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Which country is the greatest threat

Politics-world Greatest threat 2003

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Poll: Which country is the greatest threat to world peace? (74 member(s) have cast votes)

Which country is the greatest threat to world peace?

  1. North Korea (20 votes [29.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 29.41%

  2. Iran (4 votes [5.88%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.88%

  3. Iraq (1 votes [1.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.47%

  4. US (32 votes [47.06%])

    Percentage of vote: 47.06%

  5. Israel (5 votes [7.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.35%

  6. Afghanistan (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. Pakistan (1 votes [1.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.47%

  8. Syria (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  9. Saudi Arabia (1 votes [1.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.47%

  10. China (4 votes [5.88%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.88%

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#1 Enmar

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:12 AM

Inspired by a recent poll done by the EU, proudly won by Israel, closely followed by... the US.

I know, I know, polls are questionable... but the European public looks pretty questionable as well from here :eek:

Quote

Monday’s Eurobarometer opinion survey found that 59 per cent of Europeans believe Israel to pose the greatest danger to global security – ahead of Iran, North Korea and Iraq.

Here's a link to the poll results: http://www.taipeitim...1/05/2003074657

To related quotes from Arab and Israeli papers: http://news.bbc.co.u...ast/3243305.stm

And the confused debate about the questions that were used: http://www.eupolitix...fced4bdebfa.htm

And the winning quote is...

Quote

Ironically, the same poll found that 81 per cent of Europeans thought the EU should become more involved in Middle East peacemaking efforts... Obviously, such polls confirm every Israeli instinct about the need to keep Europeans as far away from any position of diplomatic influence as possible. Memo to Europe: demonizing a democracy under attack is no way to win friends and influence people.

Jerusalem Post - Israel

Edit: Meep. The thingie cut my question half way :( Can some powerful mod edit the question, please? I know it's terribly unprofessional after the poll was started, but we'll survive ;)

Edited by Enmar, 07 November 2003 - 10:16 AM.

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#2 Rov Judicata

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:23 AM

Poll edited.

Yeah, I saw the poll too. It's extremely disturbing. There's really no positive way to spin it.
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#3 Enmar

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:33 AM

TY :)
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#4 Lord Ravensburg

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:35 AM

This just makes me want to kick people in the nuts.

#5 Rhea

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:48 AM

You act like a global bully, you get treated like one. Regardless of any moral high ground we might claim while ousting Saddam, the WAY in which we went about it makes us look like a King Kong crashing our way through international circles.
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#6 Lord Ravensburg

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:50 AM

Wow.  The fact that even people here are choosing the US over North Korea (you know, North Korea, the country that just said the other day it would use nuclear weapons) isn't making things better.  It defies logic.

#7 Drew

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 10:53 AM

Lord Ravensburg, on Nov 7 2003, 09:50 AM, said:

It defies logic.
Yes, it does. But I'm not sure logic plays a part their decision.  :cool:

For what it's worth, I chose Saudi Arabia.
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#8 Uncle Sid

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 11:00 AM

I'm sorry, but there's a point where you have to stop excusing the faulty reasoning skills of the people who answer these polls in Europe.  Honestly, I'd expect that sort of poll response from people who have a government controlled press, not people in a democracy with an ostensibly free press who have the ability to think for themselves, or so we are lead to believe.  What the US looks like and what it is are two different things.  Now we're the big bully for beating up on the biggest bully in the Middle East, bar none.  Oh, but I forgot, we wouldn't want to have the poor Europeans lose their loans and receipts from weapons sales that they so graciously negotiated with Iraq before it was a pariah... just like the US did.

Europe gets sixty years of no war out of the last fifteen hundred, and suddenly they're experts on who is a menace and who isn't.  If they hadn't been in such a bloody hurry after they were done blowing themselves up to run away from their colonies after mismanaging them for centuries, we wouldn't have to deal with half of this stuff.

Edited by Uncle Sid, 07 November 2003 - 11:01 AM.

