[Godeskian]

http://news.bbc.co.u...cas/4765058.stm

Quote

Video has been obtained by a US news agency showing President George W Bush being briefed by officials on the eve of the Hurricane Katrina disaster.
The confidential video obtained by the Associated Press shows very strong warnings being given to Mr Bush about the potential strength of the storm.

It appears to contradict subsequent suggestions by the Bush administration that the threat had been unclear

Quote

Another official, Max Mayfield of the National Hurricane Center, tells the final briefing that storm models predict minimal flooding inside New Orleans during the hurricane.

But he adds that the possibility of anticlockwise winds and storm surges could cause the levees at Lake Pontchartrain to be overrun afterwards is "obviously a very, very grave concern".

His concern was borne out by events when levees collapsed, letting in the floodwater disastrously.

The president, however, said four days after the storm: "I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees."

Anyone but me see the contradiction Bush is uttering here?

I'm now taking bets on Bush getting yet another free ride from his goverment.

This post has been edited by Godeskian: 02 March 2006 - 03:56 AM

[WildChildCait]

*yaw drops*

[Spectacles]

A lot more here:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060301/ap_on_...h/katrina_video

[rponiarski]

Yes, he will get another free pass from Congress. They are too afraid to actually do anything meaningful about this, otherwise the incompetance of the administration will be out there for all to see and they definately do not want that to happen.

And think, this man has an MBA. Shows what college degrees are worth these days...

[Spectacles]

Quote

Bush didn't ask a single question during the final briefing before Katrina struck on Aug. 29, but he assured soon-to-be-battered state officials: "We are fully prepared."

How typical. Disengaged and cheerily optimistic as usual.

[emsparks]

More importantly the New Orleans Fire department is finally searching for the bodies remaining in the ninth ward. When asked why now 8 months later a spokesman said it was to make way for the clean up, they didn’t want to throw out dead bodies with the trash.

This is America and in America we don’t leave our dead behind. Yes I guess so, as long as your money is green.

You have no idea how disgusted I am. You can maybe understand the response to the storm, but there is no excuse to waiting 8 months to retrieve the dead on dry land.

[offworlder]

well let me slightly defend Bush for just a sec
{Wait! what?? me, the honourable opposition defend Bush??} Bush is not the doer-goer first-off-the-mark: he hires people he has faith in to manage and do, and put requests before him for signature: that's the job of prez as he sees it; he wasn't the expert to go and do it all: he hired his homeland chief and his Fema chief ........... now I personally think he hired the wrong guys, he loves to see himself as a super picker of people and he's wrong, he's not a super picker of people.

He really needed a well organized homeland and well organized Fema, with great setups and comm and LEADERS. Homeland security has failed in many areas and they failed in NewO. Fema griped about homeland but Fema could have put things before homeland and before the prez even around homeland even if it miffs mr homeland. they could have done and gone and spent and org'd - they didn't. Bush should have been more on the ball overseeing those two areas and I just believe Bush gets overwhelmed with what all he should do, he has some sec/admin make his sked and sticks to it like glue with trust and faith, never stepping Outside the Box as so many yuppies like to say today.

Bush should not be expected to do and go everything, but he should pick better leaders and oversee them better, more in the loop, more on the ball, more asking what things he might put forward, what things more to sign, more prep on states or emergencies, more proactive with his chiefs. He can't do everything but he needs to pick better people who can get more from him, go more and do more, For US! - sometimes it seems he's too much on cruise control and I think that's what happened with the gulf emergency. He depended, without seeing the Whats and the Whens and the doings and goings. he waited and watched. He should have listened to these briefs more, and when Brown said he was concerned, Bush should have told Brown to get out there on a flight, put somethings in front of prez for money signing, and get to the head of the game on this gulf thing. His father's Gulf was over by Persia, but W's Gulf was ours, and though he didn't have nearly the time he could have got the chiefs jumping more on it: spend accounts, stage stuffs, kickoff men and women, and get some planes gassed up.

I think, though I don't know details, that he was distracted by something else, not only his holiday in Texas, but just a bit out of comm touch with his chiefs, like his mind was on the Middle east and quail hunting, or something, but I'll never know. He could have faxed over signings for money, stuff, men, lots of things, he could have listened; but mainly I think his people let him down: they could have told him more, and rather than just say Concerned, they could have spent, and staged, and gone, and flown, they could have led the way like dept chiefs should do, rather than just blame it all on him. They were lax, and Bush chose the wrong guys. and have I said yet I Really don't trust this lawyer crony guy as the homeland chief, what the heck does HE know about terrorists or security ops or catastrophic emergencies? or about Fema for that matter?
whew, Im tired and getting off this 'typer' for a while.

[G-man]

Grrr ... in the meantime they'll deny or hush up how it was thanks to the placement of FEMA under DHS, that FEMA was systematically stripped of the manpower and resources it needed to do its job because the other heads at DHS couldn't stand Brown, and they were too busy building their own personal empires.

