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Libya was “an act of terror”? B-but you said...

Benghazi Attack Terrorism Obama 2012

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#1 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 11:03 AM

OK...so it looks like Team 0bama was deliberately pushing a false narrative to cover their a$$ over this Middle East clusterf**k. But scapegoating an anti-Muslim video from months ago that virtually no one had seen(and spreading the word of it's existence in the process) is a Hail Mary of cynical spin, that no one in their right mind could expect to get away with. That is...in a world where the major media outlets aren't essentially an arm of your re-election committee.

Now that harsh and inescapable reality has forced the White House to admit a terrorist raid on the Benghazi consulate was carried out, my only question is this: Can a corrupt major media that has abandoned all pretense at objectivity...successfully protect their candidate from what should be worldwide humiliation?

The Christian Science Monitor has broken down this incident nicely:

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After a week of hesitation, the White House now says it is “self-evident” that a “terrorist attack,” and not just a spontaneous reaction from a furious mob, struck the US Consulate in Benghazi,Libya, last week.

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The characterization is important, because it opens the door to the conclusion that the attack was a preplanned assault, resulting in the deaths of four US diplomats, including the US ambassador to Libya, Christopher Stevens.

The repercussions of declaring that the Benghazi attack was a planned terrorist assault on the United States would be extensive. For starters, it would raise questions about the Obama administration’s precautions in a volatile region and its preparedness for anti-US strikes in an area known to harbor Al Qaeda and other Islamist extremist elements.

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More broadly, it could call into question President Obama’s Middle East policy in the wake of the Arab awakening. Some Republican critics are already tarring the policy as too weak and dismissive of the threats that the region’s tumult presents.
Even now Team 0bama is trying to cushion the blow with increasingly desperate spin.

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Today the White House finally conceded that the attack was “an act of terror” but gave no other details. This admission follows testimony to Congress yesterday by Matt Olsen, Director of the National Counterterrorism Center, that the attack was in fact carried out by terrorists but was, he claimed, “spontaneous.”
:rolleyes: Has there ever been an administration more convinced that the general public is as stupid as they are?(cue the Pavlovian attack on Bush in 3...2...1...)

Edited by scherzo, 23 September 2012 - 11:09 AM.

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#2 Nonny

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 12:19 PM

View Postscherzo, on 23 September 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

Has there ever been an administration more convinced that the general public is as stupid as they are?(cue the Pavlovian attack on Bush in 3...2...1...)
Not at all.  The Bush Administration had no idea of just how stupid they [clarification: the Bush Administration, not the public] were.

Edited by Nonny, 23 September 2012 - 12:21 PM.

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The once and future Nonny

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#3 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 12:38 PM

Right on cue.
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#4 Nonny

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 12:41 PM

More to the point, however: http://www.huffingto..._n_1907114.html
Robert Gibbs Says White House Did Not Mislead On Libya Crisis


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"No one intentionally or unintentionally misled anyone involved in this," Gibbs said, during an appearance on "Fox News Sunday." "We learned more information every single day about what happened. Nobody wants to get to the bottom of this faster than we do."
For several days after the incident the White House sent mixed messages about what it believed had happened during the attacks, which initially were thought to be part of a broader range of protests against an obscure anti-Islam film. But the administration's early insistence that the attacks were not planned was quickly contradicted by voices from Libya, Congress and even the State Department, who described the attacks as likely pre-planned and coordinated...
On Friday, Carney finally acknowledged that it was "self-evident" that the attack was terrorism.
"I think as you heard Ambassador Rice say, the best information that we had at the point at which she gave that answer was answer that she gave," Gibbs said, after watching the clip of Rice. "As we have learned more, and as this investigation continues, I anticipate we will continue to learn more facts about the awful assassination and murder of our great ambassador in Libya."

Meanwhile, the important part remains the murder of an ambassador and staff, and not the need of the President's political opponents to turn tragedy into opportunity.

And speaking of important, I got places to go and things to do today.  Carry on.

Edited by Nonny, 23 September 2012 - 12:43 PM.

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The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#5 Nonny

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 12:41 PM

View Postscherzo, on 23 September 2012 - 12:38 PM, said:

Right on cue.
Wrong cue.
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The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#6 BklnScott

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 12:55 PM

So the charge here is that the picture of what really happened during the chaos on the ground in Benghazi changed as we learned more...?  

Potent stuff.

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#7 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 01:00 PM

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Meanwhile, the important part remains the murder of an ambassador and staff, and not the need of the President's political opponents to turn tragedy into opportunity.
:lol: Yeah let's pretend this administration's incompetence didn't contribute to their deaths...and ignore their embarrassing attempts to blame everyone and everything but themselves for the incident.

Good luck getting non-leftists to go along with the gag.

