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Agents of SHIELD: S03E17 - The Team

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#1 G-man

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 12:19 PM



Quote

Agent Daisy Johnson brings the Secret Warriors together for a mission that will affect them all; knowledge of Hive's powers has S.H.I.E.L.D. mistrusting everyone.

Ai-yai-yai!  The stakes are rising, the pace is increasing, and they are promising "shocking revelations" in this episode.  So strap yourselves in and hang on to your hats, True Believers, when you tune in to ABC tonight at 9pm Eastern/8pm Central and see what happens.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself
Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#2 RJDiogenes

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Posted 19 April 2016 - 05:53 PM

Not another mole, I hope.  :no:
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#3 zarkon

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Posted 20 April 2016 - 12:13 AM

Yes.

You get a mole and it's out in the open and based on the end of the show they mention something about the next 4 eps being together in some fashion.

I guess things will be upside down for awhile.

#4 G-man

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Posted 20 April 2016 - 10:09 AM

So ... it's the old scene-we-didn't-show-you-until-the-final-reveal trick.  I should've known.

The startling turn, in retrospect, was kinda obvious in a meta-textual way.  Within the story, the reason behind the turn was telegraphed by the whole nature of Hive's control/influence over other Inhumans.  Yet, because of that very nature, it left things nicely muddied as the story unfolded, and the various candidates were dragged in front of us.

Still, this was a nice thriller of an episode.  Albeit, SHIELD's SOP really, REALLY, does more to destroy trust than to build it, no matter who is in charge.  That Coulson and May, and to a lesser degree Mack, really don't see this is worrisome.  Yeah, they might be scared, and are facing an as-of-yet undefined and unknown threat originating from a particular minority, and wish to protect themselves, but they keep on making the same mistake of trying to assume a dominant stance vis-à-vis a potential threat, thereby escalating the danger, as opposed to using a more subtle, collaborative approach and attempting to de-escalate the situation.

It was good to see just how effective the Secret Warriors are, as well as Malick's revelation about Hive not being whom HYDRA had built it up to be.

It was nice to see Fitz-Simmons have their moment, and even return to teasing each other.

It was nice to see Coulson and May mentoring Daisy.

It was nice to see May's own discomfort to being kept in the dark when things get tense.

Mack ... well, obviously there's an attraction between him and "Yoyo," but SHIELD SOP has now raised a barrier between them that just might prove insurmountable.

And, of course, this is all prolog for the upcoming arc of a season finale.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself

Edited by G-man, 20 April 2016 - 01:46 PM.

Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#5 RJDiogenes

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Posted 21 April 2016 - 05:42 PM

Okay, not so much a mole as mind control.  I can live with that.  It's fixable.

But things definitely look about as bad as they can be.  That nice SHIELD HQ may be history.  And Hive-Daisy has the Terrigen.

The thing that really impressed me about this episode was Lincoln. I've never thought much of him, but he really came out looking good here. He was the only one of the four Inhumans acting reasonably when they were trapped together, and he also demonstrated a new level of maturity when he was locked up and Hive-Daisy wanted to spring him.  Yoyo, by contrast, lost points. It doesn't take a lot of common sense to understand what needed to be done, and it was especially meanspirited of her to give Mack the cold shoulder, since he obviously has a crush on her (SHIELD requires fluency in Spanish now-- surrre, Mack :lol: ).  

It was great to see Fitz and Simmons finally getting together.  I just hope it isn't foreshadowing tragedy for them.

And Malick is toast and jam.  I didn't expect that to happen so soon.

Looks like we're heading into the final arc of the season.  But SHIELD is already renewed, so not to worry.
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#6 G-man

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Posted 22 April 2016 - 08:30 AM

Ummm ... when you come from a country where those in authority have a history of locking up citizens for "reasons" rather than because they committed a crime, you're probably are not going to recognize any distinctions when those in authority that you have just assisted choose to lock you up for "reasons".

Yeah, the best way to convince an anti-establishment rebel that you're the good guys is to keep her the dark and employ the same tactics against her as the group she's fighting against.

Personally, I wouldn't deduct any points from Yoyo, as this was the SHIELD SOP that I was complaining about.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself

Edited by G-man, 22 April 2016 - 08:31 AM.

Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#7 RJDiogenes

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Posted 22 April 2016 - 05:26 PM

Yeah, I remember where she comes from, but still, these are people she knows and the situation isn't hard to understand.  She's not stupid. Hopefully her next appearance will begin with an apology to Mack.
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#8 G-man

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Posted 23 April 2016 - 08:44 AM

Actually, she doesn't know them.  She's encountered them, she's been recruited by them, but within this episode Mack was explaining just what SHIELD is.  IOW, they were still in the introduction phase of the relationship.

