Jump to content


Getting an "Insecure Connection" warning for Exisle? No worry

Details in this thread

Libya consulate, US ambassador attacked,

2012

  • Please log in to reply
107 replies to this topic

#1 offworlder

offworlder

    pls don't kick offworlders, we can find a place too

  • Islander
  • 5,363 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 10:05 AM

Can you believe, that people reacting to some movie film made out somewhere, with no connection
or control involving government, attack and blow up and burn and/or murder Americans?

http://www.cnn.com/2....html?hpt=wo_c1

' An "angry crowd" marched on the U.S. compound Tuesday, furious about an American-produced online film considered offensive to Muslims, said Libya's Deputy Interior Minister Wanis al-Sharif .
The U.S. mission in Egypt was also attacked Tuesday in response to the film depicting the prophet Mohammed as a child molester, womanizer and ruthless killer.
Stevens was the first U.S. ambassador to be killed in an attack since 1979.
'
' U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton identified a second victim as Sean Smith, a Foreign Service information management officer who was a 10-year veteran of the State Department, a husband and a father of two.
The two other victims have not been named.
'
In Bengazi-
' The U.S. mission is very badly damaged and was being looted on Wednesday, said a contractor working at the mission, who asked not to be named for security reasons.
He said he saw the bodies of all four Americans on the street Wednesday morning. ;

http://www.bbc.co.uk...africa-19570254

BBCWorld reports,
' The US ambassador to Libya is among four Americans killed in an attack on the US consulate in Benghazi, President Barack Obama has confirmed.

Unidentified armed men stormed the grounds overnight amid uproar among Muslims over a US-produced film said to insult the Prophet Muhammad.
They shot at buildings and threw handmade bombs into the compound.
It has not been confirmed how the ambassador, J Christopher Stevens, and the others died.

I say it was just an excuse to be hooligan yobs blowing up Americans, run out n the street violence rather than be responsible or constructive or positive- I mean, a movie film? They cannot believe that anyone in Bengazi is connected.

"(Do you read what they say online?) I check out all these scandalous rumours about me and Elijah Wood having beautiful sex with each other ... (are they true?) About Elijah and me being boyfriend and boyfriend? Absolutely true. We've been together for about nine years. I wooed him. No I just like a lot of stuff - I like that someone says one thing and it becomes fact. It's kind of fun." --Dominic Monaghan in a phone interview with Newsweek while buying DVDs at the store. :D

#2 Dev F

Dev F

    Straighten your pope hat!

  • Islander
  • 3,757 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 10:50 AM

There's been some suggestion that this was a straight-up terrorist attack, in retaliation for the death of Libyan al-Qaeda leader Abu Yaya al-Libi, and that the fact that it coincided with the protest of some idiotic film was either coincidental or opportunistic. It certainly was very well armed and well coordinated for an unplanned eruption of populist rage.

Edited by Dev F, 12 September 2012 - 10:51 AM.


#3 Nonny

Nonny

    Scourge of Pretentious Bad Latin

  • Islander
  • 31,142 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 11:30 AM

http://www.npr.org/b...ugh-assignments
Slain U.S. Ambassador, Chris Stevens, Thrived On Tough Assignments

Quote

Chris Stevens, the U.S. ambassador killed in an attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya, was a very special diplomat. He made a career of going to difficult places and insisting that he witness tumultuous events firsthand.
His death is filled with bitter ironies. He spent much of his professional life in North Africa and loved being in Libya at such a crucial moment in the nation's history...
His earlier experience in Libya allowed him to provide the kind of on-the-ground analysis that is often in short supply in such crises. He had credibility among the rebels and could help guide the U.S. government as it sought to figure out the complicated nature of a fast-moving revolt.

