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THE ORVILLE - S2, E2: "PRIMAL URGES"...


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#1 FarscapeOne

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 02:19 PM

Ed and the crew race to save a small group of survivors on a planet about to be destroyed by its sun. Meanwhile, Bortus and Klyden start marriage counseling when Bortus' obsession with the ship's simulation room gets out of hand.

#2 FarscapeOne

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 02:20 PM

This is the episode that was held over from last season, based on production number code.

#3 RJDiogenes

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 07:13 PM

So we won't be seeing the new character, I guess.
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#4 FarscapeOne

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 10:47 AM

I really enjoyed this episode!

It reminds of Lt. Barclay's holodeck addiction on TNG.  Retreating into a fantasy world, in this case porn, is quite easy to do with a device like the simulator.  That can easily happen to us when we develop that technology.  Hell, people are already addicted to entertainment devices... imagine when an immersive environment like that becomes commonplace.

I like how Bortus is still having issues with his baby's sex change.  And one can really see his side of anger in Klyden because he didn't fight alongside him.

That planet being swallowed by the sun... that was GORGEOUS!  And terrifying at the same time.  I really loved that little plot with the last remnants of that civilization.  That situation reminds me of TNG's "Homeward" in season 7.  Personally, I liked this solution better than what was originally to be the fate of the Boraalans in the TNG episode.

(Interesting coincidence... Penny Johnson Jerald was in "Homeward".  Her first appearance in the franchise, if memory serves me.)

I am wondering what scenes were added to the episode to make it work with the longer episode length this season.  My guess is the therapy sessions.  Anyone else have a guess?

#5 Jorgasnarova

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Posted 04 January 2019 - 11:52 PM

Visually, a remarkably impressive episode.  I wonder if one of the reasons it was held back was to allow the visual effects crew sufficient time to complete their outstanding work.  Some of the shots of the Orville slicing through space against the backdrop of the sun were weepingly gorgeous.  Screen saver time, I think.

#6 RJDiogenes

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Posted 05 January 2019 - 04:51 PM

Bloody Hell, this is why I love Orville.  :lol:  Bortus has quite a range of sex fantasies going on there, from his submissive dungeon scenario to the hedonistic oasis orgy.  But as hilarious, and oddly touching, as all that was, the scenes of John, Dan, and Isaac desperately trying to save the ship while being stroked and nuzzled by horny Moclan porn holograms was the highlight of my week.  I wonder what percentage of the simulator database is dedicated to erotica. I'm sure most of the crew have something funky going on in there. I know I would.  Not with Moclans, of course.  I'd be more likely to-- but I digress.

On the flip side of that, in true Orville fashion, we have the heartbreaking reasons for Bortus's career-endangering and life-threatening porn addiction. He still hasn't come to terms with his baby's sex change or Klyden's part in it. The scene with Dr Finn acting as counselor, bringing it all out in the open, was great. Especially the dramatic shift of Klyden coming in as the injured party and suddenly realizing what his part really was in Bortus's breakdown.  Watching the Moclans act out what is essentially a very common and universal relationship crisis in their characteristically blunt and prosaic manner was both hilarious and poignant.

The B-plot involving the rescue of the planet's last survivors was not well developed and should have been given its own episode, if it needed to be done at all.  Given the weight and excitement previewed for the upcoming first contact episode, it was dramatically unproductive to throw an inconceivably tragic first contact situation like this in ahead of it.  There were plot holes aplenty, and very little attention was given to the horrific dilemma of leaving behind more than half of a civilization's remaining population, even while rescuing a handful of people with no more than the clothes on their backs, who have nothing left of their lives or world or culture, and who do not even represent a viable breeding population.  What will become of them?

Also, on the subject of plot holes, the computer virus was not really necessary to the overall plot, providing only a little exaggerated drama at the end.  What was so special about the Moclan Oasis Orgy program that Bortus needed to go to a shady Tardigrade for it?  "Computer, give me an idyllic pond and a half dozen horny hunks."  Easy peasy.

But, structural quibbles aside, it was still a very enjoyable episode (and another reminder of how easy it would be for CBS to do real Star Trek).  Gordon, Alara, and Grayson didn't have a lot to do-- and Grayson was acting like kind of a jerk for no apparent reason-- but the season is young.

View PostFarscapeOne, on 04 January 2019 - 10:47 AM, said:

I am wondering what scenes were added to the episode to make it work with the longer episode length this season.  My guess is the therapy sessions.  Anyone else have a guess?  
Good question.  It could have been the space SFX, as Jorg suggests, since they have a bigger budget this year.  They may have just used existing footage to make a "director's cut."  There were an awful lot of porn scenes.  :D
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#7 Orpheus

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Posted 09 January 2019 - 02:32 AM

View PostRJDiogenes, on 05 January 2019 - 04:51 PM, said:

Bloody Hell, this is why I love Orville.

Indeed, this is much more on track.

View PostRJDiogenes, on 05 January 2019 - 04:51 PM, said:

I'd be more likely to-- but I digress.

Why so demure? You're on ExIsle, and known as a gentleman of exquisite tastes and delicate discernment. Can there be any doubt what Lovely Wimmiz [or Mind-twisting Gents] torment your passionate dreams?

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Watching the Moclans act out what is essentially a very common and universal relationship crisis in their characteristically blunt and prosaic manner was both hilarious and poignant.
As someone who has done couples counseling and psychotherapy, I can argue that it's ALWAYS poignant (and often a little bit hilarious]. I love how the ep left a flat concreat answer for those who like plain tied up ends, but left a lot of loose ends for those capable of, and inclined to, deep introspection or outward-directed philosophical exploration.