Consequently, given SHIELD's treatment of the Secret Warriors, it's not she who has to apologize.  For all Yoyo knows, Mack was lying to her and SHIELD is very much like the people she was fighting against.  So any apologies, and explanations ought to come from the SHIELD folk.  Afterall, the Secret Warriors are more the volunteer reserves, rather than died in the wool SHIELD agents.  Therefore, expecting them to understand and "get over it" would be asking alot, especially if SHIELD still needs their help.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself

Edited by G-man, 23 April 2016 - 08:46 AM.

Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#9 RJDiogenes

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Posted 24 April 2016 - 04:30 PM

They did explain, though.  I don't see how they could have handled it any differently without tipping off whoever was being controlled by Hive-Ward.
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#10 G-man

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Posted 24 April 2016 - 05:02 PM

Well ... not really, and only after they had them captured after some subterfuge, which thereby nullifies any explanation subsequently given.

This is the problem with dealing with an organization that engages in secrets and insists on being in control, invariably they prove to be untrustworthy.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself
Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#11 RJDiogenes

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Posted 24 April 2016 - 05:04 PM

Well, maybe that's inevitable, given their mission in life.  Tipping their hand would have given up any advantage that they had.  Although things didn't work out too well in any case.
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#12 G-man

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Posted 24 April 2016 - 05:40 PM

Agreed.  

Hopefully, next ep will feature some bridge repair between SHIELD and the Secret Warriors.  Something other than "we really need your help."

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself

Edited by G-man, 24 April 2016 - 05:42 PM.

Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#13 Cybersnark

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 10:13 AM

Some level of organized training/orientation might help; we saw that Daisy and Linc managed to handle it relatively well, if only because they're experienced enough to know how SHIELD works and why certain decisions have to be made (with the fact that they know and trust Coulson & May being an additional factor).
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#14 G-man

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 02:15 PM

But consider, while May was stuck on a hospital bed getting patched up, and saw that body wheeled past by Fitz and Simmons in their Hazmat suits, she got upset as well.  And this is someone who had been with the group since the beginning, and has seen things go sideways ... yet she was upset about not being kept in the loop.

Now, imagine a team of volunteers, one of whom was contained "for his own good" and underwent some therapy during his time with SHIELD, another of whom is a dedicated anti-establishment fighter from a police state who is just now getting her orientation with SHIELD, who after they save the gang's collective hineys are suddenly, through no fault of their own other than being who they are, treated with suspicion within a heavily armed camp, then are duped and locked up.  What reason would they have to trust SHIELD, now?

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself
Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#15 RJDiogenes

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 05:26 PM

Because after it was explained to them, they should have understood that there was really very little option.  If Mack were to ask Elena what they should have done differently, what could she possibly say?
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#16 G-man

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Posted 25 April 2016 - 07:57 PM

"You could have trusted us."

That's the rub.  

Now the question is, did SHIELD actually lose the Secret Warriors over this?  I think Lincoln may stick with them, but the others ... probably will, but I'd think it more interesting if SHIELD actually lost them for the rest of the season, and actually had to earn their trust and cooperation.

Sometimes simple bullying only results in gaining more enemies than winning friends.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself who apologizes for harping on this, but it's something that just bugs me :ranting:

Edited by G-man, 26 April 2016 - 02:28 PM.

Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#17 RJDiogenes

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Posted 26 April 2016 - 05:33 PM

But that's the thing:  It's not about trusting them.  You can trust somebody implicitly, but if they're under somebody else's control, that's irrelevant.  There's nobody Coulson trusts more than Daisy.
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#18 G-man

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Posted 27 April 2016 - 05:20 AM

True, but when you are asking people to trust you even as you treat them with suspicion, and wrongfully imprison them, that's how you create and radicalize enemies.

Sometimes showing compassion and trust means taking risks, but the reward when things play out is those people you chose not to suspect and lock up, but instead recruited to help you resolve the matter, learn to trust you.  Unfortunately, that has never been SHIELD's way.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself
Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus

#19 RJDiogenes

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Posted 27 April 2016 - 06:32 PM

But, again, this has zero to do with trusting them. It's a situation that's out of their control. If somebody is exposed to a communicable disease and you quarantine them, it's not a personal attack. If they're being mind-controlled and you take them into custody, it's not a personal attack. If any of those four said to Coulson, "You should have trusted me," it would be a sign of incredible naivete, to say the least.
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#20 G-man

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Posted 28 April 2016 - 05:15 AM

That's a fine rationalization, except for the people getting locked up against their wills for whom it does feel like a personal attack.  Especially when the so-called "disease" only affects them, and no one else.

This is as much a matter of emotions as it is of logic.  And in terms of dealing with them emotionally, SHIELD may have just convinced them to leave and to never return.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself
Let me strive every moment of my life to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, so that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend my assistance to all who may need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens, and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
-- Doc Savage

Few people want to be moderated, most people see the need for everyone else to be moderated. -- Orpheus



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