When Gadhafi's forces gained the momentum and began advancing toward Benghazi, President Obama agreed to the NATO air campaign that halted that offensive and allowed the rebels to regain the upper hand. Gadhafi fled Tripoli in August 2011 and was killed two months later.
Stevens, meanwhile, was named ambassador to Libya in May as the country struggled to build a new political system, restart its economy and create institutions almost from scratch. Stevens was widely respected for the time he had spent with the rebels during the uprising and his deep knowledge of a place that had largely been off-limits to Americans.
"I was thrilled to watch the Libyan people stand up and demand their rights," Stevens said in a video put out by the State Departmentshortly before he assumed his post as ambassador.
A graduate of the University of California, Berkeley, Stevens joined the Peace Corps and spent two years teaching English in the High Atlas Mountains of Morocco.
"I quickly grew to love this part of the world," Stevens said in the video.
He was thrilled that so many Libyans thought so highly of the United States and wanted to rebuild relations after their revolution.
"One of the things that impressed me when I was last in Libya was listening to the stories from the people who are old enough to have traveled and studied in the U.S. back in the days when we had closer relations. Those days are back," Stevens said.
He noted that 1,700 Libyans applied for Fulbright scholarships to study in the US this year, more than any other country in the world.
Robin Wright, a former foreign correspondent now at the Woodrow Wilson Center in Washington, offered this tribute to Stevens in a Facebook posting:
"He represented the very best of American diplomacy. He knew the streets, not just the elites. He had an infectious enthusiasm about the extraordinary history playing out across the Middle East, which he witnessed up close.
He got it. He spoke the language and knew the culture. He never flinched even slightly about the dangers — whether serving in a country when Qaddafi was in power, or heading the US office in Benghazi during Libya's uprising, or going back to become ambassador during a difficult transition. The United States has lost an incredible envoy. And I have lost a wonderful friend."...
He was one of the good guys, and he will be sorely missed.
Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#4 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 09:07 PM

View Postoffworlder, on 12 September 2012 - 10:05 AM, said:

Can you believe, that people reacting to some movie film made out somewhere, with no connection
or control involving government, attack and blow up and burn and/or murder Americans?

http://www.cnn.com/2....html?hpt=wo_c1

' An "angry crowd" marched on the U.S. compound Tuesday, furious about an American-produced online film considered offensive to Muslims, said Libya's Deputy Interior Minister Wanis al-Sharif .
The U.S. mission in Egypt was also attacked Tuesday in response to the film depicting the prophet Mohammed as a child molester, womanizer and ruthless killer.
Stevens was the first U.S. ambassador to be killed in an attack since 1979.
'
' U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton identified a second victim as Sean Smith, a Foreign Service information management officer who was a 10-year veteran of the State Department, a husband and a father of two.
The two other victims have not been named.
'
In Bengazi-
' The U.S. mission is very badly damaged and was being looted on Wednesday, said a contractor working at the mission, who asked not to be named for security reasons.
He said he saw the bodies of all four Americans on the street Wednesday morning. ;

http://www.bbc.co.uk...africa-19570254

BBCWorld reports,
' The US ambassador to Libya is among four Americans killed in an attack on the US consulate in Benghazi, President Barack Obama has confirmed.

Unidentified armed men stormed the grounds overnight amid uproar among Muslims over a US-produced film said to insult the Prophet Muhammad.
They shot at buildings and threw handmade bombs into the compound.
It has not been confirmed how the ambassador, J Christopher Stevens, and the others died.

I say it was just an excuse to be hooligan yobs blowing up Americans, run out n the street violence rather than be responsible or constructive or positive- I mean, a movie film? They cannot believe that anyone in Bengazi is connected.

Yes, of course I can believe that a mob rose to demand our first amendment liberties be ended to suit their vulnerable feelings.
It isn't the first time.
Outrage over rumored Koran desecration has cost lives before.

There is a movement from the sensitive religious segment of the ummah to criminalize blasphemy against their faith and prominent figures in it.
There is even momentum at the U.N. to satisfy their desire to silence critics.

And of course, the Rushdie fatwah is an old example.

In terms of the Libya attack being a "terrorist" attack and the protest being used as a cover to enable it, maybe so.
Does that mean that those who suggest they are entitled to kill in response to religious feather ruffling should not be told they are wrong?
"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#5 scherzo

scherzo

    I know things

  • Islander
  • 3,388 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 10:22 PM

You think this "angry crowd" would be offended if I made a movie where Muslims are depicted murdering non-believers, stoning women to death, and encouraging children to martyr themselves in the name of their religion? :think:
"Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so."    -Ronald Reagan, October 27 1964
Posted Image

#6 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 10:58 PM

http://egypt.usembas...v/pr091112.html

Quote

We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others

In my many tirades against Obama supporters, I have had to explain tha O bama's World Apology Tour was in fact a World Apology Tour. Just like many love to insist Obama is not a socialist, or wasn't born in Keynesia, it is fun.
Like the Cairo speech, this pandering (or surrender) to religious zealots is the opposite of defending our constitution and our liberties.

