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Teen Wolf: Monstrous

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#1 Virgil Vox

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 10:27 AM

Thought I would start a thread now so we don't cross post again and also just in case anyone forgot that the new episode was airing tonight.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman

#2 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 07:13 PM

Good idea about starting the thread early.


First things first. Was anyone else confused about the whole Stiles and Malia being locked in the hospital room? Only to have the door mysteriously open on it's own? And then cut to them being at Stiles's house? That is getting old REAL fast on this show.

So Kira found everyone else on the dead pool. Interesting. Hiding out at Argent's...even more interesting. And what was that yellow plant he put in the safe?

Now we come to the most interesting part of this show. Scott's facial changes when he was about to kill. It sort of looked like he was starting to change into the kind of Alpha Peter was in season 1.

Now we come to the most lame BS of the show....So meredith heard Peter's thoughts, got the idea for the dead pool from those thoughts. Fine. All well, up to the point of actually pulling it off. Sorry, but Meredith isn't a mastermind. There was no way she organized the attack on the vault, and set up the dead pool. And what was the deal with the whole 1970's computer set up at Lydia's? And the key for it being in the wine? That made zero sense to me.

I'm surprised Parrish isn't actively trying to find out what the hell he is. I can understand everyone else being too busy with assassins and what not, but I would think Parrish would definitely find the time to try and learn what he is.

Meredith's line about Peter being the Alpha and always being the Alpha...interesting, Especially since he seems to have absorbed Derek's powers some how. But I don't think he's going to be able to kill Scott. And entire Alpha pack couldn't do it, so I don't see Peter being able to.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#3 Virgil Vox

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 07:47 PM

Wow. I did not see the Peter twist coming (that the dead pool was his idea, not that he wants to kill Scott. That's been pretty apparent for a while). It does help to explain everything. Well, almost everything but I'll get to that at the end.

On a side note, did anyone else experience sound problems? The lips and sound on my episode didn't synch up. They were about a second out of time. Going to record the episode again tomorrow night to see if it happens again.

So Brunski was pretty much the point man. He broke into the vault, turned the bearer bonds into cash, and did pretty much all of the computer stuff. He used the code from Lydia's grandmother. Meredith just controlled him and supplied him with the names and presumably, the amount to award each one. Lydia's grandmother foresaw the dead pool and tried to destroy the computer that would be used to generate it, but Brunski stopped her before she could. It also explains why Peter was off the list. Meredith saw him as the alpha and believed he was the one to set Beacon Hills right. I also liked that they tied in Allison's death to the dead pool. It was her death, and Lydia's reaction to it, that made Meredith believe it was time to wipe out the supernatural creatures. I liked that the show is acknowledging Allison in some way since for the most part they've ignored her death.

So many great moments in this episode. I think my favorite was when Scott was just ripping to shreds that one hunter and his face started to change into a more feral, werewolf look. One part of me loved it because I want another Peter-style werewolf. Another part wanted Scott to stop and not become the monster he believes he is. Luckily he stopped. Oh, and he was just shrugging bullets off like a champ. Yay for true alpha powers.

Kira's save of Brett and the girl was awesome. Just slicing those arrows out of the air. I really love Kira. Stop taking her out of episodes, Teen Wolf. I want more Kira kitsune. I also loved her reunion with Scott. They really are a great couple. Give them another season and it could be just as good if not better than the Scott/Allison romance.

Not a lot of Liam unfortunately but what was there was nice. Liam isn't a hero yet and maybe he won't be. He's just a scared young kid who doesn't want to die. I like that Scott saw Liam hesitating and offered to take him home. I do hope Liam steps up though. Oh, and did anyone else think it was maybe slightly dumb to leave Liam, one of the biggest targets on the dead pool, by himself when a giant group of commando hunters was in town taking down werewolves? If I had been them I would have gone after Liam at his house and collected an easy $18 million. None of the characters have really shown a lot of smarts though when it comes to the dead pool like when Lydia was at her lake house by herself a few episodes ago.

Stiles and Malia made up and it was glorious. I love these two together. Malia is just a lot of fun, with her blunt statements and no-nonsense attitude. Can't keep Stalia down. I always wanted Stiles to end up with Lydia at some point but now I like them better as friends and co-detectives.

The whole final battle between Scott, Kira, Derek, Braeden, Satomi, Argent, and the commandos was just really well done. For the final fight in the dead pool it rocked. It was tense, atmospheric, and full of some great moments.

