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Alabama's Roy Moore


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#21 sierraleone

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 09:48 AM

So the GOP Republicans have shown themselves to not be one of the things that what they claim to be… With this tax bill they have shown that they are not hawkish fiscal conservatives.

In a 11 days the Alabamian votes will show us whether the small-r republicans there are really the people of 'family values'.

So, all that is left that I can see on their 'traditional' 'republican' values is a hawkish foreign policy. Which seems to translate today now-a-days into build high border walls to keep everyone out and ignore the rest of the world. At least among the isolationist strain among the populace.

Edited by sierraleone, 02 December 2017 - 09:50 AM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#22 yadda yadda

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 03:52 PM

In 11 days we we will see that Alabamians are staggering Fox / Evangelical zombies, answering no call but the guiding pressure of that right-wing handed puppeteer up their butts.

Edited by yadda yadda, 02 December 2017 - 03:53 PM.


#23 sierraleone

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 04:24 PM

^ and they will be happy to do it because they will be thinking that coastal elite liberals are the ones trying to tell them what to do! Just like Fox and Evangelical leaders tell them!
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#24 sierraleone

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Posted 04 December 2017 - 10:50 PM

It seems that if Republicans didn't have bad judgment they'd have no judgment at all:
RNC to support Roy Moore in Senate race in Alabama, weeks after cutting ties with his campaign

ETA: It is bad enough that Alabamian republicans may support Roy Moore… but how many republicans in America are, if it is known to them, going to support the RNC decision to re-support Roy Moore at this point in the campaign? And if they don't support that decision, what does that mean to them?

Edited by sierraleone, 04 December 2017 - 10:58 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#25 gsmonks

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Posted 05 December 2017 - 02:17 PM

As I've said many times before about the GOP, they only pretend to be Christians, and in truth have no real morals or values.

Most "Christians" only pretend at it, regardless. The banner "Christian" is used as a device to hide any number of crimes, and to escape being held accountable.
Capitalism is a pyramid scheme run by the 1%.

#26 sierraleone

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 07:10 PM

More Trump related than Roy Moore, but considering how they have both been accused of committing sexual misconduct, Trump has full-throatedly endorsed Moore, Trump's accusers are back in the news, and we're watching the Alabama election today, I'll put this here.

Instead of re-phrasing it, I will quote my most recent post in the POTUS 2017 - ? thread:

Quote

- Trump's sexual harrassees: are in the news again, speaking out again in this #metoo environment. Two U.S. politicians, in response to reported questions IIUC, spoke about this. U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley, appointed by Trump, said that they should be heard, Trump is reportedly furious. U.S. Senator from NY, Kirsten Gillibrand, who has said others should resign, has said that Trump should resign. Trump's response to this statement that he should resigned due to alleged sexual harassment? More harassment, with possible sexual innuendo implied, this time of Gillibrand. Via his favourite medium of tweet of course:

Quote Lightweight Senator Kirsten Gillibrand, a total flunky for Chuck Schumer and someone who would come to my office “begging” for campaign contributions not so long ago (and would do anything for them), is now in the ring fighting against Trump. Very disloyal to Bill & Crooked-USED!

WaPo articles that well expressed the deplorableness of this:
Trump's disgusting Kirsten Gillibrand tweet is just the beginning of the #MeToo backlash
Or as Alexandra Petri puts it much more succinctly in just her article title: Trump respects women, you disgusting floozy

Edited by sierraleone, 12 December 2017 - 07:10 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#27 sierraleone

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 08:13 PM

Here is a WaPo live feed of results. If you don't have access to that WaPo link here is a NYTimes one.

It shows the Democrat Doug Jones at 61.2%, but that only represents 368 votes, so lots of votes to go ;) as results *just* started coming in. I am going to be hopeful instead of cynical until I am in circumstances in which I have no choice though! :) Not out of any moral orientation, but simply due to hedonistic reasons ;)
Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#28 sierraleone

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 10:37 PM

Wow, looks like I actually have a reason to be hopeful in this election. I am following the NYTimes results, it gives a lot more context and nuance. For example, Moore quickly overtook Jones early lead, and for quite a while, but even with Moore in the lead their prediction started to say Jones before it started turning. Looking over their page I saw that there was still a lot of tallying remaining in urban areas that were expected to be more Democrat than Republican.