People do not have the right to not be offended.
Religions are not immune from criticism.
And bullies are just bullies. The best solution in dealing with bullies is to publicly humiliate them.

Edited by DarthMarley, 12 September 2012 - 10:59 PM.

"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#7 Themis

Themis
  • Islander
  • 6,544 posts

Posted 12 September 2012 - 11:11 PM

View Postscherzo, on 12 September 2012 - 10:22 PM, said:

You think this "angry crowd" would be offended if I made a movie where Muslims are depicted murdering non-believers, stoning women to death, and encouraging children to martyr themselves in the name of their religion? :think:

As long as you didn't have any image of Muhammad, you'd probably be ok...  

I can almost understand them getting upset about how their prophet is portrayed in a Muslim country, but not when the "offense" occurs elsewhere.  But I don't expect logic to play a part in these deeply rooted feelings of religious offensea nd the people getting so upset have no tradition of free speech.  In reality, I don't understand why anyone gets their knickers twisted over this stuff unless it's aimed at particular people or groups of people directly rather than the religion at large.
Cats will never be extinct!

#8 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,300 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:13 AM

View PostDarthMarley, on 12 September 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

http://egypt.usembas...v/pr091112.html

Quote

We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others

In my many tirades against Obama supporters, I have had to explain tha O bama's World Apology Tour was in fact a World Apology Tour. Just like many love to insist Obama is not a socialist, or wasn't born in Keynesia, it is fun.
Like the Cairo speech, this pandering (or surrender) to religious zealots is the opposite of defending our constitution and our liberties.

People do not have the right to not be offended.
Religions are not immune from criticism.
And bullies are just bullies. The best solution in dealing with bullies is to publicly humiliate them.

You may be perhaps unaware that this quote is entirely out of context.  The quote is of a tweet that went out from the embassy itself... without clearance from either the State Department or the White House AND quite possibly (I haven't seen final confirmation on this yet), BEFORE the attacks happened.  The "Obama apologized" talking point has zero relevance here - it's just plain false. Both President Obama and Secretary of State Clinton pushed back against these remarks.

QT

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#9 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:19 AM

View PostQueenTiye, on 13 September 2012 - 12:13 AM, said:

View PostDarthMarley, on 12 September 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

http://egypt.usembas...v/pr091112.html

Quote

We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others

In my many tirades against Obama supporters, I have had to explain tha O bama's World Apology Tour was in fact a World Apology Tour. Just like many love to insist Obama is not a socialist, or wasn't born in Keynesia, it is fun.
Like the Cairo speech, this pandering (or surrender) to religious zealots is the opposite of defending our constitution and our liberties.

People do not have the right to not be offended.
Religions are not immune from criticism.
And bullies are just bullies. The best solution in dealing with bullies is to publicly humiliate them.

You may be perhaps unaware that this quote is entirely out of context.  The quote is of a tweet that went out from the embassy itself... without clearance from either the State Department or the White House AND quite possibly (I haven't seen final confirmation on this yet), BEFORE the attacks happened.  The "Obama apologized" talking point has zero relevance here - it's just plain false. Both President Obama and Secretary of State Clinton pushed back against these remarks.

QT

You may be unaware that the quote is take from the link I posted.
Note that the domain is a .gov for the US embassy to Egypt.
I am quite aware that the White House backpedaled on the statement.
It is quite evident that it is still on the embassy's web page.
So, no, it isn't taken out of context at all.
If you still want to insist that it is, we can unpack this a little further.

>Oh darn, they took it down from the site since I posted. It was in the form of a press release statement.
Perhaps the google cache still has it.

Quote

The Embassy of the United States in Cairo condemns the continuing efforts by misguided individuals to hurt the religious feelings of Muslims – as we condemn efforts to offend believers of all religions. Today, the 11th anniversary of the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks on the United States, Americans are honoring our patriots and those who serve our nation as the fitting response to the enemies of democracy. Respect for religious beliefs is a cornerstone of American democracy. We firmly reject the actions by those who abuse the universal right of free speech to hurt the religious beliefs of others

Edited by DarthMarley, 13 September 2012 - 12:30 AM.