Chris seems to be backsliding a little since he and Allison made the new code. I don't think all werewolves eventually lose control. It just wouldn't be possible.  Glad that Satomi threw it in Chris's face that humanity as a whole is pretty awful. You don't need to be a werewolf to kill someone.

I guess I feel some sympathy for Meredith. She really is just a poor girl who has suffered a lot and thought she was doing the right thing. She realized at the end just what a horrible thing she really did. Still, her actions led to a lot of death and suffering.

Peter mentioned the Desert Wolf, aka Malia's mom, as a potential assassin. That doesn't bode well for a happy mother/daughter reunion.

Okay, so like I said there were a few things that still need some explaining. So we can guess that Meredith knew about a lot of the supernatural creatures from Peter. It makes sense that he would know about all of them. That doesn't explain how she knew about the more recent ones. How did she know that Kira and her mother were kitsune? How did she know that Malia was Peter's daughter when even he didn't know it at first? How could she know that Derek lost his powers? What about Liam getting the bite? Also, why did she increase the bounty on Liam? How did she find out about newer assassins like the Orphans? The big one that I want answered is why did the Mute go after Peter if his name wasn't on the list?

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First things first. Was anyone else confused about the whole Stiles and Malia being locked in the hospital room? Only to have the door mysteriously open on it's own? And then cut to them being at Stiles's house? That is getting old REAL fast on this show.

Melissa locked them in. I think she did it so they would make up. Once she saw that they were kissing, she unlocked the door. It was a poorly shot scene not helped by the fact that afterwards they were at Stiles's house. I agree that stuff like that is getting old.

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So Kira found everyone else on the dead pool. Interesting. Hiding out at Argent's...even more interesting. And what was that yellow plant he put in the safe?

The yellow plant was the rare form of wolfs bane that the Orphans used on Brett and Liam. My guess is that everything in there was wolfs bane. I would think that Chris destroyed the regular wolfs bane but kept the yellow in case he needed to use it on Kate or Peter.

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Now we come to the most lame BS of the show....So meredith heard Peter's thoughts, got the idea for the dead pool from those thoughts. Fine. All well, up to the point of actually pulling it off. Sorry, but Meredith isn't a mastermind. There was no way she organized the attack on the vault, and set up the dead pool. And what was the deal with the whole 1970's computer set up at Lydia's? And the key for it being in the wine? That made zero sense to me.

Meredith didn't have to be a mastermind. She got the entire plan from Peter. All she had to do was wait to activate it. She knew about the vault and could get Brunski to go after it. The dead pool was more or less set though like I said I have no idea how she identified new creatures in Beacon Hills. The computer was from Lydia's grandmother who made the entire room to study paranormal stuff. I'm guessing that Meredith and Brunski knew about it and somehow used it to generate the code. As for the key remember that Lydia's grandmother had a premonition about the dead pool so maybe she hid the key hoping Lydia would find it and use it. It's a stretch I grant you but I doubt we will be getting any other explanations.

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I'm surprised Parrish isn't actively trying to find out what the hell he is. I can understand everyone else being too busy with assassins and what not, but I would think Parrish would definitely find the time to try and learn what he is.

He may not want to. He might be scared of what he is. Or he maybe simply have no idea how to even go about finding that information out. He could maybe ask his parents but as we've seen not everyone in a family of supernaturals is a supernatural creature.

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Meredith's line about Peter being the Alpha and always being the Alpha...interesting, Especially since he seems to have absorbed Derek's powers some how. But I don't think he's going to be able to kill Scott. And entire Alpha pack couldn't do it, so I don't see Peter being able to.

I like to think about Peter being the big bad of the entire show. Think about it. He was manipulating events even as a youngster as we saw in Derek's flashback. He bit Scott and tried to use him to give himself more power. He recognized that Lydia could bring him back to life and used her as a back-up plan. He pretty much set out of the whole Alpha pack fight but used Cora's sickness to get Derek to release his alpha power. He killed Jennifer so that she couldn't get strength from the nemeton. He has allied himself with Kate, the woman who burned him, so that they could manipulate events so that he can kill Scott and get his alpha powers. Peter has been playing a long game this entire time, and I think it's about to come to fruition. I don't see him succeeding of course because then we wouldn't have a show but I'm guessing some major things will happen as a result.