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#9 StarDust

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 11:02 AM

Maybe we are a threat to Global Peace, that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Big difference between peace and freedom.  Big difference between acting like a doormat and dealing with your enemies.

I'll take freedom any day.  

They want peace they should leave us alone.  We put up with Al Queda attacking us for over a decade. Enough is enough.

Besides, the myth of global peace is just that , a myth.  What time in the history of man has the globe been peacefull?  It's been peacfull for some as they stick their head in the sand and ignore what's happened in the middle east and Africa, for example. It's kind of like saying "just don't let it touch me, I don't care what happens to them and can just filter it out like it's not there".

As far as europeans go, didn't most of them lie down for Hitler, hoping he'd leave them alone?  Seems to me they've always been in the "peace at any cost" camp. Unless of course they're starting it. Nothing to be proud of, but certainly a point of view that will affect their opinions.

#10 StarDust

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 11:33 AM

Uncle Sid, on Nov 7 2003, 12:00 PM, said:

What the US looks like and what it is are two different things.  Now we're the big bully for beating up on the biggest bully in the Middle East, bar none.  Oh, but I forgot, we wouldn't want to have the poor Europeans lose their loans and receipts from weapons sales that they so graciously negotiated with Iraq before it was a pariah... just like the US did.
Convienent  how people like to forget little details like that, isn't it?  

Quote

Europe gets sixty years of no war out of the last fifteen hundred, and suddenly they're experts on who is a menace and who isn't.  If they hadn't been in such a bloody hurry after they were done blowing themselves up to run away from their colonies after mismanaging them for centuries, we wouldn't have to deal with half of this stuff.
So very true. Most of our battles the last 50  years have been dealing with those messes.  Even Vietnam was a result of the mess the Imperialist French created, then ran from.

#11 QuiGon John

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 11:55 AM

Hrm.  I find myself pretty troubled by this poll-- not because the US finished second; I'm used to that, and I have my own issues with some of our recent actions.  I'm willing to concede we're part of the problem.

What troubles me is seeing Israel finish first.  I don't always agree with what they do, either... but at what point do we stop blaming the targets of violence for hitting back?  This poll smacks to me of the mindset which says that if Israel weren't there, the troubles in the Middle East would go away.  There may have been some element of truth to that once, but we're well past that stage now.  If demonizing our enemies isn't the solution, nor does it help to blame our friends for existing.

I don't know... at least I'm heartened to read further and find out that it wasn't an either/or poll.  Israel may have gotten 59 percent... but the second-place nations got 53.  It's not as bad as I at first feared: That Israel might have gotten 59 percent, with the rest of the world splitting the other 41.  That would have truly been scary...   :blink:

#12 Rhea

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 12:16 PM

^Agreed. The Israelis really *have* been demonized to a great extent.

Whatever the world may have owed the Jews morally as payment for Hitler's depradations, it was naive of them to think they could move back into territory already occupied by folks who had just as legitimate a claim to be there simply because their ancestors hailed from there (hey, I could claim a lot of land in Scotland based on the same reasoning).

But it's a long-done deal. And sooner or later everyone on both sides is going to have to find a way to deal with it. I suspect that erecting that nasty Berlin-type wall isn't helping the problem any.

I feel sorry for the ordinary folks on both sides caught in the crossfire.

And I'm amazed at the hypocrisy of blaming Israel for the whole mess.
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When I don’t understand, I have an unbearable itch to know why. - RAH


Everything is theoretically impossible, until it is done. One could write a history of science in reverse by assembling the solemn pronouncements of highest authority about what could not be done and could never happen.  - RAH

#13 Norville

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 12:26 PM

I'm going to be a troublemaker again and say that I can't answer the poll unless there's a choice for "All of the above" or "All of them" (meaning everyone everywhere). It's just my sense of humor acting up. ;)

(More seriously, I'd probably vote for NK, Pakistan, *and* Saudi Arabia, and we can't forget China sitting there sizzling away... and Iran and Iraq are messy... Afghanistan would probably prefer to be left alone, despite whatever the Taliban wanted, since they're very cranky tribesmen who've fought outside invaders forever... Syria's suspicious... we throw our weight around a lot without apparently caring about the consequences, and then have to clean up after those consequences... and I support Israel's right to exist, which doesn't mean I agree with everything they do, but I'm not sure what *else* they can do to survive...)
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#14 Godeskian

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 12:32 PM

I null voted.

