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OWS calls for coordinated shut down of all west coast ports

Occupy Wall Street OWS 2011

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#1 Hambil

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 02:31 PM

And this time, unlike the attempts to shut down wallstreet, they have the support of the unions running the ports.

I may not agree with everything they do, but they are not afraid to hit back when hit (in their own way, of course).

Shutdown Westcoast Ports

#2 Bobby

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 03:33 PM

LOL, at least they can P*ss and s**t off the docks! Jesus, I can just image Nittany's thread with a line of peope's asses taking dumps in the port.  Good God, that thread will be a thousand pages long...

In all seriousness, they aren't going to be affecting just the people they want to get at.  The super rich have money stashed away, probably a few thousand in pillows, more in this climate, in case the people come with pitch forks.  If they really disrupt working class people's lives, it'll be to their detriment, I think.

Edited by LiberalBob, 21 November 2011 - 03:33 PM.


#3 NeuralClone

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 03:52 PM

Ok, I read the statement at the Occupy website, and I can't figure out what the hell they're talking about or trying to do. It's a lot of propaganda-like rhetoric that doesn't say a whole lot.

There have been some horrible incidents (e.g., Oakland and UC Davis) involving police that go above and beyond what needs to be done. The UC Davis incident in particular was horrific. Those responsible for "dealing" with the protestors in those situations get absolutely no sympathy from me.

But "coordinated nationwide police attacks have turned our cities into battlegrounds?" I'm sorry but that's pure paranoia and doesn't do a thing to help the cause. There's some sort of nationwide conspiracy against the Occupy movement by police forces? Riiiiight. It's more like cities are trying to deal with people breaking the law since that is the job of the police. And until we have a Libya, Egypt, or Syria situation, I don't think we have anything close to a "battleground," especially when those who are supposedly being impacted aren't affected by anything Occupy is doing. This stuff is impacting the average person, which goes against who OWS supposedly represents.

View PostLiberalBob, on 21 November 2011 - 03:33 PM, said:

In all seriousness, they aren't going to be affecting just the people they want to get at.  The super rich have money stashed away, probably a few thousand in pillows, more in this climate, in case the people come with pitch forks.  If they really disrupt working class people's lives, it'll be to their detriment, I think.
Huh?

Edited by NeuralClone, 21 November 2011 - 03:52 PM.

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#4 Hambil

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 03:53 PM

My belief is the movement wants to remain out of the current political system as much as possible. Given that, I see two end games - different camps seems to be approaching different ones.

The first is a national work stoppage. Yes, strikes hurt the strikers, and others, and we are very aware of that and sadden by it, but it is one of the tools of last resort the worker's have.

The second, is a call for a national convention on the deficit. That is a more complicated but I believe better route. It is how the 17th amendment got passed, and it's generally the way people have to deal with anything that involves changing the power structure in this country (the 17th amendment required senators to run for office).

Edited by Hambil, 21 November 2011 - 03:54 PM.


#5 Bobby

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 04:31 PM

View PostNeuralClone, on 21 November 2011 - 03:52 PM, said:

Ok, I read the statement at the Occupy website, and I can't figure out what the hell they're talking about or trying to do. It's a lot of propaganda-like rhetoric that doesn't say a whole lot.

There have been some horrible incidents (e.g., Oakland and UC Davis) involving police that go above and beyond what needs to be done. The UC Davis incident in particular was horrific. Those responsible for "dealing" with the protestors in those situations get absolutely no sympathy from me.

But "coordinated nationwide police attacks have turned our cities into battlegrounds?" I'm sorry but that's pure paranoia and doesn't do a thing to help the cause. There's some sort of nationwide conspiracy against the Occupy movement by police forces? Riiiiight. It's more like cities are trying to deal with people breaking the law since that is the job of the police. And until we have a Libya, Egypt, or Syria situation, I don't think we have anything close to a "battleground," especially when those who are supposedly being impacted aren't affected by anything Occupy is doing. This stuff is impacting the average person, which goes against who OWS supposedly represents.