I enjoyed the few minutes where Tyler, Dylan, and Holland were being interviewed on the red carpet. Posey just seems like such a cool guy. Definitely someone I would like to just hang out with.

I kind of missed not having a Wolf Watch on after the show. I know we are getting one tomorrow but it's become a tradition that I have Wolf Watch on while writing my review.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman

#4 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 08:17 PM

View PostVirgil Vox, on 24 August 2014 - 07:47 PM, said:

The big one that I want answered is why did the Mute go after Peter if his name wasn't on the list?


I'm going to go on the assumption that the mute was there for Derek, only Peter was there instead. It's the only thing that makes sense, given that Peter's name isn't on the dead pool.

As for how Meredith knew about the newer supernaturals....If she could hear Peter's thoughts, there is a good chance she could hear the thoughts of other Supernaturals. As for the increase on the bounty for Liam???? I have no idea.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#5 Virgil Vox

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 11:18 PM

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I'm going to go on the assumption that the mute was there for Derek, only Peter was there instead. It's the only thing that makes sense, given that Peter's name isn't on the dead pool.

Don't know why I never thought of that. It just seemed like he was targeting Peter.

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As for how Meredith knew about the newer supernaturals....If she could hear Peter's thoughts, there is a good chance she could hear the thoughts of other Supernaturals. As for the increase on the bounty for Liam???? I have no idea.

It's a possibility. It just seemed like they made a big deal out of the fact that she and Peter got on the same wave length. About the increase on Liam, I'm guessing we will never get a real answer. They probably did it just for drama and to send Liam even more over the edge.

Oh, and I forgot to mention how this season has really been killing it with the opening scenes. They really hook you every episode.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman

#6 sonicsean34

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 07:36 PM

I am assuming the increase in Liam's bounty was due to him demonstrating his abilities when he fought the Berserkers a few eps ago. When they re-evaluated his threat level form harmless newbie to guy who can survive an encounter with Berserkers the bounty got recalculated.

Speaking of Beserkers i really need to know why  how they became kate's minons.

#7 Niko

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 08:34 PM

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First things first. Was anyone else confused about the whole Stiles and Malia being locked in the hospital room? Only to have the door mysteriously open on it's own? And then cut to them being at Stiles's house? That is getting old REAL fast on this show.
I agree with VV's assessment on what happened there, but agreed on the strangeness.  This is like the season of poorly done "read between the lines" moments.  The fact that some of them are intentional and some of them seem to be cuts for time or directorial fails has dampened the fun of the mystery as you realize how many moments were red herrings for total non-story reasons.

(Also, if Melissa was hanging around enough to spy on them, wouldn't she still be around to notice them leaving?  Them just waltzing out when Melissa put up such a fuss about Stiles needing a CT scan was jarring.)

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I'm surprised Parrish isn't actively trying to find out what the hell he is. I can understand everyone else being too busy with assassins and what not, but I would think Parrish would definitely find the time to try and learn what he is.
Heh... I picture him carrying around a lighter and surreptitiously holding his hand in the flame or something when nobody's looking.  But it's not like Beacon Hills has a Buffy-style library of occult stuff lying around for all their researching needs.  The Bestiary is their main supernatural resource, and Chris is apparently the keeper of that.  (Though, since it's a digital file, you'd think Stiles would've ganked a copy at some point.)

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So many great moments in this episode. I think my favorite was when Scott was just ripping to shreds that one hunter and his face started to change into a more feral, werewolf look. One part of me loved it because I want another Peter-style werewolf. Another part wanted Scott to stop and not become the monster he believes he is.
Yeah, that was powerful.  I was talking to my tv at that point, telling him not to do it.  (Though, there must've been a ton of dudes dead from gunshots anyway. :p)

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Liam isn't a hero yet and maybe he won't be. He's just a scared young kid who doesn't want to die. I like that Scott saw Liam hesitating and offered to take him home. I do hope Liam steps up though.
Great scene, again.  We get so used to casual heroism in our genre shows, that of COURSE the heroes want to save everyone, and having someone say "No, I can't do that." can be quite a kick in the gut.  Harkens back to Stiles at the end of Season 2, except we knew Stiles well enough by then to know his inner hero would win out, and we don't know Liam well enough to know what might flip that switch for him, so we're left guessing.   (Aside: This actually is coming up in "Attack on Titan" a fair bit, too, since we exchanged notes about that show. ;) )