The biggest threat to world peace isn't nations, it's individuals who chose violence as their method of doing business.

Osama Bin Laden proved that one doesn't need to be a country to be a threat

Edited by Godeskian, 07 November 2003 - 01:17 PM.

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#15 Drew

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 12:44 PM

Godeskian, on Nov 7 2003, 11:32 AM, said:

Osama Bin Laden proved that one doesn't need to be a country to be a threat
Even so, such a person needs financing. That's why I chose Saudi Arabia.

EDIT: I can't believe that NK and the US are currently tied in the Ex Isle version of this poll.  :wacko:

Edited by Drew, 07 November 2003 - 12:45 PM.

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#16 Norville

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 01:07 PM

Quote

The biggest threat to world piece

Forgive me, but I like that typo. World peace versus the world in pieces...
"The dew has fallen with a particularly sickening thud this morning."
- Marvin the Paranoid Android, "Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy"

Rules for Surviving an Autocracy
Rule#1: Believe the Autocrat.
Rule#2: Do not be taken in by small signs of normality.
Rule#3: Institutions will not save you.
Rule#4: Be outraged.
Rule#5: Don't make compromises.
Rule#6: Remember the future.
- Masha Gessen
http://www.nybooks.c...s-for-survival/

#17 Godeskian

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 01:17 PM

there's a line from a movie that goes somethign like, "I'm a man of peace, <punch> a piece of this, <punch> a piece of that"

edited the original post

Defy Gravity!


The Doctor: The universe is big. It's vast and complicated and ridiculous and sometimes, very rarely, impossible things just happen and we call them miracles... and that's a theory. Nine hundred years and I've never seen one yet, but this will do me.


#18 Godeskian

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 01:18 PM

Drew, on Nov 7 2003, 06:44 PM, said:

EDIT: I can't believe that NK and the US are currently tied in the Ex Isle version of this poll.  :wacko:
I guess not everyone believes the US is acting like a decent sort right now.

actually, perception matters a great deal and that's something i'm not sure many of the pro-americans get at the moment is how bad the image of the US is in a great many places in the world.

#19 Lover of Purple

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 01:34 PM

Actually I don't think the US has been looked at in a good light since the Korean war. We've made mistakes *cough*Vietnam*cough* and I think most of the world has glared at us. Even back in the sixties most of the world has despised the US, so as far as I see it nothing has changed. Smaller and/or less powerfull countries will always hate us. Even if we gave them all they wanted and asked nothing in return. Most of the world would happily come in here and pick at our bones if the US died. It's a simple fact of the world.

So, I am one who is very pro-USA but I don't have any misunderstandings about how the world sees my country. I just don't agree with them.

Edited to add: This poll saddens me that so many here misunderstand this country and place the US ahead of NK as a threat.

It's a good thing we aren't as bad as the world (and this poll) makes us out to be. If we where, we would already have nuked half of the planet out of existance. Sheesh!!!

Edited by Lover of Purple, 07 November 2003 - 01:39 PM.


#20 Rhea

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Posted 07 November 2003 - 01:36 PM

Well said, LoP.  :cool:
The future is better than the past. Despite the crepehangers, romanticists, and anti-intellectuals, the world steadily grows better because the human mind, applying itself to environment, makes it better. With hands...with tools...with horse sense and science and engineering.
- Robert A. Heinlein

When I don’t understand, I have an unbearable itch to know why. - RAH


Everything is theoretically impossible, until it is done. One could write a history of science in reverse by assembling the solemn pronouncements of highest authority about what could not be done and could never happen.  - RAH



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