and AnneZo. Very interesting. And, if you don't mind, LOL!

As for the parenting issue: *Gasp*. That would be advocating responsibility...
St. Louis must be destroyed!

Me: "I have a job and five credit cards and am looking into signing a two year lease.  THAT MAKES ME OLD."
Josh: "I don't have a job, I have ONE credit card, I'm stuck in a lease and I'm 28! My mom's basement IS ONE BAD DECISION AWAY!"
~~ Josh, winning the argument.

"Congress . . . shall include every idiot, lunatic, insane person, and person non compos mentis[.]" ~1 U.S.C. 1, selectively quoted for accuracy.

#8 sierraleone

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 01:34 PM

^ the very same thing we are *gasp* trying to teach young people, especially when it comes to drinking, smoking, doing drugs and having sex...
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#9 GiGi

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 02:51 PM

Okay, we JUST dealt with this issue the last two weeks.  Here is our situation...

FACT - the gun in question is some alternative to paint ball, shoots plastic bullets that are supposedly less painful than paintballs.

FACT  - the gun in question looks like a REAL gun.  It has some red paint on the barrel that is supposed to identify it as a toy.

FACT - I took it away from the oldest boy last week after trying to "be cool" with the idea of this gun, which I am not. Why did I take it away?  Within hours of them "playing with it" the oldest pointed it at the second oldest brother and shot him against his protests of not wanting the gun even pointed at him.  Second stepson comes into the house crying.  I get very upset, because yes it DOES represent an act of violence to have a gun pointed at you against your will and also to be hurt by a plastic bullet.

I made the oldest make amends by doing something to make this all up to his brother.  I told him if I ever hear again of him shooting someone who has not agreed to play this (insane) game with him, it will disappear forever!!! (he was taking the gun to his mom's house, away from supervision in my opinion, as she is gone a lot)

Ladies and gentlemen of the thread.  These are not the "toys" we played with as kids.  

I told the oldest stepson that what he has looks like a real gun and must be treated as one.  He said "oh, no, see it has this red paint here that way the police know it is fake."

I told him "oh, no, if you use it inappropriately they may not notice the red paint, signifying that this is a fake gun.  If they act out of a reaction and think you have a real gun, they will shoot you - DEAD!"  I know this, it has happened more than once around here.

Okay, end of story.  Excuse me while I go off and scream somewhere.
"Life is as dear to a mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not die, so do all creatures." -- HH The Dalai Lama

#10 MuseZack

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 02:57 PM

I'm a left-wing gun nut, so I'm probably out of place anywhere but at Hunter Thompson's ranch.  But I think this is lame.  My hippie mom gave up trying to keep toy guns from me when she saw me make one out of wood  (it was actually a phaser, since Star Trek was the only show I was allowed to watch, but still...).  I think it's a basic part of the male DNA to like to play with toy guns.  So parents should teach basic safety (not in public) and keep the real ones away from them until they're old enough and trained to respect them and use them safely.


Oh jeez, now I've probably horrified Chiron,

:devil:  :devil:

Zack

P.S.  This is what happens when you grow up in Mendocino County, where even the hippies are armed to the teeth.
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We shall harness for God the energies of Love.
Then, for the second time in the history of the world,
we will have discovered fire."
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#11 sierraleone

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 02:59 PM

MuseZack, on Jun 25 2003, 07:58 PM, said:

I'm a left-wing gun nut, so I'm probably out of place anywhere but at Hunter Thompson's ranch.  But I think this is lame.  My hippie mom gave up trying to keep toy guns from me when she saw me make one out of wood  (it was actually a phaser, since Star Trek was the only show I was allowed to watch, but still...).  I think it's a basic part of the male DNA to like to play with toy guns.  So parents should teach basic safety (not in public) and keep the real ones away from them until they're old enough and trained to respect them and use them safely.