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Stiles and Malia made up and it was glorious. I love these two together. Malia is just a lot of fun, with her blunt statements and no-nonsense attitude. Can't keep Stalia down. I always wanted Stiles to end up with Lydia at some point but now I like them better as friends and co-detectives.
On one of my podcasts from last week, there was a discussion that rang true for me about how Stalia is so great to watch because they feel like a couple who've skipped all the meet-cutes and awkward dinners and other formalities of a teenage dating story and gotten right to the more mature relationship phase where it's just a given that they've always been together.  Pretty impressive for, what, 15 minutes of screentime with them together for the whole season?  (Not that Scott and Kira's meet-cutes and awkward dinners aren't great, too.  The contrast between the two couples is part of what makes them both so awesome, I think... and how neither of them is anything like the Scott & Allison relationship, either.)

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He has allied himself with Kate, the woman who burned him, so that they could manipulate events so that he can kill Scott and get his alpha powers. Peter has been playing a long game this entire time, and I think it's about to come to fruition.
Speaking of Kate, did I read that final scene right that they were working together from the outset? (i.e. the whole Kate-kidnapping-Derek thing was the start of Peter making his move, which then got interrupted by the deadpool.)  I'm not sure if it was really meant to mean that or if I'm just distorting it to make that piece of the puzzle fit.

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I kind of missed not having a Wolf Watch on after the show. I know we are getting one tomorrow but it's become a tradition that I have Wolf Watch on while writing my review.
I missed not getting my "next week on".  I know they aired a preview scene, but I didn't see the actual montagey preview?  I mostly fast-forwarded through both the red carpet and VMA's for the Teen Wolf peeps and Dylan O'Brien, though, so I could've easily missed it.   (And now I'm posting this so late that I only have an hour or so to go until it airs, anyway.  :)

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I'm going to go on the assumption that the mute was there for Derek, only Peter was there instead. It's the only thing that makes sense, given that Peter's name isn't on the dead pool.
Yeah, for sure.  I rewatched that scene the other day, and it's pretty clear in hindsight that Peter showed up unexpectedly and the Mute most likely attacked Peter to get the drop on him before Peter noticed his presence.  (And, of course, without the bounty, there was no reason for the Mute to put himself at risk when Peter put up more of a fight than expected.)

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It just seemed like they made a big deal out of the fact that she and Peter got on the same wave length. About the increase on Liam, I'm guessing we will never get a real answer. They probably did it just for drama and to send Liam even more over the edge.
I'm relatively content to accept the assumption that it's part of her banshee power that she can tap into who's supernatural or not without it necessarily being the same kind of mind-reading like she was doing with Peter.  We've seen other instances where banshees had powers that went beyond sensing death - Lydia pulling Allison's name as the first key out of thin air, or her channeling the Nemeton, or Meredith hearing Lydia's message... It plays to me like they're overall wired into the supernatural undercurrents in some way that Meredith has more access/control over than Lydia.  So the benefactor thing becomes kind of a perfect storm of Peter's crazy ravings, Brunski's access to Lorraine's tools, and Meredith's banshee knowledge.

Misc:
- So, are we gonna get a third time of the Sheriff vs. Peter?  That was a great scene.  I miss my Stilinski family feels, but it's definitely cool how much we've seen the Sheriff actually being the Sheriff this season.

- Ian Bohen was awesome in that scene with Meredith.  I'm at a point of hoping that the next few episodes are just the opening salvo in Peter openly turning against Scott, and that the actual conflict will carry over into next season.  I can't imagine the show without him, especially when this season has barely scratched the surface in his "relationship" with Malia (and her mother).

- I love-love-loved the cassettes/tapes exchange between Stiles and Melissa!  That felt like old-school Teen Wolf there... such an early!Stiles sort of quirk, trying to get the final say on some silly little word choice.
- Whatsoever you do to the least of my people, that you do unto me.    (Matthew 25:40)

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#8 Virgil Vox

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 09:29 PM

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I am assuming the increase in Liam's bounty was due to him demonstrating his abilities when he fought the Berserkers a few eps ago. When they re-evaluated his threat level form harmless newbie to guy who can survive an encounter with Berserkers the bounty got recalculated.

I didn't even consider that. He did put up a decent fight against the Berserker. Also, glad to see someone else commenting on Teen Wolf. Hope you stick around.

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Speaking of Beserkers i really need to know why  how they became kate's minons.

