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Chris Christie's Waterloo?

New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie 2014 Bridgegate

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#41 Cait

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 01:11 AM

View PostKota, on 09 January 2014 - 11:02 PM, said:

Quote

Yesterday, the Bergen Record reported that a 91 year old woman died during New Jersey Governor Chris Christies bridge traffic scandal, possibly because emergency response teams could not reach her in time. Today, the daughter of that woman is saying she believes the death had nothing do with “Bridgegate.”

“I honestly believe it was just her time,” Vilma Oleri, whose mother, Florence Genova, died on the morning of September 9th, told The New York Times. “We want to stay out of it. It’s not political.”

Genova’s son-in-law Frank Oleri told the Times, “We believe she died in her home, but they couldn’t pronounce her until she got to the hospital. “The traffic didn’t make any difference.”
http://www.mediaite....-mothers-death/

Let's hope and pray this is true.  But, even if it is, a public safety issue was created deliberately for political reasons.  It could have been worse, and there is no good reason for its creation.  Let's be thankful if the son-in-law is correct, but let's not try and whitewash the public safety issues at the same time.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#42 Nikcara

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 01:30 PM

*
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Just to speak on the medical side for a moment, declaring death depends on the level of emergency responder and local laws.  

There are several levels of EMTs.  EMT-basics, the lowest level you'll have on an ambulance, can declare someone dead if it's obvious.  These include things like decapitation or lividity (pooling of blood in the lowest parts of the body).  If the lady had died recently she wouldn't have had these symptoms and may have been transported.

If they had a paramedic on board (EMT-P, the highest level), they could have done a 12-lead EKG, seen the lack of electrical activity in the heart, and declared her dead on scene.  They can also use a few other methods to determine death that a basic can't.  

All that said, it's quite possible that the lady was dying but didn't meet the medical definition of death when EMS arrived.  It's very possible that the delay neither helped nor hindered what nature intended, but if I was working on that ambulance I would be furious.  Not because it would change the outcome necessarily, but because even if a patient is going to die they deserve to be cared for and their families deserve to know that someone is caring for them.  Long delays in treatment when you know your loved one is dying is incredibly stressful for the family.
We have fourty million reasons for failure, but not a single excuse  -- Rudyard Kipling

Develop compassion for your enemies, that is genuine compassion.  Limited compassion cannot produce this altruism.  -- H. H. the Dalai Lama

#43 Cait

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Posted 10 January 2014 - 05:56 PM

Well, apparently this story isn't over yet...

http://www.motherjon...na-text-message


Quote

Yet text messages turned over to investigators by Wildstein raise the possibility that months before the disclosure this week of Kelly's bombshell email—"Time for some traffic problems in Fort Lee"—other senior Christie aides knew the traffic study excuse wasn't true.

[...]


Quote

Immediately after his testimony, according to documents released this week, Baroni texted David Wildstein asking how Christie administration officials in Trenton, the state capital, had reacted to his testimony:


[11/25/2013 11:58 AM] David Wildstein: You did great
[11/25/2013 11:58 AM] Bill Baroni: Trenton feedback
[11/25/2013 11:59 AM] Bill Baroni: ?
[11/25/2013 11:59 AM] David Wildstein: Good
[REDACTED MESSAGE]
[11/25/2013 11:59 AM] Bill Baroni: Just good? Shit
[11/25/2013 12:00 PM] David Wildstein: No i have only texted brudget [Bridget Anne Kelly] and Nicole they were VERY happy
[11/25/2013 12:00 PM] Bill Baroni: Ok
[11/25/2013 12:00 PM] David Wildstein: Both said you are doing great
[11/25/2013 12:06 PM] David Wildstein: Charlie said you did GREAT


Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#44 Spectacles

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Posted 11 January 2014 - 07:26 PM

Interesting:

http://www.huffingto..._n_4582353.html

Quote

Two days after New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie ® claimed he had no knowledge of a political scheme conducted by his aides to cause traffic jams, the lawmaker heading a probe into those actions unraveled a new thread.

New Jersey Assemblyman John Wisniewski (D) told NBC News Saturday that if Christie was at all aware of his aides' actions, impeachment could emerge as a potential issue.

