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White House willing to back down on "public option" in healt

Health Care Public Option 2009

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#1 Spectacles

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 07:49 AM

So much for Obama the Socialist.

http://online.wsj.co...tics_And_Policy

This is not going to set well with large numbers of people who have more faith in Medicare than they do private insurers. Polls show about 70% of the public wants a public option--a government-run insurance to fall back on when unemployment strikes or when employers do not offer insurance plans at all.

I personally cannot imagine anything else truly benefiting the public. But then I'm no expert. I'd be curious to hear other opinions about how dropping the public option is a good deal for the public.

Edited by Spectacles, 07 July 2009 - 07:49 AM.

"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#2 Nittany Lioness

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 08:12 AM

This is really weird, but clicking on your link doesn't bring up a window, at all.
The little finger pointy icon hovers over the link, but nothing happens.
That's never happened to me before.

For now I'll just comment that not going down the rabbit hole of a governmental program benefits the public by not bringing on an additional quagmire of epic proportions that I believe it would be.  So there's that.  What's that saying - When treating a disaster, first do no harm.

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#3 Balderdash

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 08:26 AM

President Obama is starting to wear on my nerves.  If we had President Hillary Clinton I don't believe that we'd be wasting our mandate or our majority.

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#4 Palisades

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 08:28 AM

Yay!!!
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"In truth, 'too big to fail' is not the worst thing we should fear – our financial institutions are now on their way to becoming 'too big to save'." —Simon Johnson

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#5 Palisades

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 10:07 AM

From the article:

Quote

"The goal is to have a means and a mechanism to keep the private insurers honest," [Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel] said in an interview.

What about the biggie of ensuring that medical providers do their billing in an honest way? There's something smelly about medical providers charging way more than they expect to be paid with the actual price paid varying wildly depending on whether the patient has insurance and what insurance the patient has.
"When the Fed is the bartender everybody drinks until they fall down." —Paul McCulley

"In truth, 'too big to fail' is not the worst thing we should fear – our financial institutions are now on their way to becoming 'too big to save'." —Simon Johnson

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TWP / An Affirming Flame / Solar Wind / Palisade

#6 Bad Wolf

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 10:54 AM

View PostBalderdash, on Jul 7 2009, 06:26 AM, said:

President Obama is starting to wear on my nerves.  If we had President Hillary Clinton I don't believe that we'd be wasting our mandate or our majority.

Too bad the alternative was McCain.  :/
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#7 Balderdash

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 10:55 AM

View PostBad Wolf, on Jul 7 2009, 08:54 AM, said:

View PostBalderdash, on Jul 7 2009, 06:26 AM, said:

President Obama is starting to wear on my nerves.  If we had President Hillary Clinton I don't believe that we'd be wasting our mandate or our majority.

Too bad the alternative was McCain.  :/


Yeah, there's no way I could go that way.  :suspect:

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#8 Palisades

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 11:08 AM

At least McCain's health plan taxed everyone's health benefits at their marginal tax rate (which for poor people would be 0%, 10%, or 15%) rather than taxing at 25% health-insurance benefits that are greater than the federal government's Blue Cross Blue Shield "standard option." How much do you want to bet that this is the insurance plan most members of Congress have (although they may have supplemental health insurance on top of it)?

What's this? Health benefits only count as taxable income if they're in excess of the feds' standard health insurance plan?

Edited by Palisade, 07 July 2009 - 11:46 AM.

"When the Fed is the bartender everybody drinks until they fall down." —Paul McCulley

"In truth, 'too big to fail' is not the worst thing we should fear – our financial institutions are now on their way to becoming 'too big to save'." —Simon Johnson

FKA:
TWP / An Affirming Flame / Solar Wind / Palisade

#9 Spectacles

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 02:14 PM

Well, apparently Obama has reaffirmed that he is still in favor of a public option.