Agreed. The Berserkers are a big old mystery. We know nothing about them other than they are loyal to Kate and extremely strong.

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I agree with VV's assessment on what happened there, but agreed on the strangeness.  This is like the season of poorly done "read between the lines" moments.  The fact that some of them are intentional and some of them seem to be cuts for time or directorial fails has dampened the fun of the mystery as you realize how many moments were red herrings for total non-story reasons.

(Also, if Melissa was hanging around enough to spy on them, wouldn't she still be around to notice them leaving?  Them just waltzing out when Melissa put up such a fuss about Stiles needing a CT scan was jarring.)

It really is the season of poorly done "read between the lines" moments. You hit that nail on the head. TW has kind of been guilty of this before but it does seem more noticeable this season. That's why I'm really hoping we get some deleted scenes or extended episodes on the DVD.

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Heh... I picture him carrying around a lighter and surreptitiously holding his hand in the flame or something when nobody's looking.  But it's not like Beacon Hills has a Buffy-style library of occult stuff lying around for all their researching needs.  The Bestiary is their main supernatural resource, and Chris is apparently the keeper of that.  (Though, since it's a digital file, you'd think Stiles would've ganked a copy at some point.)

You would think by now that they would all have a copy of the Bestiary. Considering the creatures they've encountered so far it just seems like a nice thing to have around.

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Yeah, that was powerful.  I was talking to my tv at that point, telling him not to do it.  (Though, there must've been a ton of dudes dead from gunshots anyway. :p)

There were several bodies lying motionless on the ground after the battle so I'm sure several of them are dead. I think Scott and Kira were probably the only ones trying to wound and not kill. Everyone else would be more than happy to kill them all. I was also yelling at my TV.

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Great scene, again.  We get so used to casual heroism in our genre shows, that of COURSE the heroes want to save everyone, and having someone say "No, I can't do that." can be quite a kick in the gut.  Harkens back to Stiles at the end of Season 2, except we knew Stiles well enough by then to know his inner hero would win out, and we don't know Liam well enough to know what might flip that switch for him, so we're left guessing.   (Aside: This actually is coming up in "Attack on Titan" a fair bit, too, since we exchanged notes about that show. ;) )

It's true that in a lot of genre shows it is just casual heroism. Characters think nothing of putting their lives on the line to save the world in shows like Buffy, Smallville, Angel, Supernatural, Warehouse 13, Charmed, etc. It's good to see a character that thinks twice about it, especially a 15 year old. I know that at that age I would be more like Liam than Scott.

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On one of my podcasts from last week, there was a discussion that rang true for me about how Stalia is so great to watch because they feel like a couple who've skipped all the meet-cutes and awkward dinners and other formalities of a teenage dating story and gotten right to the more mature relationship phase where it's just a given that they've always been together.  Pretty impressive for, what, 15 minutes of screentime with them together for the whole season?  (Not that Scott and Kira's meet-cutes and awkward dinners aren't great, too.  The contrast between the two couples is part of what makes them both so awesome, I think... and how neither of them is anything like the Scott & Allison relationship, either.)

Teen Wolf does do a good job with the relationships. None of them are exactly the same and they feel natural. The show doesn't create a lot of unnecessary love triangles or anything like that. When Scott and Allison broke up they both moved on and aside from Scott shoving Isaac a few times they were all more or less mature about it. It's nice to see Lydia taking a break from dating considering the train wreck that was her relationship to Jackson and the fact that Aiden died.

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Speaking of Kate, did I read that final scene right that they were working together from the outset? (i.e. the whole Kate-kidnapping-Derek thing was the start of Peter making his move, which then got interrupted by the deadpool.)  I'm not sure if it was really meant to mean that or if I'm just distorting it to make that piece of the puzzle fit.

I'm not sure. I would have to go back and re-watch the scene where Peter first approached Kate. It seemed like that was their first interaction since Peter tore her throat out. It could be that he explained his plan to her after that to get her on board.

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I missed not getting my "next week on".  I know they aired a preview scene, but I didn't see the actual montagey preview?  I mostly fast-forwarded through both the red carpet and VMA's for the Teen Wolf peeps and Dylan O'Brien, though, so I could've easily missed it.   (And now I'm posting this so late that I only have an hour or so to go until it airs, anyway.  :)

I don't think they did air a preview montage. Just the quick clip from the episode. I had the VMAs on in the background but basically only payed attention at the first when the TW cast was on and then for Dylan O'Brien. Only a few more weeks until Maze Runner comes out. I'm excited. Probably going to go to an early Thursday showing.

