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Rookie Doctors Will Soon Be Allowed to Work 28 Hours Straight


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#1 sierraleone

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 09:09 AM

They could previously be made to work really long shifts, then a cap of 16 hours was put into place in 2011.

They say the benefits of the cap have not been realized and taking it away.

Are people crazy? Who wants a doctor, a rookie doctor to boot, to be treating you in their 24th hour awake and working?

Part of their argument is that sometimes a treatment that takes more than 16 hours makes extending that important. If that is the case, keep the 16 hour cap with specific exceptions for long treatments and/or medical events (surgeries, labour and delivery, etc), don't just rip the whole cap up.

They aren't taking the cap off on a per week basis (80 hours) and require they get one day off in a 7 day period.

http://www.npr.org/s...-hours-straight
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#2 Orpheus

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Posted 12 March 2017 - 12:58 PM

I remember (well!) when this was typical. It wasn't that long ago. NY put a limit of 100hrs/wk (or was it 120) in the mid 90s, but few other states followed.

It's doable. I can tell you firsthand that it's not even as hard as it sounds (usually), as long as you don't dwell on your misery.

Still, I've always campaigned against long resident shifts/weekly hours. There's no medical/training benefit. It's just cheaper.

Excessively long hours promote patient-care mistakes and countless personal/psychological/family issues for residents.

Physicians would be the first to testify against such long hours in any other job, even noncritical ones. It's simply bad for the body/mind.

The UK has also been rolling back protections for house officers. It seems to be part of a larger anti-progressive political zeitgeist.

#3 sierraleone

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Posted 16 March 2017 - 04:03 PM

View PostOrpheus, on 12 March 2017 - 12:58 PM, said:

I remember (well!) when this was typical. It wasn't that long ago. NY put a limit of 100hrs/wk (or was it 120) in the mid 90s, but few other states followed.

It's doable. I can tell you firsthand that it's not even as hard as it sounds (usually), as long as you don't dwell on your misery.

Still, I've always campaigned against long resident shifts/weekly hours. There's no medical/training benefit. It's just cheaper.

Excessively long hours promote patient-care mistakes and countless personal/psychological/family issues for residents.

Physicians would be the first to testify against such long hours in any other job, even noncritical ones. It's simply bad for the body/mind.

The UK has also been rolling back protections for house officers. It seems to be part of a larger anti-progressive political zeitgeist.

The bolded sounds like victim-blaming to me ;) Teasing :) Though I recently read an article that starts off about a student who developed bi-polar disorder during their studies and had to drop out and will likely never be able to pay back their med-school loans, despite having disability insurance on their loan. But the article did touch on med-students more broadly:

Quote

Medical students are at a high risk for depression and suicidal ideation, according to a 2016 study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association. The study found the incidence of depression among this group was 27 per cent, compared to eight to nine per cent in the general population.
High demands placed on the students, intense studying and sleep deprivation are contributing factors, the study said.

Derek Puddester, a psychiatrist at the University of Ottawa who used to run wellness programs for medical students with mental health issues, said high debt loads add to stress levels.

I imagine some of the context of their cases/patients wear on their mental health as well. Just like cops and firefighters and social workers. It doesn't exactly promote health care staffs health though to put those other demands on them constantly.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#4 gsmonks

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Posted 16 March 2017 - 05:46 PM

I remember residents working long hours back in the early 70's, when I was working at hospitals to put myself through university. I'd  come on shift, the same people would be there, and they'd have been working since I went home to sleep.

I've worked many jobs over the years that required 12-hour shifts, and when you work those shifts, you become aware of other people working those same shifts: hospital staff, police, fire, ambulance, truck drivers, cab drivers, for some undogly reason 4 to 4 (AM or PM- take your pick).

12 hours turns into 14 hours when you consider getting to and from work, eating, sleeping, taking a shower, etc.

When I worked on the boats, we often worked 36 hours straight. That was the number of hours it took to fill the holds with fish. The skipper would then set the autopilot to take us back to port, we'd all fall down and fall asleep wherever we were, and he'd hope that the alarm would go off to wake him up if any problems arose.

. . . which is how many of those marine accidents happen that you see on tv, where ships run aground, run over small craft without apparently seeing them, crash into one another, etc.

When someone thinks stoopid is a good idea, other people tend to suffer.

Edited by gsmonks, 16 March 2017 - 05:47 PM.

Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#5 Orpheus

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Posted 17 March 2017 - 01:03 AM

I'm not victim blaming. Never in my training/career have I endorsed it. It's just BEGGING for poor performance by any physiological/psychological metric.

I just think that it sounds "impossibly bad" to anyone who hasn't endured it. Others suffer as badly for less: combat soldiers, homeless, 3-job parents...

And I wish NONE of them had to endure it. It's as preposterous as the 6-day 96-hour workweek factories once claimed were necessary and beneficial.

It is, in many ways, just hazing for docs, and nothing more than opportunistic brutalism toward the poor who are trying to get by or support their families.

I can see how I didn't make that clear, and I apologize for that. My phrasing was clouded by fond memories from a unnecessarily harsh time in my life.

Orpheus "Today (March 17) is Match Day, the perfect time to ask training programs 'When, if ever, did you stop beating your wife residents?'"

[Edited to add: "Match Day" is when the National Residency Match Program tells new docs where they will assigned (in the US) to do their residency]

Edited by Orpheus, 17 March 2017 - 01:08 AM.
: explained "Match Day" -- 3rd Friday each March



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