Oh jeez, now I've probably horrified Chiron,

:devil:  :devil:

Zack

P.S.  This is what happens when you grow up in Mendocino County, where even the hippies are armed to the teeth.
Toy guns weren't around when male DNA came about ;) :D
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#12 Bossy

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Posted 26 June 2003 - 03:12 PM

MuseZack, on Jun 25 2003, 10:58 PM, said:

I'm a left-wing gun nut, so I'm probably out of place anywhere but at Hunter Thompson's ranch.  But I think this is lame.  My hippie mom gave up trying to keep toy guns from me when she saw me make one out of wood  (it was actually a phaser, since Star Trek was the only show I was allowed to watch, but still...).  I think it's a basic part of the male DNA to like to play with toy guns.  So parents should teach basic safety (not in public) and keep the real ones away from them until they're old enough and trained to respect them and use them safely.


Oh jeez, now I've probably horrified Chiron,

:devil:  :devil:

Zack

P.S.  This is what happens when you grow up in Mendocino County, where even the hippies are armed to the teeth.
Not just male DNA! When were were kids, my dad got us all toy guns. They were pretty realistic looking, air powered, and they shot yellow rubber bullits. My three brothers, my sister, my dad, and I all had pistols. Mom refused to have one, and she thought we were nuts for having fights in the living room. :D

Dad also taught us all gun saftey from the time we were small. He probably let is shoot real guns at a far younger age than some would consider appropriate. He always suppervised us and made sure we respected the capabilities of the guns we were handling.
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#13 GiGi

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 03:19 AM

sierraleone, on Jun 25 2003, 08:00 PM, said:

Oh jeez, now I've probably horrified Chiron,
^And you love to do it!  :devil:

Okay, starting again.  Perhaps it is one type of gun that is the issue.  I didn't grow up with a hippy mom so I played with guns as a kid too (I preferred to be an Indian with a bow & arrow) I had squirt guns, cap guns, and Zack I had a phaser that shot plastic disks and it was during the second season of Star Trek when it first aired!   :p

The guns I was describing do not look like the fun plastic toys I had.  I have many hippy mom friends who are horrified at any gun.  I  am not like that. The boys have squirt guns that look like futuristic missle lauchers.  Hubby has a bb-gun.  

The gun I was describing looks and feels real.  It has weight it is made of metal.  It has a powerful shooting range, for all intends and purposes it is a real gun that shoots plastic shells.

Yes, I agree that teaching gun safety is vital.  We did that.  We are treating this as if it is a real gun since it almost is.  The difference being a real gun would not stay in the child's hands as they go off to play war games.  It would be locked away when target practice is done.

Still the first thing the oldest did was to point it at the second son and terrorize him with it.  This is at our house where I am around all the time since I have a home office.  I have no idea what will be done with this gun now that it has gone with them to their mom's house where supervision is a lot less. It went with him since most of his friends live up in the valley where they are at.

But note too--- I DID give the gun back to him.  I told him that I would trust him again to use it right, but if he blows it again he is too immature to have a gun like this.

And it is true, really no exaggeration, the gun that we got him looks real enough that a policeman could over react to it.  Especially if a child is using it in a threatening way.

Do any of you have a kid with a gun like this?  And if you do, are you concerned about it or is your child better at handling what amounts to a real gun unsupervised.  I am not asking with any sarcasm, just want to know.  Cuz I am trying to be cool here.
"Life is as dear to a mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not die, so do all creatures." -- HH The Dalai Lama

#14 Drew

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 03:25 AM

AnneZo, on Jun 25 2003, 07:21 PM, said:

Anne, who once amused herself for three hours with two bricks and a pile of dirt. (But of course that was last weekend.)
See how much we have in common! Of course for me it was 141 bricks, a very large amount of dirt, and more hours than I care to remember. But I did finally finish edging my gardens on Saturday.  :cool:

Edited by Drew, 27 June 2003 - 03:26 AM.

"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."

#15 Bad Wolf

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 05:31 AM

Okay Chiron but you're not addressing the issue at hand:

No one here disputes your right as a parent to regulate the toys your kid plays with.  The issue is governmental regulation.