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Yeah, for sure.  I rewatched that scene the other day, and it's pretty clear in hindsight that Peter showed up unexpectedly and the Mute most likely attacked Peter to get the drop on him before Peter noticed his presence.  (And, of course, without the bounty, there was no reason for the Mute to put himself at risk when Peter put up more of a fight than expected.)

Don't know why I never thought of that. Makes perfect sense.

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I'm relatively content to accept the assumption that it's part of her banshee power that she can tap into who's supernatural or not without it necessarily being the same kind of mind-reading like she was doing with Peter.  We've seen other instances where banshees had powers that went beyond sensing death - Lydia pulling Allison's name as the first key out of thin air, or her channeling the Nemeton, or Meredith hearing Lydia's message... It plays to me like they're overall wired into the supernatural undercurrents in some way that Meredith has more access/control over than Lydia.  So the benefactor thing becomes kind of a perfect storm of Peter's crazy ravings, Brunski's access to Lorraine's tools, and Meredith's banshee knowledge.

I guess I'm just going to have to make the same assumption and just let it be. Banshees do seem to have a wide range of more telepathic/mental powers.

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- So, are we gonna get a third time of the Sheriff vs. Peter?  That was a great scene.  I miss my Stilinski family feels, but it's definitely cool how much we've seen the Sheriff actually being the Sheriff this season.

I would love another showdown between these two. It might happen. We still have two more episodes and Peter is apparently making his move. I have enjoyed the extra screen time that the Sheriff has been getting this season. Letting him in on the secret has been a blessing for the character and the show.

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- Ian Bohen was awesome in that scene with Meredith.  I'm at a point of hoping that the next few episodes are just the opening salvo in Peter openly turning against Scott, and that the actual conflict will carry over into next season.  I can't imagine the show without him, especially when this season has barely scratched the surface in his "relationship" with Malia (and her mother).

Peter could be using Kate as an expendable pawn so that he could still hide his true intentions. Use her to get Scott and if Scott manages to beat Kate then Peter's hands would still be clean. I just don't know. Ian Bohen is a great actor and I love him on the show but I'm just not sure how much more they can drag his plot out. There's more they could do with him yes but if his goal is to kill Scott then I don't see that lasting for much longer.

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- I love-love-loved the cassettes/tapes exchange between Stiles and Melissa!  That felt like old-school Teen Wolf there... such an early!Stiles sort of quirk, trying to get the final say on some silly little word choice.

Same. It's little moments like that that truly make this show.

So now that the assassins are done coming out of the woodwork, what was everyone's favorite assassin? There's the Mute, the Orphans, the Chemist, the Arsonists, and the hunter commandos. I think I liked the Orphans the best just for shock value alone. I truly thought that Garrett and Violet were just going to be background characters and then boom they kill the keg guy. The Mute would probably be next just because he had a great look and was really creepy. Then probably the Chemist simply because he took out the most supernatural creatures. I'd then go for the commandos because they looked cool and posed a big threat. The arsonists would be last because they were pretty weak sauce.

I'm sure the next two episodes will be extremely intense but I'm hoping that they give us at least some nice moments in the finale. After everything the group has been through this season I would like to see them all having fun and being normal high school kids. I think the ending to season 2 with Stiles and Scott just playing lacrosse and having fun is still the best season finale moment, followed by the end of 3a with all of them in high school and being happy. I want something like that this year.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman

#9 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 11:00 PM

Regarding Scott almost killing the assassin.....I actually wanted Scott to kill him. My reason for it is simple: Wolves are predators. they kill. period. At some point they are going to have to have Scott kill. Let's face it, they've done a good job of getting around it so far. But a werewolf that hasn't killed anyone or anything? That is stretching things. And didn't Derek tell Scott, in season one, that the Alpha would want Scott to hunt and kill during the first full moon? That it was a ritual with Alphas? Or something like that? So having Scott kill in self defense...sort of. is the best way to deal with that, as opposed to having him kill an innocent.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#10 Virgil Vox

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 11:31 PM

^I'm not sure how I feel about Scott killing someone. For one, I'm not sure if him taking a life means he loses his true alpha status. I don't want Scott to go back to being a beta. Plus he is still a high school student. Sure he's a powerful werewolf and has fought some big threats but taking a life is a big deal. Plus the theme of the season does seem to revolve around the slogan that not all monsters do monstrous things.