/s/

Gloriosus
the G-man Himself

[Zwolf]

Quote

Bush should not be expected to do and go everything,

I don't think anybody was expecting him to go haul sandbags or anything. What irks me is that the guy had the unmitigated 'nads to go on Good Morning America and say "I don't think anyone anticipated the breach of the levees," when it's now been made very clear that he was informed that exactly that might happen. He knew what was up, but instead of being commander-in-chief, he was off eating cake at parties, trying to sell old people bad social security plans, and playing the gee-tar, whoopin' it up.

Instead of mobilizing his staff to deal with this problem, he was goofing around. Condi Rice was off buying shoes and watching Spamalot instead of being on point to help organize foreign aid for the victims. But he wasn't concerned. He asked no questions, made no adjustments to his schedule, and just went right on having fun... even though he'd definitely been told what the situation was.

Here's a photo of a guy who KNEW WHAT WAS GOING ON.

That's what I'm ticked about.

Cheers,

Zwolf

*edited to change the photo to a link, to avoid a hotlinking issue

This post has been edited by Zwolf666: 02 March 2006 - 05:00 PM

[veganmom]

I sometimes think his style of governing is, "maybe it will go away."

I used to think he was clueless. Now I know he's just in it for the after-office speaking fees and for tax breaks people will be thanking him for for ages.


I still don't know how Clinton or the rest of us sleep at night. I always liken it to spending years and years paying down a credit card and making friends in the neighborhood, then some kid takes control, credit card goes back up to the limit and above, he tells all the neighbors to F off, etc. He's going to prance merrily into the sunset and we'll be cleaning up after his mess for years, including New Orleans.

Years of neglect and warnings, an immediate danger, and he's laughing and prancing.
The other thing that worries me? People voted for him. I hope they've learned.

I think New Orleans is much more horrifying than any of us can imagine. It's been how many months? and they're still digging bodies out? The whole darn Army and Navy should have been deployed down there to clean up. Don't we help our own first? But there's not a lot of news coverage, because it's "old news" (unless you live there or are from there...). And, whoever said it is right. It's poor people, so.....

[Lord of the Sword]

Zwolf666, on Mar 2 2006, 03:44 PM, said:

That's what I'm ticked about.

Cheers,

Zwolf

I think that picture sums up his whole administration fairly well. Personally, the fact that the man KNEW beforehand, and did nothing....he should be impeached. Hell they wanted to impeach clinton for his extramartial affair. What Bush did, or in this case, didn't do is far more reprehenisble IMO.

This post has been edited by LORD of the SWORD: 02 March 2006 - 07:02 PM

[Lin731]

Offworlder, here's the problems with that premise.

1. Bush said they had no way of knowing the levys might fail or the level of devastation thath could occur. The video tape makes it clear that all of that was spelled out for him beforehand.

2. On the not being responsible for incompetence of those in charge of FEMA...He's the one that rolled FEMA into the Homeland Security Dept. He's also the one that filled this vital agency with political appointees that didn't know what they were doing and often drove out people that DID know what they were doing.

[Rhea]

Let me see, why does this sound familiar?

1. Something disastrous occurs that was predicted for this Preisdent before said disaster occurred, either the President or his staff stands up and lies and says they didn't know..

2. After the disaster their stand proves to be based on lies, but they get a free ride anyway because nobody wants to impeach this liar.

When we found out that Bush sent our kids to die in Iraq on false pretenses (we know now the White House had a pretty good idea they were using phony information), nobody rushed to impeach this man.

Now he got caught lying about the levees in New Orleans. Anybody want to be that he gets another free ride?

How many times do you have to get caught lying to the Ameircan public before you lose your job?

Bush and this Republican congress have shown themselves to be the most power-hungry, idiotic, lying bunch we've had in my lifetime. Why do they still have their jobs?

We're drowning in debt, the Medicare plan is a disaster, there's no money left to fund No Child Left Behind because it's all gone to the war in Iraq. New Orleans is a mess, we stiill haven't found bin Laden because we've spent all our resources freeing people who want us the hell out of their country, and somebody explain to me why any of them still have jobs!

This post has been edited by Rhea: 02 March 2006 - 04:16 PM

[Palisades]

Rhea, rponiarski, and others: I take it you've started petitions to get Bush impeached, collected hundreds of signatures, and mailed them to your state's Representatives? Have you mailed letters to your Representatives? Have you also written your local newspaper?

Or are you just complaining on some out-of-the-way message board about how the American people don't get their act together and do something?

[Fragsta]

People voted for this man???

[Spectacles]

Solar Wind, on Mar 2 2006, 04:25 PM, said:

Rhea, rponiarski, and others: I take it you've started petitions to get Bush impeached, collected hundreds of signatures, and mailed them to your state's Representatives? Have you mailed letters to your Representatives? Have you also written your local newspaper?

