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Once Upon A Time: Family Business

Once Upon a Time Once Upon a Time: Season 4 Frozen

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#1 DWF

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Posted 02 November 2014 - 07:26 PM

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The race is on to track down the Snow Queen, who was once the foster mother of Emma.

The longest-running science fiction series: decadent, degenerate and rotten to the core. Power-mad conspirators, Daleks, Sontarans... Cybermen! They're still in the nursery compared to us. Fifty years of absolute fandom. That's what it takes to be really critical.

"Don't mistake a few fans bitching on the Internet for any kind of trend." - Keith R.A. DeCandido

#2 sierraleone

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 06:29 PM

Well I suppose the Snow Queen couldn't have actually been sane... ;)

Still begs the question on why she erased Emma's memory. It appears things were going well and were good... Why not just erase the bad parts of the memory, presumably at the end of their 6 months together? Sure, Emma might occasionally cock her head and wonder how/why she was moved to another home, but considering Storybrooke had groundhog day for 28 years, it is certainly doable ;) Now obviously, the storywriters did not want Emma to recognize the Snow Queen ;) However, if the Snow Queen was planning on eventually reuniting with Emma wouldn't it be better/easier for Emma to have positive memories with her?
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#3 Sci-Fi Girl

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 06:34 PM

You mean "leave the fun"? ;)

(That's a Frozen ref, for those who haven't seen it.)  :hehe:

SFG
"A song is like a picture of a bird in flight; the bird was moving before the picture was taken, and no doubt continued after."   - Pete Seeger

Pete Seeger's life was a picture of an idea in flight, and the idea will continue long after.  As long as there are people with goodness and courage in their hearts, the idea will continue forever.

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Check out my music threads:

Beautiful Music: Folk, Acoustic, Traditional, and World

A Celebration of Song Lyrics, New and Old: Just the poetry  (to include those with different musical tastes than me)

When Sci Fi Actors Sing

#4 sierraleone

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 07:02 PM

^ I haven't yet, so yes, you lost me :)

BTW - I call the Snow Queen insane because I have no idea how her plan is suppose to actually bring about the results she wants. Without further memory interference anyways.... and then it is not a 'real' family, just people stuck with you who don't know any better (wait.... ;) ).

Honestly, while the Snow Queen may be the villain with the most unworthy pathetic/naive/unworkable plan yet ;) Yeah, Emma will be real glad to play sister/niece once you kill all of her family and friends. And while Elsa's friends in Storybrook are new to her, she isn't going to be happy that the Snow Queen has absconded with Elsa's sister.
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#5 Sci-Fi Girl

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 10:09 PM

Do you want me to explain what happened?  Or would you rather wait and see the movie?  (It is very relevant to the things you said.)  :)

SFG

Edited by Sci-Fi Girl, 03 November 2014 - 10:10 PM.

"A song is like a picture of a bird in flight; the bird was moving before the picture was taken, and no doubt continued after."   - Pete Seeger

Pete Seeger's life was a picture of an idea in flight, and the idea will continue long after.  As long as there are people with goodness and courage in their hearts, the idea will continue forever.

Posted Image   Posted Image


Check out my music threads:

Beautiful Music: Folk, Acoustic, Traditional, and World

A Celebration of Song Lyrics, New and Old: Just the poetry  (to include those with different musical tastes than me)

When Sci Fi Actors Sing

#6 sierraleone

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 10:30 PM

View PostSci-Fi Girl, on 03 November 2014 - 10:09 PM, said:

Do you want me to explain what happened?  Or would you rather wait and see the movie?  (It is very relevant to the things you said.)  :)

SFG

Sure. I am not actively seeking out Frozen, have no idea when or if I will see it :)
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#7 DWF

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 10:41 PM

It's kind of cool that this ep. was directed by Mario Van Peeples, Sunny Spoon himself. :cool: It'd be nice if Rumple could depower the Snow Queen but of course he's not going to do that sadly. And Anna has been everywhere now meeting people all over FTL. And it was cool that John Rhys Davies was her voice of the troll, not the best CGI but cool none the less.

ETA: That raindeer was a real scene stealer. :D

Edited by DWF, 03 November 2014 - 10:52 PM.

The longest-running science fiction series: decadent, degenerate and rotten to the core. Power-mad conspirators, Daleks, Sontarans... Cybermen! They're still in the nursery compared to us. Fifty years of absolute fandom. That's what it takes to be really critical.

"Don't mistake a few fans bitching on the Internet for any kind of trend." - Keith R.A. DeCandido

#8 Sci-Fi Girl

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Posted 03 November 2014 - 10:47 PM

View Postsierraleone, on 03 November 2014 - 10:30 PM, said:

View PostSci-Fi Girl, on 03 November 2014 - 10:09 PM, said:

Do you want me to explain what happened?  Or would you rather wait and see the movie?  (It is very relevant to the things you said.)  :)

SFG

Sure. I am not actively seeking out Frozen, have no idea when or if I will see it :)

Ok! :)

Elsa and Anna were happy as children, often playing games that used Elsa's ice powers.  But one time little Anna ran faster than Elsa could keep making snow, and Elsa accidentally struck Anna in the head with a bolt of ice, nearly freezing her.  The parents took both girls to see the rock trolls, to save Anna.