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"No one intentionally or unintentionally misled anyone involved in this," Gibbs said, during an appearance on "Fox News Sunday." "We learned more information every single day about what happened. Nobody wants to get to the bottom of this faster than we do."

Too bad they didn't pay attention to the information they had BEFORE the incident even happened Gibby
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#8 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 01:24 PM

View PostBklnScott, on 23 September 2012 - 12:55 PM, said:

So the charge here is that the picture of what really happened during the chaos on the ground in Benghazi changed as we learned more...?  

Potent stuff.
They embraced the flimsiest theory on the table, while eschewing common sense, in front of an incredulous press corp.

Even ignoring the fact that we now know they received warnings well before the attack, Team 0bama was obviously stretching the boundaries of credibility. Everything they said initially was lies(or just stupid, if you wanna be charitable) and then have the nerve to say Mitt  "shoots first, aims later". They're a hard bunch not to despise.
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#9 Balderdash

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 01:38 PM

The fabricated outrage from the right and Fox News (News?) would be funny if it weren't kind of dangerous.  If there isn't a real way to
undermine the administration that has actually done something about al-qaeda and bin Laden (dead on Obama's watch) lets make up
some scary.  I prefer my world politics to be diplomatic.

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#10 BklnScott

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 01:39 PM

Well, the right should go with that if that's the best they've got to go on.

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#11 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 01:56 PM

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The fabricated outrage from the right and Fox News (News?) would be funny if it weren't kind of dangerous.  If there isn't a real way to
undermine the administration that has actually done something about al-qaeda and bin Laden (dead on Obama's watch) lets make up
some scary.  I prefer my world politics to be diplomatic.
You do know Muslim radicals were responsible for the slaughter of our people in Benghazi right?  You're recommending "diplomacy" as the antidote to Islamic extremism? :dontgetit:

If outrage over the cover-up of stunning incompetence by Team 0bama is "Dangerous"...what do we call actual foreign policy that turned Egypt over to hardcore Islamists, and helped remove Qaddafi from Libya? Feeling safer? If so...based on what?
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#12 Lin731

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 02:01 PM

Let's see, we had 911 (which more and more documentation indicated President Bush ignored the warnings on). We then invade Iraq on the pretext that A. Saddam was involved (implied endlessly) and  B. That he had WMD which he didn't, while also going into Afghanistan (which should have been the main focus and wasn't) All unfunded mind you. Yet we're discussing the incompetence of Obama?  The guy who on his watch took out Bin Laden and a host of other high ranking terrorist. Ummm OKAY. All while seemingly ignoring that Obama's press secretary stated days back that they didn't have FACTS at that time to indicate it was a planned attacked (aka...months and months of planning and prep etc...)

Then we go to Mitt Romney, that paragon of foreign policy wonkage. His thrust seemed to be let's build up the military (I wasn't aware it lacking) and basically saber rattling. So while he talks about reining in spending on the one hand, on the other he talks about ratcheting up spending on the military? All this after Gaffefest 2012 in Europe. He comes across as clueless on foreign policy and this is the guy the GOP wants in the Oval Office?

edited for typo

Edited by Lin731, 23 September 2012 - 02:03 PM.

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#13 SparkyCola

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 02:01 PM

Last I saw people weren't sure whether this was:

a) a terrorist attack designed to coincide with the anniversary of 9/11
b) a reaction to a film which yes, was months ago, but was recently shown for the first time on TV in Libya.

Either one seems plausible. To me though it matters much much less which answer is the correct one. I don't care which party is in power in the USA. It's simply not possible to prevent terrorist attacks from ever happening, anywhere, ever. It isn't.

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#14 offworlder

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 02:09 PM

I was a lil surprised when I heard the administration say the thing about spontaneous after we heard from - but let's remember three things- One, their priority was Americans in a newly flaming place, flaming that day, RPG and all that- Two, what they actually said and the press got it wrong by quoting pieces and not full things, that they had no factual evidence in hand yet to prove this was a pre planned... and they didn't want to speak conjecture like everyone else was doing- Three, I am not surprised at all that the West wing didn't have agents on the ground interviewing, I mean that day and the next, the witnesses from all over breadth saying all kinds of things to the press, the way the press were getting, 'when it began I heard, I saw, and there was no...' and so forth, like the various foreign press had; oh, and Four, it is regular and everyone is used to it when an event comes up and not stopped and it's bad the opposition make it out that the ones in power were so much worse on it than themselves.

PS,yeah, like this would have been different with W in the west wing eh? ;)

PS2, oh I know, let's all have that Herbert Walker time back there in 1991 where flags were waving, right-wing foreign affairs were so illustrious, economy and jobs and spending were so perfect, and just stay there just keep waking up and it's then, then is now; and all so good that a right wing would win the 1992 election- oh wait!