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The B-plot involving the rescue of the planet's last survivors
I love that you call this the B-plot. So many shows would be happy to have it as a season-pinnacle A-plot.

To me, either one works as an A- or B-, depending on one's inclinations and tastes -- and that's why I'm a fan of Orville, whatever I think of the rest of MacFarlane's work.

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"Computer, give me an idyllic pond and a half dozen horny hunks."  Easy peasy.
Oh, you innocent child. Try it and get back to me when you recover.

#8 RJDiogenes

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Posted 09 January 2019 - 06:59 PM

View PostOrpheus, on 09 January 2019 - 02:32 AM, said:

Why so demure? You're on ExIsle, and known as a gentleman of exquisite tastes and delicate discernment. Can there be any doubt what Lovely Wimmiz [or Mind-twisting Gents] torment your passionate dreams?  
Well, let's just say I'd take a tour through the decades, from Fay Wray and Anna May Wong in the 30s to Emily Kinney and Nicole Beharie in the 20-teens.  I can provide a more comprehensive list for those interested.  :lol:

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As someone who has done couples counseling and psychotherapy, I can argue that it's ALWAYS poignant (and often a little bit hilarious]. I love how the ep left a flat concreat answer for those who like plain tied up ends, but left a lot of loose ends for those capable of, and inclined to, deep introspection or outward-directed philosophical exploration.  
Another cool thing about Orville is that, while it's a very welcome return to episodic storytelling, the characters' lives do continue in the background (or foreground), so it's not like every episode is completely isolated, as in the good old days. This I consider a welcome change.

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To me, either one works as an A- or B-, depending on one's inclinations and tastes -- and that's why I'm a fan of Orville, whatever I think of the rest of MacFarlane's work.  
I suppose it was a matter of presentation.  Bortus felt like the A-Plot.  And the doomed planet felt like it was given short shrift.  It should have been given shubstantially shtretched-out shrift.

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Oh, you innocent child. Try it and get back to me when you recover.  
I meant the setup, not the execution.  :lol:
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#9 Niko

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Posted 09 January 2019 - 10:20 PM

View PostRJDiogenes, on 09 January 2019 - 06:59 PM, said:

Well, let's just say I'd take a tour through the decades, from Fay Wray and Anna May Wong in the 30s to Emily Kinney and Nicole Beharie in the 20-teens.  I can provide a more comprehensive list for those interested.  :lol:

That would be an interesting thing to explore in sci-fi... In a world with holo-tech like this that can theoretically create ANYTHING, is it "legal" and/or ethical to use a person's exact likeness without some sort of "licensing"?  I guess it'd be the same principles that drive the legality of fan-fiction or fan-art of particular characters/actors, but bringing it into the sort of realism you see in holo-tech on these shows seems like it might be a bit of a step too far?   Would "real" holodecks have some version of the youtube algorithms to try to stop people from creating/sharing programs with licensed properties?
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#10 FarscapeOne

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Posted 09 January 2019 - 11:30 PM

BABYLON 5 touched on that with the holobrothel in THE RIVER OF SOULS.

#11 Orpheus

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Posted 10 January 2019 - 09:23 AM

As I recall, there were clear indications that Quark dabbled in unlicensed/unauthorized holographic persona recreations.

Certainly he got drubbed by Major Kira for making an unauthorized recreation of her for a "special client" in S3 (S03E08-ish?)

#12 FarscapeOne

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Posted 10 January 2019 - 11:01 AM

"MERIDIAN"... yes, but they really didn't go into the legality of it that much, not to the extent B5 was attempting.

Side note... that B-story was far superior to the A-story.  And it started the STAR TREK career of Jeffrey Combs.

#13 RJDiogenes

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Posted 10 January 2019 - 06:20 PM

View PostNiko, on 09 January 2019 - 10:20 PM, said:

That would be an interesting thing to explore in sci-fi... In a world with holo-tech like this that can theoretically create ANYTHING, is it "legal" and/or ethical to use a person's exact likeness without some sort of "licensing"?  
Maybe that's why Bortus had to go to the Tardigrade for his last simulation.  Maybe those Moclans were all hunky movie actors or sexy pop stars or something.

View PostFarscapeOne, on 09 January 2019 - 11:30 PM, said:

BABYLON 5 touched on that with the holobrothel in THE RIVER OF SOULS.  
I don't remember that at all.  I'll have to dig it out if I get a chance.
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#14 Orpheus

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:04 AM

Yeah I didn't remember it either, but after a couple of days it percolated to the top of my consciousness. I now remember Zack trying to handle it as a zoning or business licensing issue, and of course the comeuppance at the end.

I'll have to dig down into my achives this weekend. But TBH, I don't recall being particularly enamored of it back in the day.

It actually seems quite plausible that they were simulated from famous movie scenes. It would provide raw data and add zest for most Moclan consumers. I recall that "Friends" had some episode asserting a widespread Leia-in-a-gold-bikini fetish (and some of my own friends confirming it). Such a porn scene would likely seem quite peculiar to an alien anthropologist, working  from first principles.

#15 RJDiogenes

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 06:52 PM

I keep meaning to dig out my B5 movie set. I have a feeling they will be more enjoyable now than they were then.  My suspicion is that back then they were disappointing because they didn't advance the story, which we were all on the edge of our seat about, but now we'll be able to appreciate them more objectively as standalone stories.
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