"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#10 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:27 AM

http://uk.news.yahoo...-190209814.html

Quote

General Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff, called a Florida pastor on Wednesday and asked him to withdraw his support for a film whose portrayal of the Prophet Mohammad has been linked to violent protests - including one that ended with the death of America's envoy to Libya.
"In the brief call, Gen. Dempsey expressed his concerns over the nature of the film, the tensions it will inflame and the violence it will cause," Dempsey's spokesman, Colonel Dave Lapan, told Reuters.

Note that the article reports  the Taliban has called for Afghanis to "take revenge" for the film on US soldiers.
So it is, not as the OP said "an excuse to be hooligan yobs."

Related to the issue: http://www.ifla.org/...f-religion-laws
"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#11 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,300 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:27 AM

No - actually I stand corrected - the sentence by itself made me think it was the original embassy tweet that came Gov. Romney reacted to.

The quote is still out of context. :) It was only one paragraph long, and included a rejection of violence in response to being offended by someone else's speech.  But the file is gone, and the one place I know to get the full quote (which I've seen earlier today) is going to take too long to dig up.

QT

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#12 Dev F

Dev F

    Straighten your pope hat!

  • Islander
  • 3,757 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:49 AM

View PostDarthMarley, on 13 September 2012 - 12:19 AM, said:

You may be unaware that the quote is take from the link I posted.
Note that the domain is a .gov for the US embassy to Egypt.
I am quite aware that the White House backpedaled on the statement.
It is quite evident that it is still on the embassy's web page.
So, no, it isn't taken out of context at all.
Of course it is. The context is that, yes, this statement was released before the attack in Libya, and even before the protests in Egypt got out of hand. I'm not sure how it amounts to a "surrender" to violent actions that hadn't even happened yet! And certainly the embassy didn't condemn the film instead of condemning the violence, which is what the critics are now suggesting.

It also doesn't constitute an attack on our freedom of speech to acknowledge that some uses of that freedom are ugly, foolish, and dangerous. Directing juvenile and deliberately incendiary insults toward an entire religion -- the religion not just of the men who killed Chris Stevens but also those who fought to protect him and now mourn and apologize for his death -- is not some heroic act.

#13 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 12:55 AM

The full quote is as it appears in my edit.
The tweet may have differed, but that is the text as it appeared at the link.

How can it be out of context? What context is missing?

In terms of it being prudent in the face of a mob storming the gates, I get it, try to ease tensions.
but once a bully prevails, and you have lived, what do you do?

Is the position that we should self-censor, lest violent religious believers harm or kill us, a reasonable one?

There was a video on the news yesterday, and I don't know if it was an Egyptian or Libyan speaking, but the message was; if you make us angry, we will kill you.
How to best respond to such a posture is a question to settle.

This is a good article on the offending film in question:

http://worldnews.nbc...attack-in-libya

My scan of the trailer leads me to belive Pastor Jones would have a rather shocked audience. It isn't pornography, but the sexual situations, putting the woman "in charge" would perhaps outrage many of the conservative pastor's flock, as well as most Muslim men.

Yes, the film is offensive.
So what?
How should the world deal with people who insist on violent eruptions when they are offended?
Is it better to submit, and try to not offend the bully? Or is it better to insist the bully modify their behavior?
"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#14 QueenTiye

QueenTiye

    Behavior is not reproducible over multiple trials.

  • Islander
  • 24,300 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:11 AM

If I issue a full, one paragraph statement, and you only quote one sentence, and leave out the balancing next sentence, then you're taking me out of context. To convey the full,contextual meaning both the statement and the counterbalance must be included.

QT

Een Draght Mackt Maght


#15 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:16 AM

View PostDev F, on 13 September 2012 - 12:49 AM, said:

View PostDarthMarley, on 13 September 2012 - 12:19 AM, said:

You may be unaware that the quote is take from the link I posted.
Note that the domain is a .gov for the US embassy to Egypt.
I am quite aware that the White House backpedaled on the statement.
It is quite evident that it is still on the embassy's web page.
So, no, it isn't taken out of context at all.
Of course it is. The context is that, yes, this statement was released before the attack in Libya, and even before the protests in Egypt got out of hand. I'm not sure how it amounts to a "surrender" to violent actions that hadn't even happened yet! And certainly the embassy didn't condemn the film instead of condemning the violence, which is what the critics are now suggesting.