"Using the George Washington Bridge, a public resource, to exact a political vendetta, is a crime," Wisniewski said. "Having people use their official position to have a political game is a crime. So if those tie back to the governor in any way, it clearly becomes an impeachable offense."

"It's hard to really accept the governor's statement that he knew nothing until the other morning," Wisnieswki added.

It's not even up for debate: Christie's staff closed the bridge for political payback.

The only remaining question is, as with Watergate, what did Christie know and when did he know it.

It's going to be interesting to see if the staffers he threw under the bus will remain loyal to him as they are faced with possible criminal charges.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#45 Cait

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Posted 11 January 2014 - 07:40 PM

It'll be interesting to see how long this plays on and how much will actually stick to Christie.  I'm old enough to remember Iran/Contra and none of it stuck to Reagan.  Scandals seem to rely on media longevity, and what sticks, more than on actual wrong doing.  That's a shame, but historically true.  I suppose if someone could predict what would actually stick, they'd be a billionaire.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#46 Themis

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Posted 11 January 2014 - 07:43 PM

Hard to believe he was ignorant... at least suspicious.  Politics - one of humanity's greater failings.
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#47 Nonny

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 07:41 AM

View PostNonny, on 09 January 2014 - 09:57 AM, said:

earworm!

Quote

Waterloo  Waterloo  where will you meet your Waterloo
Every puppy has his day everybody has to pay
Everybody has to meet his Waterloo

I can't wait to see which GOP commentator declares that Chrisite was a Democrat all along first.   :rolleyes:
Silly me!  Of course they blamed women first!  :facepalm-f7e:
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"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#48 Cait

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 10:15 AM

http://www.huffingto..._n_4588132.html

Well, I guess Democrats smell fresh blood in the water!

Quote


New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie ® is facing a federal investigation into whether the governor used Hurricane Sandy relief money to produce tourism ads starring himself and his family, Rep. Frank Pallone (D-N.J) told CNN Sunday. The New Jersey lawmaker said the inspector general for the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development conducted a preliminary investigation, and concluded that a full investigation is warranted.

The investigation comes as the New Jersey governor is facing a separate federal probe into revelations that his top aides engineered the temporary shutdown of access lanes to the George Washington Bridge as political retribution.

Pallone wrote a letter to the inspector general of the Department of Housing and Urban Development in August, asking why a firm with a more expensive pitch won the project to make a New Jersey tourism campaign with Hurricane Sandy relief funds. The winning firm's bid was $4.7 million, while a comparable firm cost $2.5 million. The more expensive idea included the Chrisities, while the cheaper pitch did not.


Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#49 BklnScott

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 12:11 PM

This one was all but certain from the moment that commercial aired.  Anybody who hasn't seen it should take a peek - is this a spot meant to highlight the jersey shore's recovery (and thus coax tourist dollars back) or is it a campaign commercial for Christie's reelection paid for by the storm relief fund (aka our tax dollars)?  

I know what it looks like to me.  

Anybody remember how this corrupt self-promoter gave the keynote at the catastrophic Republican convention and talked himself up extensively while hardly mentioning the nominee?  A picture is surely emerging for the national audience.

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There isn't enough mommy in the world to further a cause like yours!

#50 Spectacles

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 02:55 PM

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Scott: Anybody remember how this corrupt self-promoter gave the keynote at the catastrophic Republican convention and talked himself up extensively while hardly mentioning the nominee?

*raises hand*

He caught a lot of flak from the right over that one, if I recall correctly.

His long, self-aggrandizing press conference last week over the bridge scandal also has come under fire.

Milbank: http://www.washingto...65f6_story.html

I read somewhere--can't recall the source--that Christie found a way to spell apology with a bunch of I's.
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#51 BklnScott

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:24 PM

http://thinkprogress...th-certificate/

Christie just vetoed a bill that would have made it easier for transgender people to amend their birth certificates.  Because fraud.  

Srsly.

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There isn't enough mommy in the world to further a cause like yours!

#52 Nonny

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 06:03 PM

Christie knows fraud.   :sarcasm:
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The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#53 BklnScott

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 08:15 PM

Turns out the WSJ reported last month that Christie asked NY Governor Andrew Cuomo to "complain about the way a Cuomo appointee was handling the investigation."  In other words: call it off!    

http://m.us.wsj.com/...389146?mobile=y

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There isn't enough mommy in the world to further a cause like yours!