View PostLiberalBob, on 21 November 2011 - 03:33 PM, said:

In all seriousness, they aren't going to be affecting just the people they want to get at.  The super rich have money stashed away, probably a few thousand in pillows, more in this climate, in case the people come with pitch forks.  If they really disrupt working class people's lives, it'll be to their detriment, I think.
Huh?

http://www.occupywal...t-port-shutdow/

Quote

Occupy Oakland calls for the blockade and disruption of the economic apparatus of the 1% with a coordinated shutdown of ports on the entire West Coast on December 12th. The 1% has disrupted the lives of longshoremen and port truckers and the workers who create their wealth, just as coordinated nationwide police attacks have turned our cities into battlegrounds in an effort to disrupt our Occupy movement.


Since they can't shut down Wall Street they want to shut down the way things are shipped in and out of this country.  If businesses and factories, even the service industry, can't get the products they need it will stop the economy all the same.  If regular people can't work, they can't pay the mortgage/rent, utility bills, or buy food.  It will be to the OWS detriment, because they will be hurting the people they claim to be trying to help.  The rich have money on hand and have it in banks, and in an environment where people seem to be anti-rich, It'd be prudent to have some money on hand in case you had to leave in the middle of the night.

You're the one who says the OWS people are parnoid, I'd image the rich might be getting that way as well.

Edited by LiberalBob, 21 November 2011 - 04:35 PM.


#6 Hambil

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 04:37 PM

I know they are painful, but historically large scale work stoppages are effective. As I said, it's not the route I'd prefer they take, but I'd hardly call it bad - since it's a route a lot of successful civil rights movements have taken.

http://en.wikipedia....omestead_Strike
http://en.wikipedia...._Strike_of_1902
http://webapps.lsa.u.../chronology.pdf

The history of striking as a tool is long a bloody and deserves respect.

Edited by Hambil, 21 November 2011 - 04:49 PM.


#7 Bobby

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 04:40 PM

View PostHambil, on 21 November 2011 - 04:37 PM, said:

I know they are painful, but historically large scale work stoppages are effective. As I said, it's not the route I'd prefer they take, but I'd hardly call it bad - since it's a route a lot of successful civil rights movements have taken.


Better to do it all at once, like ripping off a bandaid, and suffer the economic hardship for little bit than tear it off slowly and deal with economic hardship for years on end.  I got you, Hambil, people might have a couple of months of financial struggle in order to make things better in the long run.

#8 NeuralClone

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 05:12 PM

View PostLiberalBob, on 21 November 2011 - 04:31 PM, said:

Since they can't shut down Wall Street they want to shut down the way things are shipped in and out of this country.  If businesses and factories, even the service industry, can't get the products they need it will stop the economy all the same.  If regular people can't work, they can't pay the mortgage/rent, utility bills, or buy food.  It will be to the OWS detriment, because they will be hurting the people they claim to be trying to help.
Well, at least we agree that it will be the OWS detriment. I respect that work stoppage can be an effective form of protest. But the groups doing the protesting need to have an end goal in mind. Otherwise it just hurts others without accomplishing anything. That's ultimately my problem with OWS. There isn't a clear end goal that will end the protesting.

Quote

The rich have money on hand and have it in banks, and in an environment where people seem to be anti-rich, It'd be prudent to have some money on hand in case you had to leave in the middle of the night.
Why exactly would the rich need to be leaving in the middle of the night? Are people planning on storming their houses now? I'm generally pretty liberal with many things and I find that to be completely over-the-top.

Quote

You're the one who says the OWS people are parnoid, I'd image the rich might be getting that way as well.
No, I said that the statements on the page that Hambil linked to are paranoid. And they are. There isn't some sort of coordinated, nationwide conspiracy against the Occupy movement by the police forces in various cities. The job of the police is to keep order and enforce the law. It isn't their job to sympathize with protestors. Laws have been broken by protestors and it's the responsibility of the police to deal with that. There's no excuse for what the police have done in some cities, and in no way am I saying I approve of excessive force.
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#9 Hambil

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 05:27 PM

Actually, it was a coordinated effort by the government.

link

Edited by Hambil, 21 November 2011 - 05:28 PM.


#10 RobL

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Posted 21 November 2011 - 09:08 PM

LOL......yeah, I see any attempt to "occupy" the ports going over really well......

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#11 Captain Jack

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Posted 22 November 2011 - 03:38 AM

So the idiots want to make the US economy even worse? Dock workers need jobs too and they're part of the 99% those clueless tools claim to represent.  :headshake:

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Edited by Captain Jack, 22 November 2011 - 03:38 AM.

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