Or are you just complaining on some out-of-the-way message board about how the American people don't get their act together and do something?

Speaking as one of "others," yep, pretty much. I've signed petitions to get Congress to investigate any number of events that have showcased Bush's incompetence. I've written letters to my representatives. And I suspect other "others" have, too.

When you realize that your country is being run by a wildly incompetent administration, you tend to get concerned enough to act.

[Palisades]

^ Do you care to start a thread detailing the "number of events that have showcased Bush's incompetence"? That way those of us who write letters have additional ammunition to use.

[Themis]

How can Bush hire or appoint leaders when he isn't one and, moreover, doesn't seem to know what one is??

Just more of his incompetence to be disgusted about.

I'm too much a homebody to know enough people to start any petitions (heck, I don't have enough e-mail contacts to forward those "please forward" e-mails, not that I would) but I'd sure sign any that came my way...

Themis

[Kosh]

offworlder, on Mar 2 2006, 03:21 PM, said:

well let me slightly defend Bush for just a sec
{Wait! what?? me, the honourable opposition defend Bush??} Bush is not the doer-goer first-off-the-mark: he hires people he has faith in to manage and do, and put requests before him for signature: that's the job of prez as he sees it; he wasn't the expert to go and do it all: he hired his homeland chief and his Fema chief ........... now I personally think he hired the wrong guys, he loves to see himself as a super picker of people and he's wrong, he's not a super picker of people.

He really needed a well organized homeland and well organized Fema, with great setups and comm and LEADERS. Homeland security has failed in many areas and they failed in NewO. Fema griped about homeland but Fema could have put things before homeland and before the prez even around homeland even if it miffs mr homeland. they could have done and gone and spent and org'd - they didn't. Bush should have been more on the ball overseeing those two areas and I just believe Bush gets overwhelmed with what all he should do, he has some sec/admin make his sked and sticks to it like glue with trust and faith, never stepping Outside the Box as so many yuppies like to say today.

Bush should not be expected to do and go everything, but he should pick better leaders and oversee them better, more in the loop, more on the ball, more asking what things he might put forward, what things more to sign, more prep on states or emergencies, more proactive with his chiefs. He can't do everything but he needs to pick better people who can get more from him, go more and do more, For US! - sometimes it seems he's too much on cruise control and I think that's what happened with the gulf emergency. He depended, without seeing the Whats and the Whens and the doings and goings. he waited and watched. He should have listened to these briefs more, and when Brown said he was concerned, Bush should have told Brown to get out there on a flight, put somethings in front of prez for money signing, and get to the head of the game on this gulf thing. His father's Gulf was over by Persia, but W's Gulf was ours, and though he didn't have nearly the time he could have got the chiefs jumping more on it: spend accounts, stage stuffs, kickoff men and women, and get some planes gassed up.

I think, though I don't know details, that he was distracted by something else, not only his holiday in Texas, but just a bit out of comm touch with his chiefs, like his mind was on the Middle east and quail hunting, or something, but I'll never know. He could have faxed over signings for money, stuff, men, lots of things, he could have listened; but mainly I think his people let him down: they could have told him more, and rather than just say Concerned, they could have spent, and staged, and gone, and flown, they could have led the way like dept chiefs should do, rather than just blame it all on him. They were lax, and Bush chose the wrong guys. and have I said yet I Really don't trust this lawyer crony guy as the homeland chief, what the heck does HE know about terrorists or security ops or catastrophic emergencies? or about Fema for that matter?
whew, Im tired and getting off this 'typer' for a while.

In this case, Bush is sunk. There is video tape of him being briefed, and well briefed at that, and then there is tape of him saying that he was never told some of these things. It is offical, he has been caught red handed in a lie. No way around this one.

[Rhea]

Spectacles, on Mar 2 2006, 01:35 PM, said:

Solar Wind, on Mar 2 2006, 04:25 PM, said:

Rhea, rponiarski, and others: I take it you've started petitions to get Bush impeached, collected hundreds of signatures, and mailed them to your state's Representatives? Have you mailed letters to your Representatives? Have you also written your local newspaper?

Or are you just complaining on some out-of-the-way message board about how the American people don't get their act together and do something?

Speaking as one of "others," yep, pretty much. I've signed petitions to get Congress to investigate any number of events that have showcased Bush's incompetence. I've written letters to my representatives. And I suspect other "others" have, too.

When you realize that your country is being run by a wildly incompetent administration, you tend to get concerned enough to act.

I've written all my elected representatives (as well as Nancy Pelosi, who although not directly my representative since she represents San Francisco, is the House Minority Leader). What about you, Solar Wind? Are you happy with this President or have you actually done something?

This post has been edited by Rhea: 02 March 2006 - 05:56 PM