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Lunches seized from kids in debt at SLC elementary

Salt Lake City Utah School lunches 2014

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#1 Cait

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 02:02 PM

Words fail me on this one.  The cultural contempt for the poor has corrupted perception to the point of this... If I had been a cafeteria worker I would have never acted this way, even if someone ordered me to do it.  I would have paid for the lunches myself before I'd do that.  We are all in a Dickens novel.

http://www.sltrib.co...arents.html.csp

Quote

Up to 40 kids at Uintah Elementary in Salt Lake City picked up their lunches Tuesday, then watched as the meals were taken and thrown away because of outstanding balances on their accounts — a move that shocked and angered parents.
"It was pretty traumatic and humiliating," said Erica Lukes, whose 11-year-old daughter had her cafeteria lunch taken from her as she stood in line Tuesday at Uintah Elementary School, 1571 E. 1300 South.
Lukes said as far as she knew, she was all paid up. "I think it’s despicable," she said. "These are young children that shouldn’t be punished or humiliated for something the parents obviously need to clear up."
Jason Olsen, a Salt Lake City District spokesman, said the district’s child-nutrition department became aware that Uintah had a large number of students who owed money for lunches.
As a result, the child-nutrition manager visited the school and decided to withhold lunches to deal with the issue, he said.
But cafeteria workers weren’t able to see which children owed money until they had already received lunches, Olsen explained.
The workers then took those lunches from the students and threw them away, he said, because once food is served to one student it can’t be served to another.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#2 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 02:14 PM

There are no more guidelines, right? So I can say what should be done to those school workers who took the lunches from the kids, right? I can elaborate on how "drawn and quartered" has a certain appeal in this case, right? I can go into detail on how they should have that food shoved.....Well, maybe I should wait to verify just how far I can go.

IMO, this was done ONLY to humiliate and embarrass the kids. There are ways of dealing with outstanding balances...and just about ALL of those way involve dealing with the parents, not the kids. School kids are cruel enough on their own, with bullying and teasing. You take away a child's lunch for outstanding balance, you make that child a target for the bullies. A massive lawsuit filed against those workers who took the food should send the perfect message.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#3 Mikoto

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 03:05 PM

I can't believe that actually happened. I mean, surely they know a kid probably isn't going to concentrate on the afternoon lessons if he or she is desperately hungry after being denied a meal...
Rejected and gone.

#4 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 03:29 PM

It's BS stuff like this that makes me real glad I don't have kids. Because, honestly, if I found out a school worker took food from my child, in public like that...Most likely I'd be going to jail for a while.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#5 Cait

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 03:48 PM

All they had to do was let these kids go through and get their lunches.  Students that had a delinquent account should have been tallied [if this was indeed the only way to determine which kids owed on their accounts].  Someone with a brain should have then taken the list and called the parents to let them know.  Simple.  In no situation, should those lunches been taken away from the children.  What colossal idiots.  And, this is what passes for good management!

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#6 Tricia

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 03:52 PM

Per this--

Quote

As a result, the child-nutrition manager visited the school and decided to withhold lunches to deal with the issue, he said.


The childhood nutrition manager should be disciplined but I'd prefer he or she should be fired because of the following additional info from the linked OP article, further down the page--

Quote

Olsen said school officials told the district that their staffers typically tell students about any balances as they go through the lunch line and send home notifications to parents each week.
The district attempted to contact parents with balances via phone Monday and Tuesday, Olsen said, but weren’t able to reach them all before the child-nutrition manager decided to take away the students’ lunches.

Sounds like someone overstepped their authority IMO.  And apologies were made on the school districts FB page...later of course and the harm was already done.

I can't blame the cafeteria workers because they were operating under orders from their boss.  Might not like that they did that but the 'boss' was probably standing right there watching and more than just the kids were upset--one of the cafeteria workers was crying


Like I said....the so called "childhood nutrition manager" seems to be the one who gave the order and should be disciplined if not outright fired

I know that that's what I'd want if this happened to my kids

Edited by Tricia, 30 January 2014 - 04:05 PM.