And ZACK you have completely flabbergasted me...how can one be a LEFT wing gun nut??  :wacko:  :unsure:  :wacko:

:devil:
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#16 Drew

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 06:25 AM

Una Salus Lillius, on Jun 26 2003, 01:32 PM, said:

And ZACK you have completely flabbergasted me...how can one be a LEFT wing gun nut??  :wacko:  :unsure:  :wacko:
That's the problem with labels. Among other things, I am pretty environmentally conscious, and oppose the death penalty. Some people think this makes me liberal.
"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."

#17 Rov Judicata

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 06:27 AM

^

I'm pro-choice, a gun nut, pro-gay marriage, anti-affirmative action, pro-Iraq war, anti-Bush tax cut, pro-death penalty, and pro-enforcement of immigration law.

Labels are hard. ;).
St. Louis must be destroyed!

Me: "I have a job and five credit cards and am looking into signing a two year lease.  THAT MAKES ME OLD."
Josh: "I don't have a job, I have ONE credit card, I'm stuck in a lease and I'm 28! My mom's basement IS ONE BAD DECISION AWAY!"
~~ Josh, winning the argument.

"Congress . . . shall include every idiot, lunatic, insane person, and person non compos mentis[.]" ~1 U.S.C. 1, selectively quoted for accuracy.

#18 Bad Wolf

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 06:45 AM

Drew, on Jun 26 2003, 12:26 PM, said:

Una Salus Lillius, on Jun 26 2003, 01:32 PM, said:

And ZACK you have completely flabbergasted me...how can one be a LEFT wing gun nut?? :wacko: :unsure: :wacko:
That's the problem with labels. Among other things, I am pretty environmentally conscious, and oppose the death penalty. Some people think this makes me liberal.
I guess the fact that I was, TEASING Zack didn't come through huh.

:p

*says she who supports the death penalty in principle, is pro choice, pretty anti affirmative action, pro gay marriage, anti gun but knows she can't do anything about it, pro separation of church and state but boy has it got taken too far, anti Bush, anti Gore, pro Clinton....*

I hardly think I'm an advocate of labels seein' as my political views are about as eclectic as my taste in music.

:alien:

But wait, isn't "eclectic" a label too??

Dammit, now I'm getting a headache.

:Oo:

:hehe:

Edited by Una Salus Lillius, 27 June 2003 - 06:47 AM.

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#19 Rov Judicata

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 06:46 AM

LOL Lil!
St. Louis must be destroyed!

Me: "I have a job and five credit cards and am looking into signing a two year lease.  THAT MAKES ME OLD."
Josh: "I don't have a job, I have ONE credit card, I'm stuck in a lease and I'm 28! My mom's basement IS ONE BAD DECISION AWAY!"
~~ Josh, winning the argument.

"Congress . . . shall include every idiot, lunatic, insane person, and person non compos mentis[.]" ~1 U.S.C. 1, selectively quoted for accuracy.

#20 GiGi

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Posted 27 June 2003 - 07:04 AM

Una Salus Lillius, on Jun 26 2003, 10:32 AM, said:

Okay Chiron but you're not addressing the issue at hand:

No one here disputes your right as a parent to regulate the toys your kid plays with.  The issue is governmental regulation.
Okay, I guess I am not getting through.

As with anything, those who abuse things ruin it for all.

First, I am not in support of this regulation and yet I can see where it comes from.  Some of the guns that kids "play" with are so much like the real thing that the kids are getting shot by the police who are mistaking the guns for real.  This is why the regulation is even being an issue.  They are trying to avoid more tragedies.  These days of gang shootings that are so prevailent is very hard for police to know what is real and what is a toy.  Why does the design of the "fake" have to look so real.  If you were a policeman would you take a chance?  

Second, I can't regulate these "toys" as more than half the time the kids are away from my supervision.  Yet, I am being pressured to "be cool" with a situation that is an accident waiting to happen.

So, is any one else seeing this issue?  I really don't think this regulation is out to ban squirt guns, but the guns that are causing the problem.  It is probably not the best solution, but are there some other answers?  As I said I am not for the regulation, but something is needing to change somewhere.  And believe me many kids have no supervision whatso ever, so saying that the parents should regulate them is a good sounding notion in theory, but more times than not fails miserably in execution.
"Life is as dear to a mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not die, so do all creatures." -- HH The Dalai Lama



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