Since the ice was in Anna's head, Grand Pabbie had to remove all her memories, not only of the event, but of all magic just to be safe.  Elsa asked "She won't remember that I have powers?"

And Pabbie answered "Don't worry, I will leave the fun!"

This left Anna with a sisterly bond, and memories of their fun and games, but no idea why they stopped!  She only rediscovers Elsa's magic much later, when disaster strikes.

SFG  Posted Image

Edited by Sci-Fi Girl, 04 November 2014 - 12:20 PM.

"A song is like a picture of a bird in flight; the bird was moving before the picture was taken, and no doubt continued after."   - Pete Seeger

Pete Seeger's life was a picture of an idea in flight, and the idea will continue long after.  As long as there are people with goodness and courage in their hearts, the idea will continue forever.

Posted Image   Posted Image


Check out my music threads:

Beautiful Music: Folk, Acoustic, Traditional, and World

A Celebration of Song Lyrics, New and Old: Just the poetry  (to include those with different musical tastes than me)

When Sci Fi Actors Sing

#9 sierraleone

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Posted 04 November 2014 - 05:28 PM

^ Thanks :) Makes perfect sense, like I said, why the heck wouldn't the Snow Queen leave the fun? ;)

But I am pretty sure this show couldn't function without memory loss spells ;)
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#10 sierraleone

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Posted 04 November 2014 - 08:15 PM

I have thought of an actual good reason why the Snow Queen did the memory wipe.

They showed that Sidney took a picture of Emma and Snow Queen/Ingrid arguing. That was when he was doing surveilance for Regina in season 1.

So, upon their separation when Emma was a teenager Ingrid either left Emma's memory completely intact and/or just "left the fun" so to speak. If she had erased Emma's memory of herself completed it would be unlikely they would be having a confrontation in season 1 (unless they are going to suggest and explain on some unforementioned parallel season 1 story-line).

Now Emma only talked about the curse in season 1 to Mary Margaret, Henry, Archie, and Regina.  She didn't believe in it yet and it centred around her concern for Henry's mental health. So if she came across a former foster mother in Storybrooke I don't see a confrontation over the curse happening. And I doubt Ingrid would have pushed the whole you are the saviour crud at such a time Emma was obviously not ready for it, not even believing in the curse.

We know things had previously went "well" on paper, due to the file that Ingrid kept (though they can be like pictures, inaccurate snapshots). If things had previously gone and ended well, or even neutral, it should have been at least a non-confrontational reunion if not actually pleasant. So either it did not go/end well, or something confrontation happened between them in season 1 because of something that happened in Storybrooke.

And then Emma's memory was wiped of Ingrid, so as to not interfere with her pathetic irrational plan to kill everyone in storybrook later and then make Emma love her (no clue on how she planned/saw herself reuniting with Elsa, consider Elsa was saved 30+years ago from Rumple's well-hidden vase and by-passed all that time by hitching onto Emma's time-travel pass).

If it was wiped in her teenage years we have no explanation for the confrontation that Sidney captured on camera. Maybe Emma sideswiped Ingrid's Ice-cream truck with her Beetle? ;)

I am likely way over-thinking this, I sometimes wonder if I often put more thought into the show than the writers at this point ;)

Edited by sierraleone, 04 November 2014 - 08:19 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#11 sierraleone

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Posted 04 November 2014 - 08:24 PM

One thing I will say I reallllly loved about this episode. That mirror. Some may say it is evil, but at what point did it lie to Belle? I may have to rewatch that scene, but it may just be I am not a huge fan of the Rumple/Belle relationship origin story. It is a hard truth revealer as far as I am concerned ;)

If Ingrid the Snow Queen decides to unleash that magic on the whole town there could be some interesting impact on the story and character/relationships in regards to drama/revelations/actions/reactions/development. I just hope they don't press a big fat reset button and forget all about the impact such a bewitching magic should have, at least on an obvious level for a couple episodes.

Yeah, I know, bewitching magic *seems* kinda repetitive, but I mean the fascinate kind of bewitching. Bewitching just seems a much better word choice than fascinate :) Other than memory loss we haven't seen a lot of magic ensnare the mind that I recall.

Edited by sierraleone, 04 November 2014 - 08:41 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#12 innocentone

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Posted 07 November 2014 - 10:17 AM

It seems Sidney have a whole lot of hate for our once evil Queen, turned somewhat good.  I don't know why his portrayal would have shocked her.  But I also remember the old saying there is a then line between love and hate. who's to say.

Now was I dreaming, or di Belle finally see the true color f Gold.  I believe I fell a sleep on the episode of OUAT



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