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#7 Tricia

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 03:58 PM

Cait--that's what should have happened.  

That's the way it's done here. The kids are given the notes as well as a phone call from the school made. Plus all the teachers and the school itself all have parents email addresses.(you put your email addy's on every single form and you fill out a ton of papers between what the school requires and the teachers ask for)  If there seems to be a problem with parents paying then they also send home forms for the free or reduced cost lunch program

Like I said, it sounds to me like someone overstepped their boundaries and good sense

Edited by Tricia, 30 January 2014 - 04:07 PM.

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#8 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 06:54 PM

View PostTricia, on 30 January 2014 - 03:52 PM, said:


Like I said....the so called "childhood nutrition manager" seems to be the one who gave the order and should be disciplined if not outright fired

I know that that's what I'd want if this happened to my kids

My need for justice would demand much much more. Not sure exactly what, but whatever punishment handed out should make the next 10 "childhood nutrition managers" cringe at just the thought of it.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#9 Tricia

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 07:25 PM

Termination of employment is what I said I preferred for the person who gave the order to refuse those 40 something kids lunch.  

No job, no references, no ability to do this again, and that will give others second and third thoughts about not following the policies as outlined by the school district.

Actually it sounds like the childhood nutrition manager was a pretty bad manager  to let the situation get to that point anyway.  When you have more than 40 kids owing on their lunch accounts and you haven't sent out letters, phone calls, emails etc to the parents telling them that then something is already wrong with your management style

Edited by Tricia, 30 January 2014 - 07:29 PM.

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#10 Spectacles

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 07:51 PM

"childhood nutrition manager" -- God, what an Orwellian term for someone who would do this to children. She should have some sort Dickensian villain's name, like Mrs. Snatchalunch.

But isn't this just an extension of the argument we hear a lot these days, that people need to be shamed into being more responsible? I'm sure that somewhere in America, some self-righteous jerks are applauding Mrs. Snatchalunch. Bootstraps, people! Bootstraps!
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#11 Cait

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 08:18 PM

View PostSpectacles, on 30 January 2014 - 07:51 PM, said:

"childhood nutrition manager" -- God, what an Orwellian term for someone who would do this to children. She should have some sort Dickensian villain's name, like Mrs. Snatchalunch.

But isn't this just an extension of the argument we hear a lot these days, that people need to be shamed into being more responsible? I'm sure that somewhere in America, some self-righteous jerks are applauding Mrs. Snatchalunch. Bootstraps, people! Bootstraps!

See, this is what I think too.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#12 Nonny

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 08:42 PM

Those thieving, child-humiliating jerks better NEVER charge the parents for the lunches they stole and then THREW AWAY.  It's bad enough what they did, but if they DARE charge for those trashed lunches....  :mad:
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#13 Tricia

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 09:40 PM

View PostSpectacles, on 30 January 2014 - 07:51 PM, said:

"childhood nutrition manager" -- God, what an Orwellian term for someone who would do this to children. She should have some sort Dickensian villain's name, like Mrs. Snatchalunch.

But isn't this just an extension of the argument we hear a lot these days, that people need to be shamed into being more responsible? I'm sure that somewhere in America, some self-righteous jerks are applauding Mrs. Snatchalunch. Bootstraps, people! Bootstraps!

well the finger is pointed squarely at this person
http://news.yahoo.co...-174726995.html

Quote

The Salt Lake Tribune reports that two Utah lawmakers, Sens. Jim Dabakis, D-Salt Lake City, and Todd Weiler, R-Woods Cross, held a news conference at the school on Thursday.
Weiler called the school's actions "bullying" and "an abuse of power," adding, "This person came into a school and used her power to humiliate and embarrass children and I think we ought to draw a line and say that’s not acceptable behavior."
The school district issued another apology, at the news conference. Spokesman Jason Olsen said, "This was a mistake. This was handled wrong." And he added that food shouldn't have been taken from the students "once they went through that line."

Shouldn't even have to be said that this is unacceptable behavior. And that should mean somebody loses her job.

Edited by Tricia, 30 January 2014 - 09:42 PM.