If he does have to kill someone I hope it's in self-defense or to save one of his friends. From the preview

Spoiler

I'm not sure if all alphas force their betas to kill. Derek didn't with his three betas, Scott definitely hasn't forced Liam to do anything bad, and it seems like Talia Hale went in for a more peaceful approach. I think Derek was simply telling Scott that that particular alpha was calling Scott out to kill and that he would be forced to do it soon if they didn't stop the alpha.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman

#11 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 26 August 2014 - 12:51 AM

View PostVirgil Vox, on 25 August 2014 - 11:31 PM, said:


I'm not sure if all alphas force their betas to kill. Derek didn't with his three betas, Scott definitely hasn't forced Liam to do anything bad, and it seems like Talia Hale went in for a more peaceful approach. I think Derek was simply telling Scott that that particular alpha was calling Scott out to kill and that he would be forced to do it soon if they didn't stop the alpha.

Good point. I had forgotten Derek didn't do that ritual with his 3 betas.
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#12 Niko

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Posted 26 August 2014 - 10:45 AM

Quote

I am assuming the increase in Liam's bounty was due to him demonstrating his abilities when he fought the Berserkers a few eps ago. When they re-evaluated his threat level form harmless newbie to guy who can survive an encounter with Berserkers the bounty got recalculated.

Ah! I like that, too.  Better than the seemingly random choice of him to inherit all of Derek's money.  Good thought. :)

Quote

I'm not sure. I would have to go back and re-watch the scene where Peter first approached Kate. It seemed like that was their first interaction since Peter tore her throat out. It could be that he explained his plan to her after that to get her on board.

That's what I thought, too, but it's been bugging me.  Kate's motivation for the whole kidnapping/de-aging of Derek and the way that led to Derek's loss of power and Peter's gain still feels a gap for me.  I want the ties there to be tighter, somehow.

Quote

Peter could be using Kate as an expendable pawn so that he could still hide his true intentions. Use her to get Scott and if Scott manages to beat Kate then Peter's hands would still be clean. I just don't know. Ian Bohen is a great actor and I love him on the show but I'm just not sure how much more they can drag his plot out. There's more they could do with him yes but if his goal is to kill Scott then I don't see that lasting for much longer.

I think I'm kinda influenced by Ian Bohen's take on the character in wanting him to stay around.  I was a little sad on Wolf Watch last night when he was explaining how Peter respects Scott and that Ian himself has always wanted Peter to be a "good guy" who happens to have flexible morals when it comes to looking out for his own interests, but that the writers were committed to Peter being truly evil.  I'm more with Ian's interpretation of him, and I don't like that there may be a disconnect there on the part of the writers.  Makes me worry that they'll take him out like the audience should be "rooting" for him to die, which would be a crappy end for a character who's been a strong presence as both enemy and ally for so long.

Quote

So now that the assassins are done coming out of the woodwork, what was everyone's favorite assassin? There's the Mute, the Orphans, the Chemist, the Arsonists, and the hunter commandos.
  Eh... the Orphans, I guess.  With second-place to the Chemist.  Either of them would've been fun to have around for a more leisurely reveal.  I didn't have time to get terribly attached to any of them, though.
- Whatsoever you do to the least of my people, that you do unto me.    (Matthew 25:40)

- Do not let kindness and truth leave you; Bind them around your neck, Write them on the tablet of your heart.  (Proverbs 3:3)

#13 Virgil Vox

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Posted 26 August 2014 - 05:13 PM

Quote

That's what I thought, too, but it's been bugging me.  Kate's motivation for the whole kidnapping/de-aging of Derek and the way that led to Derek's loss of power and Peter's gain still feels a gap for me.  I want the ties there to be tighter, somehow.

You might get your wish since in the preview

Spoiler

So maybe there is a connection there. I'm hoping we will also get answers to just exactly what is going on with Derek and whether it's reversible.

Quote

I think I'm kinda influenced by Ian Bohen's take on the character in wanting him to stay around.  I was a little sad on Wolf Watch last night when he was explaining how Peter respects Scott and that Ian himself has always wanted Peter to be a "good guy" who happens to have flexible morals when it comes to looking out for his own interests, but that the writers were committed to Peter being truly evil.  I'm more with Ian's interpretation of him, and I don't like that there may be a disconnect there on the part of the writers.  Makes me worry that they'll take him out like the audience should be "rooting" for him to die, which would be a crappy end for a character who's been a strong presence as both enemy and ally for so long.