It also doesn't constitute an attack on our freedom of speech to acknowledge that some uses of that freedom are ugly, foolish, and dangerous. Directing juvenile and deliberately incendiary insults toward an entire religion -- the religion not just of the men who killed Chris Stevens but also those who fought to protect him and now mourn and apologize for his death -- is not some heroic act.

Even if the attack on our embassy never happened, and our ambassador to Libya was not assasinated, the press release does not reflect American values.
Pointing to the timeline and claiming "Nothing had happened yet when the statement was made, so your argument is invalid" just doesn't hold up.
It is political spin that the Obama campaign has forwarded to the chattering political shows.

Back long ago, when the evangelical right was complaining about NEA funding for Mapplethorp and the urine soaked crucifix that were funded with US tax dollars, none of this was much aof a concern among the left.
Why might that be?

But frankly, I find the suggestion that this is "taken out of context" to be a hostile (and unsubstantiable) claim.
First, it is a claim that the quote is out of context.
Nope.
Next, it is asserted that the "context" of other events means my true claim is "out of context" and somehow shouldn't be taken to mean what it obviously says.
So if we are to go down that road, lets go all the way down that road.

Obama speaks in Cairo to the Muslim world as part of his appeasement strategy.

Newsweek prints a rumor of scriptural desecration, and rioting mobs kill a few of their own members in their outrage.

Scriptures get burned in Afghanistan, again, riots, deaths, and the soldiers involved get punished, for burning a book.

The idea that we must modify our behavior to cater to a violent mob is surrender to a violent mob.

How is that working for us so far?
An appeasing message goes out, and the mob still comes.

Obviously, I support a position with more testicular fortitude.
We should tell all who try to extort concessions (in this case, our very liberty to speak) that their position is not a healthy one for them to take.
And then demonstrate our resolve on the matter.


Here is the US govt definition of terrorism:

http://yeoldeconscio....com/art98.html

Quote

appears to be intended (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population; (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by assassination or kidnapping.

Clearly, the assasination in Libya meets that criterion.
Equally clear is taht the mob intimidation is designed to extort (influence) the civilian population (filmmakers, like the recent one causing the outrage, or Theo van Gogh, scholars who criticize, other religious figures with a different view, etc.).
We are dealing with a mob of terrorists, and our government sends an appeasing love letter, and blames the victim (which is not the outraged belivers).
"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#16 DarthMarley

DarthMarley
  • Islander
  • 1,292 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 01:26 AM

View PostQueenTiye, on 13 September 2012 - 01:11 AM, said:

If I issue a full, one paragraph statement, and you only quote one sentence, and leave out the balancing next sentence, then you're taking me out of context. To convey the full,contextual meaning both the statement and the counterbalance must be included.

QT

What balancing sentence are you claiming I have left out?

http://en.wikipedia...._out_of_context

Quote

The practice of quoting out of context, sometimes referred to as "contextomy" or "quote mining", is a logical fallacy and a type of false attribution in which a passage is removed from its surrounding matter in such a way as to distort its intended meaning

Since we are still going down this road, I think you should identify the "balancing statement" I am omitting in order to distort its meaning.
Otherwise, this is just a rhetorical smear against me.

Our state dept. didn't defend American liberties, and instead apologized for them, and berated, not the angry mob, but the American exercising their rights.
That happened.
Calling it "out of context" doesn't change the frame, our government did this.

Edited by DarthMarley, 13 September 2012 - 01:27 AM.

"It is not who is right, but what is right that is of importance."

#17 Nonny

Nonny

    Scourge of Pretentious Bad Latin

  • Islander
  • 31,142 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 09:14 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2....html?hpt=hp_t2
Staff and crew of film that ridiculed Muslims say they were 'grossly misled'