The administration has gone back and forth on this. I wonder what we'll end up with.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#10 Palisades

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 02:42 PM

Actually, he's not going back and forth on this particular issue. His position is that he's in favor of a public option but will sign health care legislation that doesn't have it.
"When the Fed is the bartender everybody drinks until they fall down." —Paul McCulley

"In truth, 'too big to fail' is not the worst thing we should fear – our financial institutions are now on their way to becoming 'too big to save'." —Simon Johnson

FKA:
TWP / An Affirming Flame / Solar Wind / Palisade

#11 Captain Jack

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 03:36 PM

The only reason this played out to this result is because Obama could not get enough support from his own party.  Otherwise, Obama the socialist it would have been.  I can possibly live with this new version depending on what all the details are about.  Frankly, I'd rather have NO government involvement, but I'm willing to hear more and see if I like it or not.
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#12 Spectacles

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 06:44 PM

^You've got it backwards. The people in his party who are most wary of Obama right now on health care are those who want a public option. The public option is the closest thing to a skeery-socialist thang. It's a government-run, Medicare-like option for people without insurance that would compete with private insurers. If Obama backs off it, as he and his advisers periodically hint they may, all hell will break lose from the more progressive wing of the Democratic party--and from progressive Independents, too. Hell, I'll be mighty unhappy--and I'm not a socialist.

People who think Obama is a socialist really need to do some more reading. He isn't. If anything, he's very private capital-friendly. Just ask the Goldman-Sachs crowd and all the big banksters. And his health insurance plan is (wisely) being drafted by negotiating with insurers and hospital owners and doctors as much as possible--as was the health care plan of that other "socialist," Hillary Clinton.  :)
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#13 Spectacles

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 06:51 PM

View PostPalisade, on Jul 7 2009, 03:42 PM, said:

Actually, he's not going back and forth on this particular issue. His position is that he's in favor of a public option but will sign health care legislation that doesn't have it.

He's also indicated that it must be in the plan but it's not going to be "a line in the sand." Can't be both. Either it's negotiable or it isn't.

Obama's unwillingness sometimes to dig in his heels and take a firm stand irks me. Perhaps it's politically wise, but it still aggravates me. I often find myself wondering if anything is non-negotiable to him--what his core principles are. They're very hard to define, which worked to his advantage in the primaries because he was, as he himself acknowledged, something of a Rorschach. He once described himself as a screen that others projected their own hopes onto. That's a great quality for campaigning because everyone thinks you're exactly what they're hoping for. Governing, though, is all about tough choices. I believe he's up to them; I just wish I had a sense of what his choices would be. I honestly don't and that bothers me.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#14 Palisades

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 06:56 PM

^ Actually, the Democrats who are holding up the public option appear to be the ones in the Senate Finance Committee. I’d be willing to bet that Senators in the Finance Committee receive extensive lobbying from insurance companies.
"When the Fed is the bartender everybody drinks until they fall down." —Paul McCulley

"In truth, 'too big to fail' is not the worst thing we should fear – our financial institutions are now on their way to becoming 'too big to save'." —Simon Johnson

FKA:
TWP / An Affirming Flame / Solar Wind / Palisade

#15 Spectacles

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 07:02 PM

View PostPalisade, on Jul 7 2009, 07:56 PM, said:

^ Actually, the Democrats who are holding up the public option appear to be the ones in the Senate Finance Committee. I’d be willing to bet that Senators in the Finance Committee receive extensive lobbying from insurance companies.

Oh man, they ALL do. I read an article the other day on how DC is crawling with insurance lobbyists, etc. The industry is spending billions on lobbying. This is why it doesn't matter which party is in power: as long as it take millions to run for office and stay in office, policy is written by those with the deepest pockets.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#16 Spectacles

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 07:05 PM

To illustrate how the heath care industry and insurers are furiously lobbying (with former congress critters and senators, no less, from both parties) read this:

http://www.washingto...ml?hpid=topnews

We need to stop this crap.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#17 Shalamar

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 09:29 PM

Specs, What I really believe is that Obama Doesn't have any core priniciples.

As a friend from another board puts is "He is bought and paid for" ...that 'he has never made a vote ( yes or no - not his long history of abstain / 'present' ) that he wasn't paid to make.'

And he gave a majority of the voters the dream they wanted - and now the underlying nightmare is beginning to show through.

I don't think he's a socialist...unless 'they' pay him enough. I don't think he's this or that or whatever - unless 'they' pay him enough..

I very strongly believe that he is going to run this nation into a debt status we can not recover from and expect us to like it.
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