#54 Cait

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 03:10 PM

All of this is pretty circumstantial.  Maybe he forgot seeing Wildstein.  But, this is politics, and the opposition is gonna run with this.  Circumstantial or not, it looks bad.  Voters don't like it when it begins to look bad and smell.

http://blogs.wsj.com...-during-fiasco/

Quote

Also present with Mr. Christie that day were Bill Baroni, the authority’s deputy executive director, who was helping Mr. Wildstein manage the fallout from the closures among local officials, subpoenaed documents show. Also there was David Samson, the Port Authority chairman and close Christie ally, who has said he didn’t learn of the lane closures and traffic in Fort Lee, N.J., until an email from a New York port official ordered the lane closures reversed. Messrs. Samson and Baroni didn’t respond to requests for comment.


Mr. Christie addressed Mr. Wildstein in a news conference last week, saying he had not encountered him “in a long time.”

“I have had no contact with David Wildstein in a long time, a long time, well before the election,” which was held Nov. 5, Mr. Christie said last week. “You know, I could probably count on one hand the number of conversations I’ve had with David since he worked at the Port Authority. I did not interact with David.”


Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#55 Spectacles

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 03:23 PM

Quote

Posted Image
Gov. Chris Christie is seen with David Wildstein, in red tie, on Sept. 11, 2013, before a ceremony on the 12th anniversary of the 2001 World Trade Center attacks in Manhattan, in a photo obtained by The Wall Street Journal. Sept. 11 was the third day of the lane closures in Fort Lee, N.J.

Wow.....Is Christie using Boehner's tanning cream?
"Facts are stupid things." -Ronald Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things"

"Although health care enrollment is actually going pretty well at this point, thousands and maybe millions of Americans have failed to sign up for coverage because they believe the false horror stories they keep hearing." -- Paul Krugman

#56 Tricia

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 03:23 PM

Off topic I know but everytime I see this thread title I keep wanting to sing ABBA's "Waterloo"
:D

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#57 Nonny

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 03:42 PM

I'm singing the much earlier (though not that early!) Stonewall Jackson's Waterloo.  :lol:
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The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot

#58 Lin731

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 09:55 PM

Wow the water really hit the loo on this one. Will this story have legs remains to be seen as we all know what short memories the American people have. I kinda liked Christie (or the persona he displayed for the public) but if this plays out that he did in fact know about the lane closures (and it really seems that he did) and then using Sandy relief funds for self promotion...Well that will end any thought I might have entertained about him as a presidential candidate. Really makes me wonder if there IS such a thing as a competent, law abiding, moderate politician in this day and age (or a politician of any sort for that matter). Republicans as a party need to find some middle ground candidates if they want to retake the White House at the next election. They do well in the state legislatures and Governorships but the White House, not so much. The public image Christie projected (I believe) could have appealed to enough independents and moderate dems to get him elected but if this scandal drags on, his presidential asperations are done.
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#59 Cait

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 11:52 PM

View PostLin731, on 14 January 2014 - 09:55 PM, said:

The public image Christie projected (I believe) could have appealed to enough independents and moderate dems to get him elected but if this scandal drags on, his presidential asperations are done.

I agree.  But, it's probably the reason this bridge thing is going to be pushed.  Nip Christie in the bud on his Presidential ambitions.  It's probably the same reason Republicans pounce on Hillary whenever they can.  You can't begin to soon to tar and feather a possible "winner" from the opposition ya know.  True or not, push hard enough and long enough, it will become "the truth".   That's how it is in our current political climate.  Although, I think Christie would have had a hard time winning the GOP primaries regardless.  He's just too far left of the current Republican base.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#60 Nonny

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Posted 16 January 2014 - 12:28 PM

Comic: President Chris Christie, Day 100

http://www.dailykos....detail=facebook
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The once and future Nonny

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Can anyone tell me who I am quoting?  I found this with no attribution.

Fatal miscarriages are forever.

Stupid is stupid, this I believe. And ignorance is the worst kind of stupid, since ignorance is a choice.  Suzanne Brockmann

All things must be examined, debated, investigated without exception and without regard for anyone's feelings. Diderot



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