Until the end of season 3a I more or less had the same opinion of Peter as you. This was a guy who was morally grey and did what was in his best interests but he had some affection for those around him. I figured that he would sell Scott and co. down the river if it suited him but he would help them if it suited him as well. Then we see him murder Jennifer and she basically says that he wants to kill Scott and become the alpha and he of course says he has always been the alpha. That changed my opinion of him to a guy who has basically been playing a long con.

I'm not sure which version of Peter I would prefer. I like the morally grey character that is looking out for himself but I also like him as a villain that has been scheming since day one. I guess it will depend on what happens in the next two episodes. It is sad that Ian Bohen would prefer the character to be good but the writers want him evil.

I'm not rooting for Peter to die because I like the actor and character but that might change depending on what he does the next two episodes. If he does make his move and causes a lot of collateral damage there may be no coming back for him. It all just depends on exactly what his final plan is.

Something I never thought about until now was that even when Peter thought Scott was dead he still wanted his body. He sent Kate and her Berserkers to retrieve it. Kate wanted the body, not just confirmation that Scott was dead. So that means that Peter could still somehow do something with Scott's body to further his plans.

Quote

Eh... the Orphans, I guess.  With second-place to the Chemist.  Either of them would've been fun to have around for a more leisurely reveal.  I didn't have time to get terribly attached to any of them, though.

I think the Orphans were in more episodes than any of the other assassins. Well, maybe tied with the Mute who appeared in Scott's dream sequence. The assassins were kind of a double edged sword. On one hand I liked the gang having multiple enemies to fight against but on the other hand they really didn't get fleshed out that much.

Oh, I forgot to mention this but Derek's speech about sending a message was another good moment in the episode. Though honestly you would think with the Mute, the Orphans, the Chemist, the blonde hospital assassin, and the main arsonist dead then a message has all ready been sent. Still doesn't take away from the power of the speech.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman

#14 Lord of the Sword

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Posted 26 August 2014 - 08:39 PM

View PostVirgil Vox, on 26 August 2014 - 05:13 PM, said:

Oh, I forgot to mention this but Derek's speech about sending a message was another good moment in the episode. Though honestly you would think with the Mute, the Orphans, the Chemist, the blonde hospital assassin, and the main arsonist dead then a message has all ready been sent. Still doesn't take away from the power of the speech.

It was a good speech, but after he gave it I was like: "Haven't you already sent that message with the assassins you've already killed off?"
"Sometimes you get the point of the sword, sometimes the edge, sometimes the flat of the blade (even if you're the Lord of the Sword) and sometimes you're the guy wielding it. But any day without the Sword or its Lord is one that could've been better  " ~Orpheus.

The Left is inclusive, and tolerant, unless you happen to think and believe different than they do~ Lord of the Sword

Looks like the Liberal Elite of Exisle have finally managed to silence the last remaining Conservative voice on the board.

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is it’s natural manure.” ~Thomas Jefferson

#15 Niko

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 06:43 AM

Nice little bit of news:  "Jeff Davis just told me the Sept. 8 season finale is super-sized! It will run 1 hour and 15 minutes!"

https://twitter.com/...988674841698305
- Whatsoever you do to the least of my people, that you do unto me.    (Matthew 25:40)

- Do not let kindness and truth leave you; Bind them around your neck, Write them on the tablet of your heart.  (Proverbs 3:3)

#16 Virgil Vox

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Posted 27 August 2014 - 11:19 AM

Quote

Nice little bit of news:  "Jeff Davis just told me the Sept. 8 season finale is super-sized! It will run 1 hour and 15 minutes!"

https://twitter.com/...988674841698305

That is great news. I knew that they had more material for the episode and were having trouble cutting it down so I'm very excited that they are just getting an extended episode.

Quote

It was a good speech, but after he gave it I was like: "Haven't you already sent that message with the assassins you've already killed off?"

If I was an assassin and saw that all the other assassins in Beacon Hills had been killed and hadn't been able to enjoy their money I would have run for the hills.
"You will give the people an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you. They will stumble. They will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders."
--Jor-El


It's a recession when your neighbor loses his job: it's a depression when you lose yours.
-- Harry S. Truman



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