Over on the TrekBBS, the perennial rumor has resurfaced that the Tzenkethi mentioned in a few DS9 episodes were meant to be a hidden allusion to the Kzinti from Larry Niven's fiction and the animated Trek's "The Slaver Weapon" (because of the vague similarity of their names, I guess). Somebody's claiming that he remembers reading posts from people who had "insider sources" stating that this was the case, and I really don't think that's true. Since you cowrote "The Adversary," the episode where the Tzenkethi were first mentioned, I figure you're just about the most inside source there is on this. So can you put this to rest once and for all?
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DS9 question for Robert Hewitt Wolfe
Started by
Christopher
, Nov 27 2006 09:55 AM
26 replies to this topic
#1
Christopher
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Posted 27 November 2006 - 09:55 AM
"You don't use science to show that you're right, you use science to become right." -- xkcd
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#2
Kosh
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Posted 27 November 2006 - 12:10 PM
I had always assumed it was a Niven nod.
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#3
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Posted 27 November 2006 - 01:44 PM
Kosh, on Nov 27 2006, 12:10 PM, said:
I had always assumed it was a Niven nod.
Why??? I don't think "Tzenkethi" sounds very much like "Kzinti" at all. I mean, there are tons of alien names that sound more similar to each other, even within Trek (Tellarites, Talarians, Tarellians; Andorians, Antarians, Antarans; Takret, Takrit, Tak-Tak). For that matter, I don't recall anyone ever suggesting that the game Tsunkatse (from the VGR episode of the same name) was named after the Tzenkethi -- which is certainly a much closer similarity than Tzenkethi/Kzinti. So I'm just bewildered why anyone would hear "Tzenkethi" and think of the Kzinti specifically, let alone why they'd assume it was anything more than a very, very remote coincidence.
"You don't use science to show that you're right, you use science to become right." -- xkcd
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
#4
Kosh
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Criag Ferguson For President!
Posted 29 November 2006 - 03:56 PM
The sound in my head, of how to pronounce it. My bad!!
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#5
Christopher
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Posted 02 December 2006 - 08:14 AM
Bump.
"You don't use science to show that you're right, you use science to become right." -- xkcd
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
#6
Robert Hewitt Wolfe
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Posted 03 December 2006 - 01:27 AM
Errr... uh... damn. I can't freaking remember. I mean, yeah, I basically made them up. And yeah, I named them. But I can't remember if I was making a purposeful homage to Niven or not.
If I had to guess, I suspect I did my usual and combined a couple things. Probably Kzinti and Tsankth.
But when I picture them in my head, they weren't big cat people. I thought of them as more like the Hakazit.
And that's the best I can do ten years later.
If I had to guess, I suspect I did my usual and combined a couple things. Probably Kzinti and Tsankth.
But when I picture them in my head, they weren't big cat people. I thought of them as more like the Hakazit.
And that's the best I can do ten years later.
"There are monsters, there are angels...
There's a peacefulness and a rage inside us all."
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#8
Christopher
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Posted 03 December 2006 - 09:27 AM
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 3 2006, 01:27 AM, said:
But when I picture them in my head, they weren't big cat people. I thought of them as more like the Hakazit.
I had to look that up -- a species from Jack Chalker's Well World series. The page I found said that in one book they were like 3-meter-tall T. rexes with powerful arms, but in another they were giant mosquitoes. At a guess, I'd say you were thinking of the T. rexes?
"You don't use science to show that you're right, you use science to become right." -- xkcd
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
#9
Robert Hewitt Wolfe
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Posted 03 December 2006 - 03:00 PM
Christopher, on Dec 3 2006, 06:27 AM, said:
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 3 2006, 01:27 AM, said:
But when I picture them in my head, they weren't big cat people. I thought of them as more like the Hakazit.
I had to look that up -- a species from Jack Chalker's Well World series. The page I found said that in one book they were like 3-meter-tall T. rexes with powerful arms, but in another they were giant mosquitoes. At a guess, I'd say you were thinking of the T. rexes?
Uh, they became mosquitoes in the later books? Bah. Heavily armored lizard things FTW.
Wait! You had to look up Hakazit but not Tsankth? Dude!
Edited by Robert Hewitt Wolfe, 03 December 2006 - 03:02 PM.
"There are monsters, there are angels...
There's a peacefulness and a rage inside us all."
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#10
Christopher
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Posted 03 December 2006 - 05:36 PM
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 3 2006, 03:00 PM, said:
Christopher, on Dec 3 2006, 06:27 AM, said:
I had to look that up -- a species from Jack Chalker's Well World series. The page I found said that in one book they were like 3-meter-tall T. rexes with powerful arms, but in another they were giant mosquitoes. At a guess, I'd say you were thinking of the T. rexes?
Uh, they became mosquitoes in the later books? Bah. Heavily armored lizard things FTW.
That would've been cool. Too bad you didn't have the kind of CGI tech they later had on VGR and ENT.
Actually, though, my Trek novel editor Marco Palmieri is planning a Lost Era novel about Sisko's involvement in the Tzenkethi conflict. It was announced at the same time as the "Picard's missing years" novel (which I just finished writing a couple of weeks ago), but as far as I know, it's still in the development stage. I don't know what direction it'll take with the Tzenkethi, although it definitely won't be the mock-Kzinti route that some fanfiction has taken.
Quote
Wait! You had to look up Hakazit but not Tsankth? Dude!
I had to look them both up, but I didn't have anything specific to say about the Tsankth (except possibly "Gesundheit").