"(Do you read what they say online?) I check out all these scandalous rumours about me and Elijah Wood having beautiful sex with each other ... (are they true?) About Elijah and me being boyfriend and boyfriend? Absolutely true. We've been together for about nine years. I wooed him. No I just like a lot of stuff - I like that someone says one thing and it becomes fact. It's kind of fun." --Dominic Monaghan in a phone interview with Newsweek while buying DVDs at the store. :D

#15 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 02:29 PM

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Let's see, we had 911 (which more and more documentation indicated President Bush ignored the warnings on). We then invade Iraq on the pretext that A. Saddam was involved (implied endlessly) and  B. That he had WMD which he didn't, while also going into Afghanistan (which should have been the main focus and wasn't) All unfunded mind you. Yet we're discussing the incompetence of Obama?
Yeah imagine that. Discussing something that happened a WEEK AGO, rather than hard-left spin that's over a decade old.

We need to get our priorities together people!

Edited by scherzo, 23 September 2012 - 02:29 PM.

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#16 Orpheus

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 02:30 PM

I think that it is fairly well-established now that Bengazi was an organized armed attack in the context of lax Embassy security (an unfortified building with no Marine protection), and concerns by the local government that were tragically disregarded.

It's hard for me to see how (any) Bush figures into this at all.

#17 Lin731

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 03:58 PM

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It's hard for me to see how (any) Bush figures into this at all.

Only in the sense that somehow this administration is so horribly inept (aka....compared to the last one)?  Conservatives weren't talking about incompetence on the part of President Bush and probably still aren't even given that more documentation has come out regarding ignoring intell regarding 911. Yet the conservative media and many members are touting this as some A. Horrible lie by the Obama administration or B. Incompetence in not just automatically asserting it was a planned attack.
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#18 Balderdash

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 05:05 PM

View PostOrpheus, on 23 September 2012 - 02:30 PM, said:

I think that it is fairly well-established now that Bengazi was an organized armed attack in the context of lax Embassy security (an unfortified building with no Marine protection), and concerns by the local government that were tragically disregarded.

It's hard for me to see how (any) Bush figures into this at all.

The only reason a Bush figures into this at all is that the Right didn't seem to care what their guys did, it was all good.  But now we can
hold this President to account for everything including stuff that clearly still belongs to a Bush.  And honestly I would never bring a
Bush up if the Right weren't continually squealing that the sky is falling every other minute.  They hold this President to an insane
level competence when they held their guy to NONE.  So yeah, given a few days to get the facts together it's pretty clear that it was
a terrorist attack and not some random pissed off Muslims.  And since all Muslims are not radical terrorists I'm glad that we aren't
randomly accusing all Muslims.

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#19 offworlder

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 05:40 PM

correct me if I'm wrong, but I've never heard of consulates having Marine uniformed guards let alone armed, or particular high end security systems and concrete berms and steel bulwarks and all like the Green Zone - and yes, even the top pro press confused the terms embassy with consulate ;)
But, I also want to address Sparky's: I say it was both, the a) and the b)- one guard who ran but later spoke to press as an eye witness said the demo mob was not there yet when the concerted attack came suddenly with great fury and rpg explosions from three directions at once like a military operation; then the mob arrived after the start; now I don't know if he's wrong but I was not an eye witness even to think of disputing him; but it was clear to witnesses that this was a these, Two; a demo mob arrived to chant and yell and toss smoke bombs and even molotov a truck or car, AND a militia operator group with rpg and machine guns, maybe grenades too, made a three flank attack including blasting their way into the consulate which is a leased biz mogul villa, one of the witnesses with press reports was the landlord. Then ambassador Chris and his team including at least one Marine and StateDep sec officers, Seals, moved the staff over to a safe house according to plans but the attackers and it seems even the mob had info bout that safe house, but also prolly some of them followed staff to it,

at any rate, there was then the attack on staff at the safe house where Chris died, and the Seals died in the fight defending everyone. So, both.
"(Do you read what they say online?) I check out all these scandalous rumours about me and Elijah Wood having beautiful sex with each other ... (are they true?) About Elijah and me being boyfriend and boyfriend? Absolutely true. We've been together for about nine years. I wooed him. No I just like a lot of stuff - I like that someone says one thing and it becomes fact. It's kind of fun." --Dominic Monaghan in a phone interview with Newsweek while buying DVDs at the store. :D

#20 scherzo

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Posted 23 September 2012 - 05:40 PM

Quote

It's hard for me to see how (any) Bush figures into this at all.
He doesn't.

Not even tangentially.

And yet...I correctly predicted he'd be brought up to absolve 0bama of ANY wrongdoing.

I've clearly been navigating these waters for far too long. :(
"Well, the trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so."    -Ronald Reagan, October 27 1964
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