Currently estimated of 92% of votes counted.
D - Jones - 49.5%
R - Moore - 48.9%
Write In - 1.6%

Jones leads by about 8,000 votes, andů I thought I read somewhere on their page recently that there were some estimated 100,000 votes to count or something like that, can't find it now, but those votes are largely in urban areas, so it is not expected to trend back to Moore again. Who knowsů and as I typed this post looks like AP has called the race for Jones.

ETA: Other reports are saying turnout was double what was expected by state officials. Even if someone were to say, well, hey now, you can't call it yet, there could be 200K votes left then! There were only two counties that were trending Moore that have not reported 100% of their votes yet, Baldwin (94% reporting), & Shelby (63%). There are three populous counties that were trending Jones that have not reported 100% of votes yet: Jefferson (85% - contains Birmingham), Mobile (70%), and Montgomery (51%). Mobile is 56.8% for Jones currently, the other two locations even more strongly for Jones so far.

Edited by sierraleone, 12 December 2017 - 10:54 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#29 yadda yadda

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 10:48 PM

Keeping up with the Jones'es...not easy for a child molester evidently. Thank you for partially restoring my faith in humanity you conscience-driven humans in Alabama!

#30 Omega

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 10:58 PM

A good outcome in every possible respect, except one: Alabama doesn't want to be represented by a Democrat. It just wasn't presented with any other acceptable option. This showcases everything wrong with how we elect people.

The GOP just lost this Senate seat because of their inflexible election system. If Alabama used approval voting instead of primaries, this would not have happened. Nor, on a national scale, would Trump. They need to start paying attention to such things.

#31 sierraleone

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 11:10 PM

View PostOmega, on 12 December 2017 - 10:58 PM, said:

A good outcome in every possible respect, except one: Alabama doesn't want to be represented by a Democrat. It just wasn't presented with any other acceptable option. This showcases everything wrong with how we elect people.

The GOP just lost this Senate seat because of their inflexible election system. If Alabama used approval voting instead of primaries, this would not have happened. Nor, on a national scale, would Trump. They need to start paying attention to such things.

I know you mean Alabama as short hand for the majority of Alabama, but it should still be pointed out. What did Trump win by? 70-30? So about 1/3 of people aren't happy to be represented by a  Republican? And is turn-out for democrats typically depressed by being a minority? I know, that is pretty much how democracy works ;) , especially in a 2 party-system.

I will be interested in seeing turn-out for various groups and how people parse the numbers to see if the difference was really republicans voting Democrat (or write-in, which seems to have made a big difference, though we might need a final tally to make sure). And/or if the difference was strong democrat turn-out and/or depressed republican turn-out.

Edited by sierraleone, 12 December 2017 - 11:13 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#32 sierraleone

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 11:44 PM

Roy Moore is not giving a concession speech yet, but has given a speech more or less saying the process needs to play out, to pray on it, and they will review the results in the morning.

5 minutes ago there were still some votes to be 20K votes to counted I thought, though I check on the results now and all counties are at 100% reporting.

Final results:
D - Jones - Total =  671,151   /  % = 49.9%
R - Moore - Total = 650,426   /  % = 48.4%
Write-Ins - Total = 22,819   /  % =   1.7%

So a difference of 20,725 votes between Jones and Moore (there is also, separately, 22,819 write-ins), and a difference of 1.5%.

For an automatic recount is has to be a difference less than 0.5%, for a requested recount it has to be "close" to 0.5% and requested, by the presumed defeated candidate, within 48 hours.

Edited by sierraleone, 12 December 2017 - 11:49 PM.

Rules for surviving an Autocracy:

Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
Source: http://www2.nybooks....r-survival.html

#33 Omega

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Posted Yesterday, 12:28 AM

Oh, but wait, the Alabama Supreme Court which Roy Moore was part of just ruled that Alabama can destroy all the ballot records immediately after the election. Sorry, Roy!


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