"You don't use science to show that you're right, you use science to become right." -- xkcd
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
#11
Rhea
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Posted 03 December 2006 - 06:09 PM
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 3 2006, 12:00 PM, said:
Christopher, on Dec 3 2006, 06:27 AM, said:
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 3 2006, 01:27 AM, said:
But when I picture them in my head, they weren't big cat people. I thought of them as more like the Hakazit.
I had to look that up -- a species from Jack Chalker's Well World series. The page I found said that in one book they were like 3-meter-tall T. rexes with powerful arms, but in another they were giant mosquitoes. At a guess, I'd say you were thinking of the T. rexes?
Uh, they became mosquitoes in the later books? Bah. Heavily armored lizard things FTW.
Wait! You had to look up Hakazit but not Tsankth? Dude!
LOL! In the days precomputer I actually took the old octagonal gaming maps, taped several together and did a giant Well World map, using all the books. I still have it somewhere, I think. I'm an info junkie anyway, but so many species were mentioned over so many books it was hard to track them all. When I reread the books I haul it out. Ok, geek moment SO over now.
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- Robert A. Heinlein
When I don’t understand, I have an unbearable itch to know why. - RAH
Everything is theoretically impossible, until it is done. One could write a history of science in reverse by assembling the solemn pronouncements of highest authority about what could not be done and could never happen. - RAH
#12
Robert Hewitt Wolfe
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Posted 03 December 2006 - 07:10 PM
Christopher, on Dec 3 2006, 02:36 PM, said:
I had to look them both up, but I didn't have anything specific to say about the Tsankth (except possibly "Gesundheit").
Ah, that's a relief. So for now, I'm still officially geekier than you. Go me!
Living Blade 0wnz3rz, but seriously, Summon Baracuda? Weak ass.
"There are monsters, there are angels...
There's a peacefulness and a rage inside us all."
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#13
Drew
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Josef K.
Posted 04 December 2006 - 12:38 PM
Is this conversation in English? 
"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."
#14
Smitty
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"If I knew what was going on I'd really be indignant.&q
Posted 04 December 2006 - 12:41 PM
Que'?
-cs™
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#15
JadziaDax
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Posted 04 December 2006 - 02:07 PM
*scratchs head*
Didn't/don't we have a board member with that name?
*blushes* Here I thought it was something like that....like with Andi
Didn't/don't we have a board member with that name?
*blushes* Here I thought it was something like that....like with Andi
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#16
Rov Judicata
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Posted 04 December 2006 - 02:07 PM
Drew, on Dec 4 2006, 11:38 AM, said:
Is this conversation in English?
GBTW n00b.
St. Louis must be destroyed!
Me: "I have a job and five credit cards and am looking into signing a two year lease. THAT MAKES ME OLD."
Josh: "I don't have a job, I have ONE credit card, I'm stuck in a lease and I'm 28! My mom's basement IS ONE BAD DECISION AWAY!"
~~ Josh, winning the argument.
"Congress . . . shall include every idiot, lunatic, insane person, and person non compos mentis[.]" ~1 U.S.C. § 1, selectively quoted for accuracy.
Me: "I have a job and five credit cards and am looking into signing a two year lease. THAT MAKES ME OLD."
Josh: "I don't have a job, I have ONE credit card, I'm stuck in a lease and I'm 28! My mom's basement IS ONE BAD DECISION AWAY!"
~~ Josh, winning the argument.
"Congress . . . shall include every idiot, lunatic, insane person, and person non compos mentis[.]" ~1 U.S.C. § 1, selectively quoted for accuracy.
#17
Drew
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Josef K.
Posted 04 December 2006 - 02:08 PM
Hmmm. You've just given me an idea . . .
"Someone must have slandered Josef K., for one morning, without having done anything wrong, he was arrested."
#18
Robert Hewitt Wolfe
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Posted 04 December 2006 - 06:51 PM
Drew, on Dec 4 2006, 09:38 AM, said:
Is this conversation in English?
133tsp33k ftw 01dth1nkr! pwewpwewpwew!
err, sorry, channeling my inner 13 year old.
"There are monsters, there are angels...
There's a peacefulness and a rage inside us all."
----------------------------------
Voice of the Beehive
#19
Christopher
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Posted 04 December 2006 - 08:17 PM
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 4 2006, 06:51 PM, said:
133tsp33k ftw 01dth1nkr! pwewpwewpwew!
err, sorry, channeling my inner 13 year old.
err, sorry, channeling my inner 13 year old.
Do us a favor -- change the channel.
"You don't use science to show that you're right, you use science to become right." -- xkcd
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
"Heroism is here, in the hearts of so many of our fellow citizens, all around us, just waiting to be summoned." -- President Barack Obama, January 12, 2011
Christopher L. Bennett Homepage -- Includes purchasing links for Only Superhuman, on sale now! Updated 5/28/13 with discussion of Rise of the Federation Book 1.
Written Worlds -- My blog
Facebook Author Page
#20
MuseZack
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Posted 04 December 2006 - 11:07 PM
Robert Hewitt Wolfe, on Dec 4 2006, 11:51 PM, said:
Drew, on Dec 4 2006, 09:38 AM, said:
Is this conversation in English?
133tsp33k ftw 01dth1nkr! pwewpwewpwew!
err, sorry, channeling my inner 13 year old.
Were in ur base killing ur d00ds!
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We shall harness for God the energies of Love.
Then, for the second time in the history of the world,
we will have discovered fire."
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