Quote

The 80 cast and crew members involved in the making of the movie that has roiled much of the Islamic world said Wednesday they were "grossly misled" about its intent and expressed sorrow over the resulting violence.
"The entire cast and crew are extremely upset and feel taken advantage of by the producer," they said in a statement to CNN about the movie, "Innocence of Muslims."
"We are 100% not behind this film and were grossly misled about its intent and purpose," continued the statement, which was sent to CNN by a member of the production staff who asked not to be identified for security reasons. "We are shocked by the drastic rewrites of the script and lies that were told to all involved. We are deeply saddened by the tragedies that have occurred."
Four Americans, including U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens, were killed Tuesday in Libya amid a regional furor over the film, which mocks Islam's prophet.
A casting call published in July 2011 in Backstage magazine and in other publications for actors identifies the working title of the movie as "Desert Warrior" and describes it as a "historical Arabian Desert adventure film."
An actress in the film who asked not to be identified said the original script did not include a Prophet Muhammed character. She added that she and other actors complained that their lines had been changed.
The actress said she spoke Wednesday with the producer, who is identified in the advertisement as Sam Bassiel. "He said he wrote the script because he wants the Muslims to quit killing," she said. "I had no idea he was doing all this."
"I would never be involved in a film to ever hurt or bring harm to anybody," she told CNN. "This makes me sick to my stomach to think that I was involved in that movie that brought death to somebody else."
The actress said the character of Muhammed in the movie was identified as George when it was shot, and that she returned afterward and read other lines that may have been dubbed into the piece.
A member of the production staff who worked directly on the film and has a copy of the original script corroborated the actor's account, adding that it mentions neither Muhammed nor Islam....


Posted Image


The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#18 Balderdash

Balderdash
  • Islander
  • 5,729 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 10:19 AM

IMO:

Mitt Romney needs to wait until he knows what he is talking about and stop trying to embarrass my country and our President
when the sh*t is hitting the fan.  Sit down and shut up.  You want have to worry about looking foolish and opportunistic if you
will follow those simple steps, sit down and shut up.

President Obama did not apologize and he said that those responsible will be punished.

I don't care what made the lunatic radical Muslims angry, they can be angry and they can learn how to handle their anger just
like the rest of the civilized world..  The next time some jackwad Religious leader issues a Fatwa against a person because they
feel that Mohammed has had his feelings hurt, I think we need to, as a group stomp the crap out of the Fatwa issuer.  Enough
is enough, the rest of the world should stop kissing these loons asses and start holding THEM accountable.

Another Democrat leaning Independent that has to search for truth because it can't be found on Fox News OR MSNBC.



"Being gay is not a Western invention, it is a human reality"  by HRC


#19 Tricia

Tricia

    To err on the side of kindness is seldom an error.

  • Islander
  • 10,245 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:02 AM

Always better to wait and find out more of the facts than to speak up and say something that will be proven wrong later.  

John McCain speaks up on this attack...and he may not like Obama's foreign  policies but that's not really what he is speaking about here--

http://news.yahoo.co...-111254340.html

Quote

McCain, who is ranking member of the Senate armed services committee, said that Libya is a dangerous place, but emphasized that the "overwhelming majority" of Libyans voted for a moderate government and did not rise up with al Qaeda and terrorists. That is, the attacks on the consulate are an ill representation of the Libyan people.
"It was a terrorist attack. It wasn't the result of a mob being excited. It was a group of jihadists who were well-armed and well-trained and well-equipped, and they decided to attack the consulate in Benghazi and try and kill people. That's far different from what happened in Cairo, where a mob was whipped into a frenzy by these people who were talking about this so-called movie that insults Mohammed."
As for the Obama administration's handling of the crisis, McCain was almost entirely positive. "I think it was fine. By the way, Secretary of State Hilary Clinton gave a marvelous statement today," said McCain. He did not offer such praise for the Romney campaign's statements on the events.

Also I am looking for stories to link on how the Libyan people supported and mourn this attack. And have spoken out against it.  I know those stories exist as I saw the clips on the news last night and this morning.

edit to add link to the Bengazi pics  of support and condemnation of the attacks. http://imgur.com/a/tlCyI

Edited by Tricia, 13 September 2012 - 11:46 AM.

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#20 Kota

Kota
  • Islander
  • 417 posts

Posted 13 September 2012 - 11:16 AM

Romney made a stong statement, something President Obama should have done -

John McCain also had something to say about it:

McCain backs Romney

Quote

Republican nominee Mitt Romney has been suggesting that President Barack Obama is weak and didn't react quickly enough to condemn attacks on U.S. missions overseas. He was backed up Thursday by the party's last presidential nominee, Sen. John McCain, who said Obama has a "feckless foreign policy" that has left America weaker.




Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: 2012

0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users