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#14 Balderdash

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 10:09 PM

Quote

And he added that food shouldn't have been taken from the students "once they went through that line."

Food shouldn't have been taken from students, period!

Another Democrat leaning Independent that has to search for truth because it can't be found on Fox News OR MSNBC.



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#15 Elara

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 10:34 PM

That was my first thought, taking food away and expecting those kids to go all day without a lunch, is completely unbelievable for a school to do. The school here, would never do such a thing, but if they had when my son was in school, I would have been there in seconds to have a word with the principal.

And this was not just done to embarrass the kids, it was done to embarrass the parents, to shame them into paying their bill. Granted, late on the lunch account isn't what you want to be, but sometimes it can't be helped, and this was far too extreme an action in response.

Personally, this is a sick person to think this was even slightly okay.
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#16 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 10:39 PM

View PostTricia, on 30 January 2014 - 07:25 PM, said:

Termination of employment is what I said I preferred for the person who gave the order to refuse those 40 something kids lunch.  

No job, no references, no ability to do this again, and that will give others second and third thoughts about not following the policies as outlined by the school district.

Still not good enough, IMO. Termination goes without saying. But as for actual "punishment and warning to others" I'm thinking along more medieval. Since they basically stole the lunches from the kids, I'm leaning towards a more third world country approach. In some countries, if you steal something; then the hand you used to steal with gets chopped off. Something along those lines is definitely called for, IMO.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#17 Tricia

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 10:40 PM

yeah, he added more than was necessary

BTW the kids were given a piece of fruit and milk to eat, not given nothing.  That's not much at all even if it was something.



I know they probably stopped doing it because of peanut allergies but back when my college age child was in kindergarten the process for when a child didn't have any more lunch money in their account (which you actually bought those lunch tickets that they punched or marked everyday) was that they were given lunch the first two days and then a sack lunch the third day consisting of a peanut butter sandwich, an apple or orange and milk to eat and a form for the free or reduced cost lunch program to take home. But they also sent a note home the first day and then called the parents the second day. I asked the lunch ladies once what happened after that third day and they didn't know because the parents paid or made arrangements to pay or got on the lunch program

In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change. --Thich Nhat Hanh


You don't need to attend every argument you are invited to


Do not ask that your kids live up to your expectations.  Let your kids be who they are, and your expectations will be in breathless pursuit.


#18 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 10:48 PM

Is it my imagination, or are we all actually agreeing and on the same side in a OT thread?
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#19 Cait

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 10:55 PM

View PostLord of the Sword, on 30 January 2014 - 10:48 PM, said:

Is it my imagination, or are we all actually agreeing and on the same side in a OT thread?

Yes.  Remember the date.  We all agreed.  :)

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.

Source:
http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html


#20 FnlPrblm

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 02:07 AM

This happened to a friend of mine's daughter.  My friend, who is pretty laid back person, went ape-shnikes about a year and a half ago on FB.  Why? Because she found out that for a full week, her daughter had gone without any lunch at all due to her lunch bill not having been paid.  On a Friday night, the daughter went up to her mom and solemnly asked if they were poor.  Bewildered by the question (my friend & her husband both work decent jobs), she inquired why the daughter would ask such a question.  The kid was nearly in tears.  When the whole thing got unfolded, my friend went to FB because she couldn't go to the school (being a Friday night).  Forty dollars...my friend had missed the bill (or whatever it was, she admitted to the initial default being her own) but...she didn't receive any kind of notice, call or anything about the delinquency.  The daughter told the mom that she was told her bill was due and that she couldn't get any food at all until it was paid.  The kid was 9 years old...wtf is a bill? :p  Plus, they told her in front of all her friends and so on.  The kid was too embarrassed about the whole thing to even ask her mom directly.

LoTS, from my private conversation with her on Monday night, let's just say you would have been a satisfied man in knowing justice was eventually served. ;)  Well...somewhat.  No one was killed or racked.  But I think belittled for not being an adult and knowing how to pick up a phone in a week, is at least a meager qualifier. ;)
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